|
|
Post by Muhlakai on Nov 19, 2016 23:54:27 GMT -5
Here's my hangar. Win rate is consistently in the high 80s now and tops 90% frequently. The biggest challenge I have on the field is when the whole other team is running artillery and makes it hard to advance with my knife fighters because, obviously, they're a bit slow. I just unlocked my 5th slot and rarely use more than three or four anyhow, so I was thinking about adding something mid-range. (Forgive the uneven levels. I've been changing things up a bunch and just haven't finished all the leveling.) - I'm not excited about adding any heavies until I reach 4/9 or later with the mediums because the MM already penalizes me for my win %. - Geps aren't an answer here. My goal is Top play and Geps wouldn't be cost-effective in the mean time. (I've shown the math here in the past.) This is especially true since my win% is already so high. *My idea* that I'm looking for feedback on was to swap the Thunder/Taran Boa for a Trident/Tulu Boa. (I would just try it, but I don't have either weapon yet and figured I might as well ask advice.) I don't need to dominate the field, just make it incredibly inconvenient for campers to remain camping. Thoughts? Alternatives? The only other thing I've thought of was to wait until an RDB just fits, but that 5th slot is tempting to play with.  |
|
|
|
Post by CΛΜΡΞΓ™ on Nov 20, 2016 0:27:02 GMT -5
My recommendation to you:
- remove an Orkan/Thunder Boa
- add in a CRV Patton
You could also remove the thunder/taran boa, but that is the best silver bot in silver tier imo. I wouldn't recommend removing the pattons since they have firepower comparable to mag geps at 350m.
|
|
|
|
Post by Strayed on Nov 20, 2016 0:59:00 GMT -5
Midrange doesn't really come unto its own until high silver and above where shield bots come into play. Still, I would recommend upgrading an rdb griff in the background.
In my opinion, the boa is the best silver bot in silver tier. Thunder taran would be best due to lack of shield bots. Still, one or two thunder orkans doesn't hurt as you can ambush mag geps without sustaining too much damage.
|
|
|
|
Post by CΛΜΡΞΓ™ on Nov 20, 2016 1:41:31 GMT -5
Midrange doesn't really come unto its own until high silver and above where shield bots come into play. Still, I would recommend upgrading an rdb griff in the background. In my opinion, the boa is the best silver bot in silver tier. Thunder taran would be best due to lack of shield bots. Still, one or two thunder orkans doesn't hurt as you can ambush mag geps without sustaining too much damage. I'm going to try this whole 'ambushing mag geps with missiles' tonight strayed... who knows, it might work out. Actually I have noticed that gep pilots who have never played in gold before have no idea that they can backpedal missiles. They also unload all of their pinatas at you when you are back-pedalling... |
|
Scorpio Snow
Destrier
Posts: 108
Karma: 47
Pilot name: [2wik] Scorpio Snow
Platform: iOS
Clan: Wiklings [2wik]
League: Silver
Favorite robot: Any bots counter Gepard at Silver
|
Post by Scorpio Snow on Nov 20, 2016 1:46:25 GMT -5
I think your best bet to not go higher with a mid range bot currently would be a golem. Trident, Tulu, Pin.
They give you the highest damage for mid range medium bots and you can corner shoot with Trident Pin on one side (roughly same cycle) and Tulu on the other side.
|
|
|
|
Post by CΛΜΡΞΓ™ on Nov 20, 2016 1:50:20 GMT -5
I think your best bet to not go higher with a mid range bot currently would be a golem. Trident, Tulu, Pin. They give you the highest damage for mid range medium bots and you can corner shoot with Trident Pin on one side (roughly same cycle) and Tulu on the other side. The reason I don't recommend using the trident/pin/Tulumbas is because of the awkward fire times, and fire rates. I find I am much more accurate with the CRV Patton. And if you are fighting other midrangers, cornershooting wont work because most midrange weapons have splash. |
|
yhondeh
Destrier
Posts: 122
Karma: 94
|
Post by yhondeh on Nov 20, 2016 1:57:53 GMT -5
My hanger for my iOS char is somewhat similar to OP. I seem to do ok, but usually, my CRV Pin Patton is the last one I use. I may simply replace it with Pinata Patton.  |
|
|
|
Post by Muhlakai on Nov 20, 2016 6:55:27 GMT -5
MM is hitting me hard enough that I see shieldbots (plural) about every other game. Until I had my fifth slot I wasn't even fielding a Thunder Taran Boa. As it is, it might have been a third Orkan instead of Taran but I don't own a third Orkan yet. I can attest that the Orkans perform as advertised on shields and Geps. I make about as many kills with the Orkans as with my Thunder.
RDB Griffin makes sense, though there's really no "background" for me for the next 20 million Ag or so just to get my weapons up to 8 (let alone 9!). It's worth filing away, though.
