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Post by ʂωєєтცяєα∂ on Oct 11, 2017 20:54:57 GMT -5
I dont pay to win. I payed because I like the game and want to be competitive in Champion League. By the way, Owning two dash bots doesnt guarantee me wins it only helps me be a little more competitive in the upper leagues with my clan where they are everywhere. You knew War Robots sold "better" equipment with money when you started playing it, its only an issue now when its an amount you dont want to spend. If playing a game for free gives you satisfaction over spending money for your entertainment even if it makes it more enjoyable then thats your thing but hating on someone who is willing to spend is just childish. I'll happily give you more credit as you made it to TT without dashes obviously. but in your own words, "Owning two dash bots doesn't guarantee me wins it only helps me be a little more competitive in the upper leagues with my clan where they are everywhere". So in a more clearer term: If I don't have dashs, I will be an underdog vs. guys that do. If we just all agree that they are OP like 98% do and stop defending them/excuses/etc. More people would just play and not ?female dog?. I promise not to make a new thread about how OP they are or necropost one. The Ember has done a good job replacing the OP of the K-Bots anyways. But I hope you see the bigger picture that this new meta we are going down will leave the game in a much worse condition than it is now. Don't support that if you like this game (by support,I mean try to convince others that the k-bots are not OP, everything is great, just stay outside of the K-bots firing range, don't engage k-bots unless 5 other blues helping you at the same time ?poo-poo?ty advice that some people are giving) I’ll give you this. The Ember is a little ridiculous currently.
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Post by imnobody on Oct 11, 2017 21:02:50 GMT -5
We know that currently Haechi is OP with its excellent mobility and superior firepower thanks to the 3 medium slots it has. What do you think is the best step to balance it? Removing one of the slots might work? Example 1Example 2It can still corner shoot with both weapons in this example. how dare you go out insult pixsonic monetize system.
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Post by ʂωєєтცяєα∂ on Oct 11, 2017 21:07:21 GMT -5
I honestly doubt that "PDB working in team" would lay waste to "Haechi working in team". It is obvious that a coordinated team of robots can destroy several uncoordinated robots. However we need to compare equally skilled teams. And in my opinion, 2-3 Haechi team wreck any 2-3 bot on Powerplant, Shenzhen, Moon, Deadcity, Valley and most probably Springfield as well, if they stay in "city area" and proceed from there. Have you randomly spawned in a game and got stuck facing a top-100 rated clan so well organized and clearly on Discord/comms, that the game was basically over in a few minutes? I recently have and in one particular case versus Mexico, we competed against their 6-man clan that was running a mix of maxed silver/gold wep/bots, and wreaking havoc on opposing guys in their Haechi and Bulgasari bots.
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Post by GuitarGuy on Oct 11, 2017 21:55:53 GMT -5
I think the fairest way to rebalance the bot would be to lengthen the cool down time between dashes. If and when that happens which I'm sure it will once Pixonic sells enough of them. Problem is, by the time that happens there's a line of a whole set of new robots out that will be even more over powered than this batch. Removing a weapon from it to me isn't the answer. Honestly, I think the best way to "balance" the robot in the game is just make it more available and I'm on reasonable price that way everyone can enjoy it if there will willing to work for it.
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Post by WilsonK on Oct 11, 2017 21:58:20 GMT -5
i think maybe increase Haechi's bash cooldown and minimize the HP and shield? Holy 「dookie」, a new ability?! BASH?! Guys, get ready for Haechi bashing through walls over to you! I kidddddddd ~ anyhoos yeah, minimizing base HP is reasonable, but not the Ancile. It should have the same HP & Ancile as the Carnage imo... because 3 medium hardpoints? With DASH?! Damn.....
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RΛИDØM
Destrier
iOS - clan BMF
Posts: 91
Karma: 77
Pilot name: RANDOM
Platform: iOS
Clan: BMF
League: Top
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Post by RΛИDØM on Oct 11, 2017 23:20:20 GMT -5
Agree with GuitarGuy on the Haechi.
Imo removing one weapon slot is much too drastic a nerf to the Haechi. Players have paid significant sums for these robots and fundamentally changing the robot would be disrespectful of their hard earned money. Pixonic will probably eventually nerf it but the changes will be more along the lines of increasing the dash timer and/or decreasing the health pool and/or decreasing the speed.
