iKily
Destrier
Don´t poke me, I Die
Posts: 50
Karma: 31
Pilot name: iKyli
Platform: Android
Clan: None
League: Expert
Server Region: North America
Favorite robot: GAU Punisher Leo
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Post by iKily on Mar 6, 2017 18:24:02 GMT -5
2 Mediums Hardpoints, 2 Light Hardpoints (high damage output), jumping ability, high HP, relatively fast, can be bought by Silver...
In my honest opinion; I do believe the Griffin should either lose 1 Medium Hardpoint, or has its HP reduced; then again that´s just me, and I´m not quite fond of having to see 3 or 5 at every time in the match.
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Post by 3castle on Mar 6, 2017 18:35:00 GMT -5
griffin is a decent robot. i say, maybe its the best silver bot. performs a lot like other heavy bots, but the jump ability makes the big difference. u can jump to dodge aphids, missile weapons, run away, jump and shoot, capture beacons in the beginning of the battle. it can be played with many different setups, so im assuming these are y there are so many people using griffin.
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Post by CrownBlack on Mar 6, 2017 18:54:37 GMT -5
The fact that Griffins are everywhere is why I will not give up on my Zeus carny. For every shield bot there are three griffins to get. Don't get me wrong I have several. Cheap and easy to load out but slow and once u jump pretty easy pickings unless you have good cover but still better than Rhino.
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tagnal
Destrier
Posts: 103
Karma: 45
Pilot name: Tagnal/A Toddler
Platform: Multiple
Clan: [ℵモⓂ] / [Ħⱴⓚ]
League: Champion
Server Region: North America
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Post by tagnal on Mar 6, 2017 19:10:06 GMT -5
Griffin is more like a Jack-of-many trades. But, isn't a master at any particular one.
It has a good jump, but long cool down. Has many different viable weapon loadouts. With those weapons it can dish out a ton of damage in a short amount of time, but lacks any kind of protection. It can only hope to avoid it with jump which is on a long timer. So no matter what build, griffons are always vulnerable (any weapon will damage it). It has decent midrange builds, but still outclassed/ranged by other midrange. (Although lvl 12 hydras can be pretty damn annoying) It can do long range with molots, but still not as long as any true sniper bot.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
Karma:
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Post by Deleted on Mar 6, 2017 19:29:56 GMT -5
Griffin is more like a Jack-of-many trades. But, isn't a master at any particular one. It has a good jump, but long cool down. Has many different viable weapon loadouts. With those weapons it can dish out a ton of damage in a short amount of time, but lacks any kind of protection. It can only hope to avoid it with jump which is on a long timer. So no matter what build, griffons are always vulnerable (any weapon will damage it). It has decent midrange builds, but still outclassed/ranged by other midrange. (Although lvl 12 hydras can be pretty damn annoying) It can do long range with molots, but still not as long as any true sniper bot. You're talking about the Leo. Griffin is the master of hit and run.
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Grimsunder
Destrier
Posts: 120
Karma: 46
Pilot name: ĢŘÎM
Platform: Android
Clan: Steel Wolf
League: Diamond
Favorite robot: Griffin
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Post by Grimsunder on Mar 6, 2017 19:38:11 GMT -5
I am exactly at the top of Gold 3, a few points away from Diamond that I hope to join next month. So I face a mix of high-gold and low-diamond.
At my level, no bot come close to the impact of the Gareth or the Galahad. I'd argue the Gareth has a stronger impact on the game than a Lancelot quite frankly because of the capping ability and amazing speed. Most of the time the Lancelot comes slowly, attract fire, and die. The Gareth is much harder to deal with, he can escapes all missiles with ease, and is basically immune to plasma because of the shield.
Thing is, the Gareth have deceptive speed so a good pilot will always choose the way he engages you, and then, ALSO have extraordinary resistance (in relative ways, the shield is even superior to Galahad, 200% of base health, which means at level 9 a Gareth has over 200'000 HP). That can help him blow away all mediums (except Galahad) and most of the heavies. I know it well, I am a typical knife fighter and use both Leo/Thunder/Pinata and Natasha/Thunder/Pinata setups. Believe it or not, but when I see a Gareth or a Galahad coming at me, I know it is over for me. They don't beat me because they are smarter or anything, they beat me because they come at my face, resist my attacks (evade Pinatas with ease, or at worst they resist to them with the shield), and blow me away with the combo Taran/Magnum.