Trident/Tulu/Pin is an interesting thought, but as mentioned, corner shooting isn't a big concern, so wouldn't the armor on the Boa be preferable to the slight damage bump from the Pin?
These are good ideas. I need to keep thinking. Any other feedback?
|
|
|
|
Post by sochilli (Saltesers) on Nov 20, 2016 7:04:54 GMT -5
MM is hitting me hard enough that I see shieldbots (plural) about every other game. Until I had my fifth slot I wasn't even fielding a Thunder Taran Boa. As it is, it might have been a third Orkan instead of Taran but I don't own a third Orkan yet. I can attest that the Orkans perform as advertised on shields and Geps. I make about as many kills with the Orkans as with my Thunder. RDB Griffin makes sense, though there's really no "background" for me for the next 20 million Ag or so just to get my weapons up to 8 (let alone 9!). It's worth filing away, though. Trident/Tulu/Pin is an interesting thought, but as mentioned, corner shooting isn't a big concern, so wouldn't the armor on the Boa be preferable to the slight damage bump from the Pin? These are good ideas. I need to keep thinking. Any other feedback? The pin is actually pretty significant, you want the golem to get as much bang from your, well, bang. |
|
|
|
Post by CΛΜΡΞΓ™ on Nov 20, 2016 7:42:48 GMT -5
I wouldn't recommend using the boa as a midrange platform, you don't need the extra hp. Patton suits the role perfect, as though it has slightly less firepower than the golem, the reload times match and it is easier to achieve maximum DPM, both because of the equal fire rate and reload times.
|
|
|
|
Post by SGT D00M! on Nov 20, 2016 7:51:55 GMT -5
I'm going to second the consensus that the Boa makes a poor mid-range bot. I had luck with the Vityaz, (I prefered the better matched reload times to the Golem) though you can't take it with you much higher. Still gives you a chance to upgrade that trident, that can be useful again later. That said, the Golem TTC is popular for a reason and I would not be quick to discount it.
|
|
|
|
Post by Zhøu™ on Nov 21, 2016 1:56:50 GMT -5
Forget about Mid range Boa. Too little firepower. Boa is a brawler bot through and through. If you want a mid range bot in silver, go for CRV Pattons, or Tulu Trident CRV Golem.
|
|
|
|
Post by SoCalGrndR on Nov 21, 2016 2:20:03 GMT -5
Muhlakai,
I made the transition to heavys when had my weapons levels to 7. I am running heavys & Galahad all at lvl 6. Weapons are slowly moving to 8. Had to buy some addtional weapons to complete hanger set up.
When I was running my lvl 4 med hanger, I was running a steady low 80's when I added my 5th slot.
I have really enjoyed the change in the game running a heavy hanger! Win rate now low-70's, and big differnce in play running 3x Griffins!! I still have med & light hangers, but the switch to heavys was like a new expansion to the game!
I agree that Boa is not a mid-support Bot. The Boa is a tough SOB, let it Brawl. Love to run through (albeit slooowly) over my kill when after detroying it with Thunder/Taran or Orkan.
|
|
|
|
Post by Muhlakai on Nov 21, 2016 6:58:01 GMT -5
Help me understand: the universal belief seems to be that the Boa's armor should cause it to be relegated to knife fighting only. My thought was that it would allow the Boa to advance fearlessly without regard to taking a few hits as it moves into position, particularly against Gekkos and Molots. Forget whether the armor is heavy or not. Are the Trident and Tulus going to be enough to punch holes in those tin foil Natashas? I'm asking because I don't know if my paradigm is wrong or if everyone just seems to have a bias against the idea.
|
|
|
|
Post by CΛΜΡΞΓ™ on Nov 21, 2016 7:17:16 GMT -5
Help me understand: the universal belief seems to be that the Boa's armor should cause it to be relegated to knife fighting only. My thought was that it would allow the Boa to advance fearlessly without regard to taking a few hits as it moves into position, particularly against Gekkos and Molots. Forget whether the armor is heavy or not. Are the Trident and Tulus going to be enough to punch holes in those tin foil Natashas? I'm asking because I don't know if my paradigm is wrong or if everyone just seems to have a bias against the idea. Try it for yourself if you don't believe us  |
|
|
|
Post by SGT D00M! on Nov 21, 2016 7:29:13 GMT -5
There is also the disconnect in reload times. For me the hardpoints on the Boa have more to do with why it's a poor mid-range choice then it's high hp.