There are more powerful weapons and robots coming out - so there will likely be more ways to counter the Haechi. The Ember, Scourge, Plasma Griff, Plasma Ancilot, Kumiho, Plasma Bulgasari and Fury/Carnage Zeus and on long maps quad treb Butch all work well against the Haechi. On brawling maps expect to see more Ember Carnages, Lances and Inquisitors melting the Haechi. I feel like Beacon Rush coming out simultaneously with the Haechi increased the perception of it being overpowered. I’m waiting to see how the other new robots and weapons impact the Meta - particularly the Ember and the Inquisitor.
For those unable or unwilling to spend money on the game the reality is that the new Meta will likely continue to be frustrating. If you like the 6v6 team combat with lots of abilities, maps, strategy, teamwork, game modes and counters but would like a completely even playing field with better graphics all for $50 or less - try Overwatch! Overwatch (made by Blizzard) has over 30 million players and much deeper gameplay than War Robots ever will. I may switch to Overwatch myself if Pixonic keeps the current pricing scheme and sales tactics.
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Post by WilsonK on Oct 11, 2017 23:43:22 GMT -5
Agree with GuitarGuy on the Haechi. Imo removing one weapon slot is much too drastic a nerf to the Haechi. Players have paid significant sums for these robots and fundamentally changing the robot would be disrespectful of their hard earned money. Pixonic will probably eventually nerf it but the changes will be more along the lines of increasing the dash timer and/or decreasing the health pool and/or decreasing the speed. There are more powerful weapons and robots coming out - so there will likely be more ways to counter the Haechi. The Ember, Scourge, Plasma Griff, Plasma Ancilot, Kumiho, Plasma Bulgasari and Fury/Carnage Zeus and on long maps quad treb Butch all work well against the Haechi. On brawling maps expect to see more Ember Carnages, Lances and Inquisitors melting the Haechi. I feel like Beacon Rush coming out simultaneously with the Haechi increased the perception of it being overpowered. I’m waiting to see how the other new robots and weapons impact the Meta - particularly the Ember and the Inquisitor. For those unable or unwilling to spend money on the game the reality is that the new Meta will likely continue to be frustrating. If you like the 6v6 team combat with lots of abilities, maps, strategy, teamwork, game modes and counters but would like a completely even playing field with better graphics all for $50 or less - try Overwatch! Overwatch (made by Blizzard) has over 30 million players and much deeper gameplay than War Robots ever will. I may switch to Overwatch myself if Pixonic keeps the current pricing scheme and sales tactics. On the hindsight, I like your post. Well written.
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Post by zeframmann on Oct 11, 2017 23:56:32 GMT -5
Losing a slot would be a major step in balancing it out. I don't see Pix doing it though.
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Post by zeframmann on Oct 12, 2017 0:18:27 GMT -5
I promise you a PDB team can evenly compete against a group of Haechi if they play it right and stay out of range. I have seen it done several times. Do voice coms and planning play are part in it? absolutely! But its harder to do that then to just nerf a bot that challenges your current skillset.. thats the whole point of my posts. Hahaha! Utter rubbish. The Griff sacrifices an obscene level of mobility to the Haechi. It's jump has a 25sec cooldown to the 5sec on the Haechi's dash, and without it it's as slow as a Leo. It has nearly as much health as the Griffen as well, without it's shield. What that translates to is that in most cases if a PDB ambushes a Haechi, the Haechi can quickly evade and take cover. If the Haechi ambushes the Griff, there's a far better chance the Griff's jump will be on cooldown and it will be destroyed. I played both against each-other on the test server, and the only time my PDB could win without suffering catastrophic damage is if I ambushed them right after a dash, or the pilot was incompetent. When I was in the dash? Griffens and Fujins were like shooting fish in a bucket. Indeed. I have 2 Haechi... Does it allow me to dominate others? I dont think so. I think we both know that's rubbish. The only people you're not going to dominate are other Haechi owners, and if you really thought PDBs could compete would wouldn't have traded them for Haechi's, hmm?
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Post by T34 on Oct 12, 2017 0:18:32 GMT -5
Tuning in late and skimmed
I had this epiphany recently while drinking my coffee and agree with some of the above.
IMO, most of us had it all wrong. The Haechi will not be rebalanced in relation the old meta. The haechi has a balanced or near balanced place in the new meta that will be dominated by the new gear. We are down the wrong path by discussing whether a slot should be removed or a dash taken away.