And it's no different with a Rhino. The Rhino has major downsides compared to the britbots. Firstly, using the shield basically blocks your robot. Secondly, it diminishes drastically your firepower. The britbots have none of those problems, so a good britbot pilot will simply circle around the Rhino smashing him. Sure once in a while a Rhino will beat a britbot, but at equal skills and even situation, there is not a chance a Rhino can survive that kind of encounter. Same for the Carnage for different reasons. A Gareth Taran/Magnum will smash a Carnage in a few seconds only.
This is where I find it a bit ridiculous. Let's not forget Gareth is supposed to be a LIGHT bot. It doesn't make sense how strong he is currently. It is more understandable for the Galahad, and even there, it comes down to the medium vs heavy conversation, Galahad is still a medium which is very clearly superior to most heavies. When people say don't compare the Rog to the Griffin because the Rog is a medium, shouldn't we apply this same logic to the Galahad ? That's why I clearly see both Gareth/Galahad as OP, but mainly the Gareth.
Whatever, the Gareth/Galahad is a totally different topic.
Good luck in Diamond soon. You'll hope every single time that the Fury on the other side isn't looking at you. And also, if you are using Thunder Pinata Leo / Natasha, have something to replace it. There are literally no Leos or Natashas there. It may seem like the Gareth and Galahad are the king bots in gold now. If you want to see a video of Gareth's best performance in top tier, watch Adrian's. -> Although I wouldn't call Adrian an extremely good Gareth or Galahad pilot, this is pretty much the gist of the Gareth. I'm in Diamond and still see a fair share of Leos (thunder or Ancile and aphids, pinatas, mags) and Natasha's as well altho those are mostly trident pin setups. As far as the Griff goes it's a solid platform for hit n run while doing gobs of dmg. That said it's quite easy to kill if you catch it with its jump on cool down. Very well rounded imho.
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Post by Heishiro on Mar 6, 2017 20:58:05 GMT -5
yup griffins are OP. pls nerf it remove 1 leg.
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Post by mijapi300 on Mar 7, 2017 2:43:56 GMT -5
I am exactly at the top of Gold 3, a few points away from Diamond that I hope to join next month. So I face a mix of high-gold and low-diamond.
At my level, no bot come close to the impact of the Gareth or the Galahad. I'd argue the Gareth has a stronger impact on the game than a Lancelot quite frankly because of the capping ability and amazing speed. Most of the time the Lancelot comes slowly, attract fire, and die. The Gareth is much harder to deal with, he can escapes all missiles with ease, and is basically immune to plasma because of the shield.
Thing is, the Gareth have deceptive speed so a good pilot will always choose the way he engages you, and then, ALSO have extraordinary resistance (in relative ways, the shield is even superior to Galahad, 200% of base health, which means at level 9 a Gareth has over 200'000 HP). That can help him blow away all mediums (except Galahad) and most of the heavies. I know it well, I am a typical knife fighter and use both Leo/Thunder/Pinata and Natasha/Thunder/Pinata setups. Believe it or not, but when I see a Gareth or a Galahad coming at me, I know it is over for me. They don't beat me because they are smarter or anything, they beat me because they come at my face, resist my attacks (evade Pinatas with ease, or at worst they resist to them with the shield), and blow me away with the combo Taran/Magnum.
And it's no different with a Rhino. The Rhino has major downsides compared to the britbots. Firstly, using the shield basically blocks your robot. Secondly, it diminishes drastically your firepower. The britbots have none of those problems, so a good britbot pilot will simply circle around the Rhino smashing him. Sure once in a while a Rhino will beat a britbot, but at equal skills and even situation, there is not a chance a Rhino can survive that kind of encounter. Same for the Carnage for different reasons. A Gareth Taran/Magnum will smash a Carnage in a few seconds only.
