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Post by endyu on Jul 11, 2019 11:50:10 GMT -5
Ares gets a 25% speed nerf while its ability is in use.
Nemesis and Hades get a 15% speed nerf but bumps in their HP.
I don't like these nerfs for the Nemesis as it's already a fairly weak bot.
I think if anything, the Ares should be 25%, Hades 15%, and no speed nerf to the Nemesis.
I'm also not a fan of these nerfs in general. They do not solve the Ares-train problem.
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Post by Rollo Tomasi on Jul 11, 2019 11:57:42 GMT -5
This will help some, but I agree not nearly enough of a nerf. Many a (weakened) ares train has escaped my full SuckerPunch wrath only because the 3rd guy could backpeddle to safety. Strider w AC and Last Stand stands ready to test the nerf...if it ever hits live server!
But really, the purple panty bubble needs to be much smaller (personal shield only perhaps) the ability should be 2s shorter and cooldown should be 2s longer.
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Post by 𝖉𝖊𝖆𝖉𝖒𝖆𝖗𝖘𝖍 on Jul 11, 2019 12:01:35 GMT -5
We should jump on the test server and do a 6 man Ares train to see if the nerf helps!
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Post by Loganspawn on Jul 11, 2019 12:02:37 GMT -5
I feel they should just nerf the speed all the time myself. Why is a super uber god shield bot faster than a blitz and as fast as a hellburner and many other smaller weaker bots. LAME
I also think the shield duration should be shortened and the cool down lengthened.
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Post by Loganspawn on Jul 11, 2019 12:03:18 GMT -5
We should jump on the test server and do a 6 man Ares train to see if the nerf helps! LOL it will just move slower |
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Post by ⓣⓡⓘⓒⓚⓨ48 on Jul 11, 2019 12:05:43 GMT -5
What do they do... sit around and look for ways to piss people off? This is NOT the answers folk are wanting to the question of "will Pix ever balance these bots?"
*Hades is already too slow. Frankly, other than when it's in a train, it's pretty balanced. Lower HP is part of WHY it's as balanced as a God bot can be in their current iterations. If you get at a Hades, it dies.
*I don't run the Nem but I would think it should have had the Ares' speed since it's shield is so quick... tbh. It would fit the rocket dynamic better... slowing it down is not the best move.
*However, Ares DID need a speed nerf IMO. IDK about 25% but I am not sad about that... the counter play for getting into its shield is limited if it can back up at 60Kmh, many bots can't keep up.
The perfect scenario, for me, is to make the Retribution only affect the bot and not be a bubble (which would keep the other two bots balanced but relevant, as well), and to go ahead and slow the Ares down. That's it. Sure there are other things that could and maybe should have been done, but after all of the folks that have sunk time and resources into it have gotten over the initial push back against the nerf, those two things wouldn't be a bot breaker in my mind.
Ah well...
Thanks for posting OP.
IMO, YMMV
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Post by Desc440 on Jul 11, 2019 12:05:49 GMT -5
This is such a ridiculous non-nerf. Like that's really going to fix the damn cancer bot.
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Post by 𝖉𝖊𝖆𝖉𝖒𝖆𝖗𝖘𝖍 on Jul 11, 2019 12:09:14 GMT -5
We should jump on the test server and do a 6 man Ares train to see if the nerf helps! LOL it will just move slower Lol yup...that's all it will do for the 3 man as well. It would be funny to watch the synchronized skill of a 6 man Ares train. |
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Post by Poopface on Jul 11, 2019 12:11:22 GMT -5
*Hades is already too slow. Frankly, other than when it's in a train, it's pretty balanced. Lower HP is part of WHY it's as balanced as a God bot can be in their current iterations. If you get at a Hades, it dies. Hades is beyond underwhelming. I have one and it sucks. I've faced a number of them and hey suck vs my underleveled hanger. It has a lot of issues.
As soon as I can get something viable, I'm pulling it out of my active list. |
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Post by endyu on Jul 11, 2019 12:13:03 GMT -5
I think I see where Pixonic is coming from with this nerf. It's to make it easier for fast bots like the Pursuer, Strider, Blitz, Hellburner, etc to get inside the Ares bubble and kill it.
Pixonic is trying a rock > paper > scissors type of balance:
Ares > Ao Jun
Ao Jun > Tanks
Fast bots > Ares
Tanks > Fast bots
This can work, but they need to fix the bug where retribution does full damage to resistance bots (tanks) when charged up. The Ares cannot lose firepower, AJs would run rampant without Ares to keep them in check. At the same time, Ares needs a hard counter.