The old gear is a thing of the past and will never be competitive against the new always more powerful releases. Within a short period of time the new releases will replace almost all the old stuff on top and a balance will be established between them. Fury is perhaps the only exception (wonder how pix will tackle that issue – maybe a new bot).
And perhaps here comes the first realisation for those who put 5 haechies into their hanger. Pix has already caught them out and now they will have to swap out some of those haechis for something else.
All the new bots coming out will fill a gap in the RM top tier environment and will replace the older RM items. the older RM items will than be discounted to a reasonable level.
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Post by snk on Oct 12, 2017 0:32:55 GMT -5
Don’t need to blame people paying hundreds to get Heachi, they didn’t hack or cheat. It is just Pixonic too greedy, create some OP bots then charge over price on them. Pixonic make the game unbalanced, not the pilots.
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Post by carnage on Oct 12, 2017 2:46:35 GMT -5
Nice artwork there. I've voted for the first option, however the following would actually be better. 1) Lowering it's base HP 2) Converting one medium hardpoint to a light hardpoint (this is because the Kumiho already has 2 medium hardpoints) This exactly. And that way the firepower of the Haechi would have been just in between Kumiho and Bulge.
It's also a better compromise than removing a slot completely or removing the ancile.
Still... while that would make sense, that should have been done from the start. It's much harder and arguable to do that kind of change after the release of the robot.
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Post by Russel on Oct 12, 2017 2:51:12 GMT -5
I honestly doubt that "PDB working in team" would lay waste to "Haechi working in team". It is obvious that a coordinated team of robots can destroy several uncoordinated robots. However we need to compare equally skilled teams. And in my opinion, 2-3 Haechi team wreck any 2-3 bot on Powerplant, Shenzhen, Moon, Deadcity, Valley and most probably Springfield as well, if they stay in "city area" and proceed from there. Have you randomly spawned in a game and got stuck facing a top-100 rated clan so well organized and clearly on Discord/comms, that the game was basically over in a few minutes? I recently have and in one particular case versus Mexico, we competed against their 6-man clan that was running a mix of maxed silver/gold wep/bots, and wreaking havoc on opposing guys in their Haechi and Bulgasari bots. I guess you misread my post, let me paraphrase that: Solo bot < solo Haechi bot < coordinated ANY bot team < coordinated Haechi team
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Post by Russel on Oct 12, 2017 2:52:27 GMT -5
And I got brand new 「fluffernutter」ing awesome idea for nerf. Make damage done to Haechi worth x3 silver payout compared to normal bot.
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Post by zeframmann on Oct 12, 2017 2:57:26 GMT -5
Don’t need to blame people paying hundreds to get Heachi, they didn’t hack or cheat. It is just Pixonic too greedy, create some OP bots then charge over price on them. Pixonic make the game unbalanced, not the pilots. I don't blame people for buying it, but I will blame them if they disingenuously try to downplay how overpowered it is out of fear of their investment being nerfed at the expense of everyone who can't afford such nonsense. If they only care about staying competitive with others who purchased the bot, then it shouldn't matter if it is nerfed because they will still be competitive against each-other. The only reason left is that they want to keep clubbing seals. As you say, Pixonic made the robots unbalanced so it falls upon them to re-balance them.
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Post by WilsonK on Oct 12, 2017 3:23:16 GMT -5
And I got brand new ?firetruck?ing awesome idea for nerf. Make damage done to Haechi worth x3 silver payout compared to normal bot. Also a Medal of Valor 1st Class (+5 gold) per destroyed Haechi will be nice (or collecting some components from destroyed dash bots also will work ) That'll be a bad idea. People'll make use of "full squads" of full Haechis... 30 Haechis x 5 Au... 150 Au per round for a player? Silver will do fine, but not Au...
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Post by Russel on Oct 12, 2017 4:03:14 GMT -5
And I got brand new ?firetruck?ing awesome idea for nerf. Make damage done to Haechi worth x3 silver payout compared to normal bot. Also a Medal of Valor 1st Class (+5 gold) per destroyed Haechi will be nice (or collecting some components from destroyed dash bots also will work :D ) Collecting components is an awesome idea!