This is where I find it a bit ridiculous. Let's not forget Gareth is supposed to be a LIGHT bot. It doesn't make sense how strong he is currently. It is more understandable for the Galahad, and even there, it comes down to the medium vs heavy conversation, Galahad is still a medium which is very clearly superior to most heavies. When people say don't compare the Rog to the Griffin because the Rog is a medium, shouldn't we apply this same logic to the Galahad ? That's why I clearly see both Gareth/Galahad as OP, but mainly the Gareth.
Whatever, the Gareth/Galahad is a totally different topic.
Good luck in Diamond soon. You'll hope every single time that the Fury on the other side isn't looking at you. And also, if you are using Thunder Pinata Leo / Natasha, have something to replace it. There are literally no Leos or Natashas there. It may seem like the Gareth and Galahad are the king bots in gold now. If you want to see a video of Gareth's best performance in top tier, watch Adrian's. -> Although I wouldn't call Adrian an extremely good Gareth or Galahad pilot, this is pretty much the gist of the Gareth. Not sure how a few seconds of what was probably some of his worst Gareth play is the gist of the Gareth. That was careless piloting that put himself in a position no bot would've survived. The Gareth isn't overpowered by any means, but that certainly isn't the gist of it. Watching Ace Thunder would be getting the gist of the bot.
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Post by carnage on Mar 7, 2017 4:15:26 GMT -5
If we come back to the Griffin, I am sceptical when I see some answers here. People say it is not OP, then say "it is great for this, for this, for this, for this, has great health, jump, firepower, etc.". When I read this my first reaction is... well you exactly describe an OP robot.
Now to be fair I don't really think it is OP. Or maybe just a bit. But if it is everywhere like it is the case now, you HAVE to consider the question. When a robot is by far the most frequent robot you will find, it has to raise some questions. Either it is OP, or it is way to cheap relative to what it offers.
I guess it's fair to say the Griffin should have been a gold robot...
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Post by ShutUpAndSmokeMyWeed on Mar 7, 2017 4:20:37 GMT -5
Griff is admittedly very strong for a silver bot and I would even consider paying 5000 gold for it. But I think Pix has some interest in keeping a non-premium competitive bot for the sake of proving it's not a pay-to-win.
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Post by wildboar on Mar 7, 2017 4:38:53 GMT -5
If we come back to the Griffin, I am sceptical when I see some answers here. People say it is not OP, then say "it is great for this, for this, for this, for this, has great health, jump, firepower, etc.". When I read this my first reaction is... well you exactly describe an OP robot. Those reasons describe why it's popular as an Ag bot ... you can afford to buy it "on your way up" ... it is outclassed in many respects when you start comparing it to premium bots
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Thunder Carnage
GI. Patton
Out of the shadows, a horror emerged...
Posts: 140
Karma: 61
Pilot name: Pilot Hunter 203
Platform: iOS
Clan: Wut?
League: Gold
Server Region: Asia
Favorite robot: Thunder Carnage
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Post by Thunder Carnage on Mar 7, 2017 4:56:10 GMT -5
If we come back to the Griffin, I am sceptical when I see some answers here. People say it is not OP, then say "it is great for this, for this, for this, for this, has great health, jump, firepower, etc.". When I read this my first reaction is... well you exactly describe an OP robot. Those reasons describe why it's popular as an Ag bot ... you can afford to buy it "on your way up" ... it is outclassed in many respects when you start comparing it to premium bots Not exactly...PDB griffin can kill a full health ancilot in places with jumpable cover. Just jump onto a high enough building and start giving the poor guy a plasma concussion. You'll get the first shot off, and due to his heavy slot being occupied by the now useless ancile, he will not be able to bring enough firepower before 1) you cripple/destroy him or 2) your teammates see that the ancilot is vulnerable and finish him off for you. Now try doing that in one of those premium bots you praise so much
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Post by SuperHero on Mar 7, 2017 5:26:26 GMT -5
The Griffin is OP? The op hasn't encountered many maxed Ancilots has he? Griffins deal good dmg, but as many have said, are squishy. They do NOT have good health. I think they have the lowest health of all heavy bots?? (Someone correct me if I'm wrong) The game generally has a decent balance: Pay more, get better stuff, while having some variety. Griffins are about offence. The shieldbots are about survivability. There is no right or wrong, just preference. And as is it in human nature, we are scrooges and pick the cheaper options unless we can afford the expensive one. Don't forget that Griffins can be bought early and you thus save a lot of silver not having to upgrade a Rhino or a Lancelot from scratch. And the Rog needs a buff. It used to be perfect but got badly nerfed. The recent buff does nothing to compensate for the previous nerf. The Griffin is not OP. but the Rog definitely is underpowered. Finally I would disagree with my buddy ShutUpAndSmokeMyWeed. I would never pay 5000gold for it. 2500 maybe.