I'm thinking that the logic behind this move is that Hellburners with AC module will be the hard counter for Ares-trains and fast bots will be workable counters.
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Post by Munki on Jul 11, 2019 12:17:19 GMT -5
Looking at the stats for the Nemesis change, I think it looks good. Bot gets over 10% more HP, speed goes up 1 KPH, and only loses 15% speed when the shield is active. This is not a nerf. Curious to see how it performs. May need to get to the test server to see this in person.
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Post by ⓣⓡⓘⓒⓚⓨ48 on Jul 11, 2019 12:17:20 GMT -5
*Hades is already too slow. Frankly, other than when it's in a train, it's pretty balanced. Lower HP is part of WHY it's as balanced as a God bot can be in their current iterations. If you get at a Hades, it dies. Hades is beyond underwhelming. I have one and it sucks. I've faced a number of them and hey suck vs my underleveled hanger. It has a lot of issues.
As soon as I can get something viable, I'm pulling it out of my active list. Really? I wouldn't say my experience is the same... I can have some really good games with it, without feeling I stomped all over folks who didn't have a God bot... which is what I want, tbh. I don't run it now just because I am sticking to a "fun" hangar for a while... but still, I actually like it for when I am dropped into an overly seeded Champions League match.
What do you run on it? I use Avenger Shredder or Avenger Shredder ECU and have some good matches... but it's def not a walk out with your rooster out kind of bot like the Ares.
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Post by ⓣⓡⓘⓒⓚⓨ48 on Jul 11, 2019 12:19:28 GMT -5
Looking at the stats for the Nemesis change, I think it looks good. Bot gets over 10% more HP, speed goes up 1 KPH, and only loses 15% speed when the shield is active. This is not a nerf. Curious to see how it performs. May need to get to the test server to see this in person. Ahhh that adds a bit more complexity to the proposed change... IMO it now goes from a nerf to a re-balance.
Interesting.
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Post by Munki on Jul 11, 2019 12:30:33 GMT -5
Hades is also getting a 1 KPH speed bump according to the charts shown in the attached video.
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Post by bayscout on Jul 11, 2019 12:36:57 GMT -5
Is there a full list of all these proposed changes somewhere?
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Post by ironstar on Jul 11, 2019 12:45:18 GMT -5
I really like my Hades but it's already slow, no need to make it slower.
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Post by endyu on Jul 11, 2019 12:45:35 GMT -5
I think I was wrong.
With the speed nerf, the Hellburner will definitely break up an Ares train easily. It does require AC module and probably an Ecu, but at least we'll be able to break the trains.
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inspirace
Trusted Contributor 
Posts: 2,670
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Favorite robot: Rog, Griff, Carn, Doc, Rhino, Haechi, Kumiho, Bulgasari, Mender, Inquisitor, Spectre, Strider,
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Post by inspirace on Jul 11, 2019 13:09:54 GMT -5
The train will run slower and also perhaps more clunky since the passengers need to keep their pace with the one providing the purple. A 50% reduction would have been better.
On 1-vs-1, it will be easier to dash inside the purple for my, say, Strider and even Haechi. Until now, Ares was able to backpedal quite fast when I head-bump into its shield.
It’s better than nothing (or a buff). Could’ve been better,
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Post by Wife is Pissed on Jul 11, 2019 13:10:12 GMT -5
I run Nemesis and Hades and get killed all the time without much difficulty. Ares is the ONLY Pantheon bot that needs any nerfing at all. The fact that he can lock you down jizz all over your face with his blue spunk while being invincible for a full 8 seconds is ridiculous. Nemesis is weak and Hades is the most balanced bot of the three.
You want to fix Pantheon? Boost Nemesis rocket damage, slow Ares speed to match Hades, nerf Ares jizz damage, leave Hades alone, and standardize purple shields on all three bots for 6 seconds with a 12 second cooldown, like the Hades.
There. Fixed.
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Post by Loganspawn on Jul 11, 2019 13:27:12 GMT -5
LOL it will just move slower Lol yup...that's all it will do for the 3 man as well. It would be funny to watch the synchronized skill of a 6 man Ares train. It might even help as sometimes the guy with the shield up likes to move away from the others when he shouldn't!  |
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Post by Blurred Vision on Jul 11, 2019 13:46:59 GMT -5
Freakin' morons. As someone who runs all three God bots, Hades & Nemesis do NOT need adjustments. Frankly, they're pretty balanced as they are now. Ares was the only one that needed some tweaking, but even that's debatable if you consider how hard it is to kill off a T-Falcon or Fenrir loaded with super heals, heavy armor, etc.