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Post by Russel on Oct 12, 2017 4:06:15 GMT -5
Also a Medal of Valor 1st Class (+5 gold) per destroyed Haechi will be nice (or collecting some components from destroyed dash bots also will work ) That'll be a bad idea. People'll make use of "full squads" of full Haechis... 30 Haechis x 5 Au... 150 Au per round for a player? (rofl) Silver will do fine, but not Au... Components idea would be awesome. If you want Haechi - shoot Haechi more! Every killed Haechi rewarding you with 500 components, killed Ember bot - you get 500 Ember components
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Post by WilsonK on Oct 12, 2017 4:06:41 GMT -5
That'll be a bad idea. People'll make use of "full squads" of full Haechis... 30 Haechis x 5 Au... 150 Au per round for a player? Silver will do fine, but not Au... Components idea would be awesome. If you want Haechi - shoot Haechi more! Every killed Haechi rewarding you with 500 components, killed Ember bot - you get 500 Ember components OH YEAHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!
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Post by robocain on Oct 12, 2017 5:25:22 GMT -5
Gareth, Galahad and Lancelot were ridiculously OP when they were introduced. The Hyundais won't stay as OP as they are now. They will get nerfed into place in a couple of months.
Complaining about OP-ness is a waste of time in my opinion.
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Post by zeframmann on Oct 12, 2017 7:53:31 GMT -5
That'll be a bad idea. People'll make use of "full squads" of full Haechis... 30 Haechis x 5 Au... 150 Au per round for a player? Silver will do fine, but not Au... Components idea would be awesome. If you want Haechi - shoot Haechi more! Every killed Haechi rewarding you with 500 components, killed Ember bot - you get 500 Ember components This actually has possibilities.
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Post by shivaswrath on Oct 12, 2017 7:59:36 GMT -5
it doesn't need to be rebalanced, they are easy to take apart if you time it right. Ummm, no. Ummm, no robot is invincible.
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Post by snk on Oct 12, 2017 8:16:33 GMT -5
Is Heachi the best brawlers? Of course, 3 Orkans + Ancile + Dash + decent running speed.
You may argue that Ancilelot, Fujin and Carnage has Ancile too. But Heachi is on a totally different league with all other Ancile bot, I know my Orkan will hit every Ancile bot but Heachi, they have possibilities to Dash 2 time, That already make Heachi can last 2-3 times longer than all other Ancile bot. Dash probably the best special ability to run back to cover as well.
But for someone spend so much RM, nerf the Heachi isn’t fair to the Heachi pilot. Just greedy Pixonic create such a bot to suck up player money.
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Post by seanh on Oct 12, 2017 8:45:52 GMT -5
I think they should receive a skin nerf. Make them pink with big yellow spots. No body will be afraid of them then, no self-respecting whale will want one, they will just by another inquisitor.
Problem solved?
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Post by Russel on Oct 12, 2017 9:01:19 GMT -5
Components idea would be awesome. If you want Haechi - shoot Haechi more! Every killed Haechi rewarding you with 500 components, killed Ember bot - you get 500 Ember components This actually has possibilities. No promises here, but this idea actually was passed to developers. Hoooray!
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Arkontas
Destrier
Posts: 28
Karma: 46
Platform: Android
Clan: ns dark elite
League: Champion
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Post by Arkontas on Oct 12, 2017 12:57:58 GMT -5
Ok, I am going to throw out some unpopular opinions here. The rebalance viewpoint is coming from people who dont own these bots or spent the money on them so naturally they want them nerfed in some way because they feel its overpowered to there conventional hangars. This isnt fair to the people who have spent the money or grinded for keys to win one. Its my opinion that the reason many upper middle league players feel so threatened by them is because they get mixed in with Champion league players who usually have better CQC skills and know how to work in groups. One thing I have noticed lately with Diamond, Expert and many Master level players is the amount of long and mind range in hangar, some as many as 3 or 4 range bots and maybe two brawlers. This is a big problem when you hit any smaller maps an now half and sometimes over half of your hangar is simply ineffective to capture and hold beacons or to hold of any small group of red brawlers that are paired up. I have seen many top clans simply drop 4 plasma griffins at the beginning of a BR match and totally wreck a squad of Ork Haechis. While I will not deny the power of the new K bots, they are not as overwelming if you plan the right tactics for it and quit trying to play so much mid and long range. The Haechi is no stronger than a carnage or fujin, it just has superior mobility. When on big maps its very fragile out in the open. I would be willing to bet most of you only have problems with them on small maps. And this comes right back to honing your CQC skills and having a hangar that can brawl more than it can sit back and snipe with range. I agree with this. Players in good Champion league squads already have ways to beat them and you'll encounter them every match. Magnums, Tarans, Scourge, Zeus, Ember and Trebs all kill them. Jump, Dash, hell even Charge, Anciles and sitting outside of 300m all mitigate the Orkan's damage. Add into the mix proper situational awareness, teamwork and communication and they really end up just being more mobile Griffins. The only time they really feel OP is when skillful and coordinated players use them. They overwhelm people unfamiliar with the mechanics or with poorly optimized hangars and the match gets swept up from under them. In reality, if you put those same people in Griffins and Lancelots they'd still smash- it would just be a familiar 「bum-bum」 whooping.