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Post by snk on Mar 7, 2017 5:48:46 GMT -5
Griff jump too high, make you take a lot of shot before landing.
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Post by CΛΜΡΞΓ™ on Mar 7, 2017 5:49:21 GMT -5
I'll add that the Griffin is super easy to pilot. ha....haha... no.
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Post by cakeordeath on Mar 7, 2017 5:52:47 GMT -5
2 Mediums Hardpoints, 2 Light Hardpoints (high damage output), jumping ability, high HP, relatively fast, can be bought by Silver... In my honest opinion; I do believe the Griffin should either lose 1 Medium Hardpoint, or has its HP reduced; then again that´s just me, and I´m not quite fond of having to see 3 or 5 at every time in the match. Mostly, you're really just describing that the Griffin is a heavy bot. The griffin's weapon load is unremarkable in strength for a heavy bot (same as rhino, comparable to a leo, inferior to the lancelot, natasha and fury). It is quite versatile, yes, but identical to the rhino. The griffin's hp are low for a heavy bot (only the butch has fewer; same as a Natasha or fury). It has no shields. The griffin is relatively fast... for a heavy bot. It's outclassed in speed by every medium and light. Honestly, if it wasn't for its jumping ability the Griffin would have trouble competing with the other heavies. Removing a medium slot from the Griffin would drop it's weapons down into the lower end of medium bot territory, leaving it an inferior choice to the under-powered rogatka and frankly making it utterly useless.
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Post by CΛΜΡΞΓ™ on Mar 7, 2017 5:55:58 GMT -5
Onto a more serious note, i'm surprised people are only saying 'it is the best silver bot in the game'. The griffin would still be used in top tier play even in a case where infinite resources can be used to build a hangar. I'm not saying that they are OP as such, however they are definitely up there in the top in terms of best bots in the game.
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Post by carnage on Mar 7, 2017 5:59:18 GMT -5
Finally I would disagree with my buddy ShutUpAndSmokeMyWeed . I would never pay 5000gold for it. 2500 maybe. It's true if a Galahad is worth 2'500, I don't think the Griffin would be worth more.
Since britbots are underpriced (or overpowered, depending the way you look at it), it is hard to compare with britbots though. I mean, look at direct comparison... Guepard vs Gareth or Rogatka vs Galahad. In both cases the classes and the prices are similar, but in both cases the britbots are massively surpassing their counterpart. They even surpass robots from higher classes as well.
Still, a price of 2'500 could definitely have made sense for the Griffin.
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Post by K A Z on Mar 7, 2017 6:21:01 GMT -5
When you say it....hell yeah, that's true - 3 of them even sneaked into my hangar!
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Post by Paps on Mar 7, 2017 6:23:57 GMT -5
Great. Now I need to buy a couple more stock Griffins to keep around. Y'know... in case this gets out of hand and Griffins magically turn into Au purchases or something.
Edit: This is why we can't have nice things, folks.
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Post by K A Z on Mar 7, 2017 6:27:40 GMT -5
Great. Now I need to buy a couple more stock Griffins to keep around. Y'know... in case this gets out of hand and Griffins magically turn into Au purchases or something. Edit: This is why we can't have nice things, folks. Exactly my thought...I would stock most Ag purchases like that...just in case they get buffed good enough.
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Post by Heishiro on Mar 7, 2017 6:43:23 GMT -5
When you say it....hell yeah, that's true - 3 of them even sneaked into my hangar! aahhmmm... KAZ... 5 sneaker here.. they are not OP btw..