|
|
funyun
Destrier
Posts: 40
Karma: 8
|
Post by funyun on Nov 21, 2016 10:51:15 GMT -5
Help me understand: the universal belief seems to be that the Boa's armor should cause it to be relegated to knife fighting only. My thought was that it would allow the Boa to advance fearlessly without regard to taking a few hits as it moves into position, particularly against Gekkos and Molots. Forget whether the armor is heavy or not. Are the Trident and Tulus going to be enough to punch holes in those tin foil Natashas? I'm asking because I don't know if my paradigm is wrong or if everyone just seems to have a bias against the idea. Ranged weapons have a lower DPS, so you either need more weapons, or more time, to make up for the difference. Using a BOA and advancing defeats the two things you need to effectively use ranged weapons. You should be maintaining a 4-500m standoff and using cover. Also, do your 80-90% wins generate 10 gold every win? Cause I find it hard to believe you are getting the beacon bonus with those bots. |
|
|
|
Post by Muhlakai on Nov 21, 2016 11:02:55 GMT -5
Also, do your 80-90% wins generate 10 gold every win? Cause I find it hard to believe you are getting the beacon bonus with those bots. Nope. Squadding reduces my rewards, obviously, but when soloing I reliably hit at least 5 Au almost every single time and hit 8-10 every couple of games. It works out well since I need a lot more Ag than Au right now anyhow. Steady gold and lots of silver. |
|
|
|
Post by sochilli (Saltesers) on Nov 22, 2016 8:13:43 GMT -5
Help me understand: the universal belief seems to be that the Boa's armor should cause it to be relegated to knife fighting only. My thought was that it would allow the Boa to advance fearlessly without regard to taking a few hits as it moves into position, particularly against Gekkos and Molots. Forget whether the armor is heavy or not. Are the Trident and Tulus going to be enough to punch holes in those tin foil Natashas? I'm asking because I don't know if my paradigm is wrong or if everyone just seems to have a bias against the idea. Try it for yourself if you don't believe us When you try it: you're doing it right if: - you hover around 520m away - you keep peppering with Her Royal Stabby-wabby Trident - you dive into 499m for the pin and tulu and you see - unreturned fire - significant impacts on medium and light bots (half the bot's HP taken down) you're doing it wrong if: - you're well within 400m, especially inside knife range - you took the melee in the name trident too seriously - "yeah dude you can't contain splash weapons at point blank" and you see - shot-for-shot fire - dominance by opposing knife fighters on you - "yeah I totally meant to hit that guy 400m behind my target" - ^aka your aim is worse than a stormtrooper |
|
|
|
Post by ⓣⓡⓘⓒⓚⓨ48 on Nov 22, 2016 15:19:17 GMT -5
I second the golum option... It just works for me... the reload times don't matter to me. I actually do pretty well with the mismatch as it allows for two distinct attacks when most folks are expecting only one.
The Pins do enough extra damage to be worth it in my mind.
However, nothing wrong with the Vitz Tri/CRV/CRV. Since you are staying at level 4 for now, it doesn't matter too much that you won't be using it later. Upgrading to level 4 isn't that bad a loss of Ag. IMO. And it does make it easier to keep track of the reload times if that bothers you.
Tridents are definitely my midrange choice at 6/8 heavy tier. 2 level 8s on a level 6 Carnage is pretty dang effective against bots of the same level as you. So, if not for the need of midrange, then for the need of getting a trident up to par for when you make the jump, as well as practice at using them. There is a distinct delay when shooting them and keeping them on target during the slow triple fire salvo that it does takes a bit of getting used to.
|
|
|
|
Post by moody on Nov 22, 2016 15:54:18 GMT -5
Help me understand: the universal belief seems to be that the Boa's armor should cause it to be relegated to knife fighting only. My thought was that it would allow the Boa to advance fearlessly without regard to taking a few hits as it moves into position, particularly against Gekkos and Molots. Forget whether the armor is heavy or not. Are the Trident and Tulus going to be enough to punch holes in those tin foil Natashas? I'm asking because I don't know if my paradigm is wrong or if everyone just seems to have a bias against the idea. Ranged weapons have a lower DPS, so you either need more weapons, or more time, to make up for the difference. Using a BOA and advancing defeats the two things you need to effectively use ranged weapons. You should be maintaining a 4-500m standoff and using cover. Also, do your 80-90% wins generate 10 gold every win? Cause I find it hard to believe you are getting the beacon bonus with those bots. I often play very close to the same tier that the OP is in with very similar setup bots - medium 3/7-8. I use 3 boas, a plasma patton and a Trident/crv vityez. Using this lineup I usually get 80%-90% wins and top damage (two tarens take care of that). I often also get the beacon bonus. If I wanted to I would probably be able to get the beacon bonus more frequently, possibly at the expense of the damage bonus. This level is not full of people that really know what they are doing. I will say, I am not good with mid-range. I have a tendency to get in too close and also have a tendency to use it after I have gone through all 4 knife fighters. There are rarely situations that the mid-ranger does as well as a knife fighter would the way I use it. |
|
[AurN] perfectlyGoodInk
Aurora Clan Moderator
Posts: 729
Karma: 556
Platform: Android
Clan: leader of Aurora Nova [AurN]
League: Gold
Server Region: North America
Favorite robot: Bishop from Aliens, although WALL-E is a close second
|
Post by [AurN] perfectlyGoodInk on Nov 22, 2016 15:55:10 GMT -5
I second quad Patton CRV Pin. Midrange is a bit away from the thick of things, so it's worth it to trade some hit points for more fire power.