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Post by linearblade on Oct 12, 2017 13:09:34 GMT -5
Haechi are not broken. Orkans are broken. They kill you because only energy shield bots can survive orkans, and to a lesser extent well time jump / kumi dash.
Lancelots reigned previously not because they had physical shields, if was becsuse you could equip an ancile on them and not insta die from orkans.
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Post by linearblade on Oct 12, 2017 13:12:04 GMT -5
The haechi combos orkans particularly well with its shield , giving it an edge in orkan on orkan combats. Haechi with anything else is pitifully "above average", and that's it.
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Post by GuitarGuy on Oct 12, 2017 13:27:22 GMT -5
Ok, I am going to throw out some unpopular opinions here. The rebalance viewpoint is coming from people who dont own these bots or spent the money on them so naturally they want them nerfed in some way because they feel its overpowered to there conventional hangars. This isnt fair to the people who have spent the money or grinded for keys to win one. Its my opinion that the reason many upper middle league players feel so threatened by them is because they get mixed in with Champion league players who usually have better CQC skills and know how to work in groups. One thing I have noticed lately with Diamond, Expert and many Master level players is the amount of long and mind range in hangar, some as many as 3 or 4 range bots and maybe two brawlers. This is a big problem when you hit any smaller maps an now half and sometimes over half of your hangar is simply ineffective to capture and hold beacons or to hold of any small group of red brawlers that are paired up. I have seen many top clans simply drop 4 plasma griffins at the beginning of a BR match and totally wreck a squad of Ork Haechis. While I will not deny the power of the new K bots, they are not as overwelming if you plan the right tactics for it and quit trying to play so much mid and long range. The Haechi is no stronger than a carnage or fujin, it just has superior mobility. When on big maps its very fragile out in the open. I would be willing to bet most of you only have problems with them on small maps. And this comes right back to honing your CQC skills and having a hangar that can brawl more than it can sit back and snipe with range. I agree with this. Players in good Champion league squads already have ways to beat them and you'll encounter them every match. Magnums, Tarans, Scourge, Zeus, Ember and Trebs all kill them. Jump, Dash, hell even Charge, Anciles and sitting outside of 300m all mitigate the Orkan's damage. Add into the mix proper situational awareness, teamwork and communication and they really end up just being more mobile Griffins. The only time they really feel OP is when skillful and coordinated players use them. They overwhelm people unfamiliar with the mechanics or with poorly optimized hangars and the match gets swept up from under them. In reality, if you put those same people in Griffins and Lancelots they'd still smash- it would just be a familiar ?bum-bum? whooping. This is so true! on iOS top clans like CDxx, VICE and HEAT run all Dash hangars and they devastate people..... The exact same way they did before Dashes were even around.. It can make a OP pilot now very OP! But these guys can crush you with just about any hangar. they dont need a dash to dominate you, It just makes the inevitable end much quicker is all..
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Post by bronzeknee on Oct 12, 2017 23:06:28 GMT -5
bronzeknee , thanks for taking time to share your view and suggestions. You don’t need to worry, if Pix follows its habits, you’ll get some kinda nerf. For now you just need to adjust your piloting to take them out as best you can. I have no further opinion on the subject. As for you talkin crap about someones piloting you know nothing of, you’ve been called out by Guitar Guy son, check it: “Oh, and if your iOS and up to a custom match im totally down. I wont run a single dash bot either. I dont know you so you could be a total beast and wreck me but I am willing to take that chance.. :-) Lets see how "unskilled" I really am...” What say you? Of course I will play. I am on Android though and I don't have access to an iOS device. But if you have an Android device we can duel in Destriers or whatever. I'd love to record it and upload it. I played video games professionally for years, so I'm always down for a competition. Can we bet on it? But it isn't his piloting that I have a problem with. It is his view that the Haechi isn't overpowered. That view isn't shared by the majority (any?) of top players/streamers. So either he is wrong, or all of them are.
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