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Post by wildboar on Mar 7, 2017 6:51:30 GMT -5
When you say it....hell yeah, that's true - 3 of them even sneaked into my hangar! aahhmmm... KAZ... 5 sneaker here.. they are not OP btw.. There is something a little OCD about that line up just jealous
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Post by zeus on Mar 7, 2017 6:51:41 GMT -5
Griffin seems fine as it is, I feel that it's likely the most balanced bot. It deals good damage, and it dies just as easily. The griffin doesn't have exceptional speed or health. What it has is its 20 second jump that made it so good to use and versatility in its ranged weaponry, from orkans to plasma to tulus to molots. It doesn't have shields or 200k health, its weapons drop off fast. A bad jump means a dead griffin. A shot from ranged or mid range weaponry tend to put it at close to half health. It is susceptible to every weapon type out there, with the exception of zenits and noricoms.
It's silly to change everything that works out well into gold bots or weapons. The silver bots and items will be left with scraps. Silver weapons are already useless for the most part. New players would be stuck with Natasha or Leos for their entry into heavy bots, both gold and wsp do take a while to accumulate.
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Post by ewing411 on Mar 7, 2017 6:58:47 GMT -5
NERF EVERYTHING! Make it walking nerf shooter. No one will get feelings hurt, MM won't matter. MoD and MoC will be replaced with MoP, Medal of Participation. The irony is a Medal of Participation would better reflect the current battlefield rewards. Ba-da-ching!
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Post by RightOn on Mar 7, 2017 7:06:21 GMT -5
Because it has the firepower of a Rhino combined with Jump...
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Post by K A Z on Mar 7, 2017 7:08:40 GMT -5
When you say it....hell yeah, that's true - 3 of them even sneaked into my hangar! aahhmmm... KAZ... 5 sneaker here.. they are not OP btw.. Well, well... I'm not sure how you managed it, but I see 6 Griffs in your post edit: explanatory note:
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Post by ewing411 on Mar 7, 2017 7:15:55 GMT -5
God bless Pixonic for doing things opposite of CCP. In Dust 514 weapons that were "overused" got nerfs to bring them in line with everything else, except for the main line rifle. Pixonic at least looks at bots and weapons to see if they fit the intended purpose. The last pass they did on silver heavies was sorely needed because if they hadn't this really would have turned pay-to-win with gold and workshop bots being used exclusively in higher leagues.
Aside I do think the Griffin over performs a little bit. But not enough to warrant a nerf. My preference is the Dev's get a good idea of the pecking order and then subtly buff or tweak weaker bots who are under performing just like how silver heavies were x months ago. Then re-evaluate and do it again.
Nerfing is the nuclear option. You only pull it when something is clearly breaking the game.
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Post by SATmaster728 on Mar 7, 2017 7:45:46 GMT -5
Because it has the firepower of a Rhino combined with Jump... and it can actually move decently.
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Post by SuperHero on Mar 7, 2017 8:27:43 GMT -5
Finally I would disagree with my buddy ShutUpAndSmokeMyWeed . I would never pay 5000gold for it. 2500 maybe. It's true if a Galahad is worth 2'500, I don't think the Griffin would be worth more.
Since britbots are underpriced (or overpowered, depending the way you look at it), it is hard to compare with britbots though. I mean, look at direct comparison... Guepard vs Gareth or Rogatka vs Galahad. In both cases the classes and the prices are similar, but in both cases the britbots are massively surpassing their counterpart. They even surpass robots from higher classes as well.
Still, a price of 2'500 could definitely have made sense for the Griffin.
Don't forget, it is only now that the MM allows such a mix. I have been playing this game too long so I am now not sure what level is required before you can purchase shieldbots. But they previously had a MM penalty on them so they could not be used in lower tiers effectively, thus allowing the Gepard and the Rog to shine. Even now, I believe that the Gepard still is a better choice for beginners. The Galahad at low levels is slow and vulnerable to hit and run piñata or CRV attacks. But I'm a little out dated on lower tier stuff. And with the league system, we are all playing catch up on how the league and MM co-exists
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