In my humble opinion, anyway. You have a much higher win rate than me. RDB Griffin seems like another viable option, but I haven't tried it myself yet.
|
|
|
|
Post by moody on Nov 22, 2016 16:01:53 GMT -5
I second quad Patton CRV Pin. Midrange is a bit away from the thick of things, so it's worth it to trade some hit points for more fire power. In my humble opinion, anyway. You have a much higher win rate than me. RDB Griffin seems like another viable option, but I haven't tried it myself yet. I will say that higher tiers work very differently. I don't work well with a midrange at this tier, but a 6/8 RDB griffin can be magic. Well worth getting and leveling 4 CRV Pins on a patton as you can get two RDB (griffins) using them at a later date. Given the longer reload time I am forced to work better with CRV's than I do with a trident. Edit, That's not true..... yet I do tend to stay behind cover slightly more with CRV's?? Take my experience with a pinch of salt. I have barely scratched the bottom of Gold and don't know how worthwhile it really is further up. |
|
|
|
Post by Ron Gaul on Nov 22, 2016 16:13:12 GMT -5
I'm honestly not very sold on Golem since the speed nerf. As a knifer it's so-so, but honestly, a Trident/Pin Vityaz has almost the same DPM as a Trident/Tulu/Pin Golem. Reason? The CRV Pin cycles almost twice as fast as the Tulu. Speed difference is negligible, and Vitz's extra toughness will help against knickers who manage to close range.
But, I also prefer CRV Patton to either, as weapons are always perfectly synced up and the Trident's range advantage doesn't make such a difference in Silver tier.
|
|
|
|
Post by ⓣⓡⓘⓒⓚⓨ48 on Nov 22, 2016 16:16:57 GMT -5
Midrange Tridents have saved many of my matches. When there is just no way to galvanize the Blue team to take the center, a few minutes of trident blasts will usually either clear away or soften up, greatly, the beacon that is so contested. At your level, you may even do well with Zeus if you have them, since there are less, overall, shield bots in that tier.
BUT, regardless of whether you go with Patton Pins, Vitz, Boa, or Golum... Midrange can, absolutely, be a factor in winning a match. Do you absolutely need it? No, most games have at least 1 person holding down that role. And, frankly, if your team isn't able to take advantage of it, whether from lack of initiative, ability, or the right kind of bots, you won't be able to make up for that lack with your bot alone. However... if it is close, and there is a good tug of war on that center beacon that is deciding the match, a midrange bot can make a huge difference.
Learn it now, while it matters less, upgrading your Trident (or future RDB weapons, whichever path you choose) along the way, and you will be sitting pretty at the 6/8 Heavy introductory to low gold tier. (I know that is considered High silver to some... but as I have stated in previous posts, the MM will give you plenty of both tier examples.)
YMMV
|
|
|
|
Post by Heishiro on Nov 22, 2016 20:41:05 GMT -5
if you are doing OK on what you have right now then no need for you to add a midrange bot. as you said your win % is around 80-90% which is really good. invest on weapons and bots that you will carry up to the top, consider the amount of time and silver you will use, once you reach 4/8 stop there and start upgrading some griffins in the background. the amount of silver you will need to reach those weapons to Level 9-10 is unimaginable  so do not waste you silvers for upgrading weapons that you will only use for 1-2 months. |
|
Neg0Pander
Site Designer!
Grab 'em by the Griffin
Posts: 329
Karma: 221
Pilot name: Neg0Pander
Platform: Android
Clan: WIKITTENS [WiKi]
League: Silver
|
Post by Neg0Pander on Nov 24, 2016 9:09:05 GMT -5
I second the vote for mid-range Golem. I've had games on Shenzhen and Canyon where I took top damage without having to change out of it.
I've tried every mid-range medium and for me, Golum's superior bursts win it. The trident/crv is good, too, but I really prefer having the big burst of the tulu on the initial fire and to take out weak bots. I think the mismatched reloads actually work in your favor.
|
|
![[AurN] perfectlyGoodInk Avatar](http://storage.proboards.com/6607038/avatar/40AmBXNiR1xsOVmOvxBp.jpg)