This cluster flop is being brought to you by the brilliant minds at Pixonic.
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Post by Poopface on Jul 11, 2019 14:12:14 GMT -5
Hades is beyond underwhelming. I have one and it sucks. I've faced a number of them and hey suck vs my underleveled hanger. It has a lot of issues.
As soon as I can get something viable, I'm pulling it out of my active list. Really? I wouldn't say my experience is the same... I can have some really good games with it, without feeling I stomped all over folks who didn't have a God bot... which is what I want, tbh. I don't run it now just because I am sticking to a "fun" hangar for a while... but still, I actually like it for when I am dropped into an overly seeded Champions League match.
What do you run on it? I use Avenger Shredder or Avenger Shredder ECU and have some good matches... but it's def not a walk out with your rooster out kind of bot like the Ares.
I'm using Punisher/Avenger. As I said, I get hosed in it and have no troubles killing them. It's not just me having issues. |
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Post by Rollo Tomasi on Jul 11, 2019 14:42:40 GMT -5
I think I see where Pixonic is coming from with this nerf. It's to make it easier for fast bots like the Pursuer, Strider, Blitz, Hellburner, etc to get inside the Ares bubble and kill it. Pixonic is trying a rock > paper > scissors type of balance: Ares > Ao Jun Ao Jun > Tanks Fast bots > Ares Tanks > Fast bots This can work, but they need to fix the bug where retribution does full damage to resistance bots (tanks) when charged up. The Ares cannot lose firepower, AJs would run rampant without Ares to keep them in check. At the same time, Ares needs a hard counter. I'm thinking that the logic behind this move is that Hellburners with AC module will be the hard counter for Ares-trains and fast bots will be workable counters. So we know from RW testing that retribution bypasses DR. Has pix publically acknowledged that or is it being saved for a silent nerf like pix is so fond of doing? New in v5.3 ... Also, misc other tweaks and bug fixes. |
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Post by Rollo Tomasi on Jul 11, 2019 14:45:07 GMT -5
I think I was wrong. With the speed nerf, the Hellburner will definitely break up an Ares train easily. It does require AC module and probably an Ecu, but at least we'll be able to break the trains. I might just bump my HB up to 12 and put it back in service. Now if only I could win 50k au for some a couple of AC modules for each of my bots, I’d be all set. |
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Post by #1 worst pilot on Jul 11, 2019 14:51:43 GMT -5
Screw it, Buff the ares, destroy the player base and start over again. They messed up, over sold an over powered bot so now anything they do to it will either infuriate those who grinded for them/paid for them, or infuriate everyone else because the nerf will never be enough. The bot created a strong yay/nay about it, there is no middle ground. But it is needed for the au jun.
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Post by Thunderkiss on Jul 11, 2019 15:02:30 GMT -5
I think I was wrong. With the speed nerf, the Hellburner will definitely break up an Ares train easily. It does require AC module and probably an Ecu, but at least we'll be able to break the trains. Not a chance. 3 Ares is a RIDICULOUS amount of fire power.
Hellburner won't stand a chance. As it is a strider has to be so carefully played to get in, and even then it's not 100% effective, more like 50%-60%.
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Post by nomercy on Jul 11, 2019 16:26:27 GMT -5
the speed of Hades and nemesis is already 52 km/h. Maybe they forgot it?
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Post by endyu on Jul 11, 2019 16:28:56 GMT -5
I think I was wrong. With the speed nerf, the Hellburner will definitely break up an Ares train easily. It does require AC module and probably an Ecu, but at least we'll be able to break the trains. Not a chance. 3 Ares is a RIDICULOUS amount of fire power.
Hellburner won't stand a chance. As it is a strider has to be so carefully played to get in, and even then it's not 100% effective, more like 50%-60%.
Not if you run head first, no ecu, from a distance away HB's have a normal running speed of 60 which goes up to 120 when its ability is active. Add Road Hog, Speed boosters, Speed modules (future), Adamant Road Hog... that thing will close the distance on an Ares quick. |
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Post by Thunderkiss on Jul 11, 2019 17:21:56 GMT -5
Not a chance. 3 Ares is a RIDICULOUS amount of fire power.
Hellburner won't stand a chance. As it is a strider has to be so carefully played to get in, and even then it's not 100% effective, more like 50%-60%.
Not if you run head first, no ecu, from a distance away HB's have a normal running speed of 60 which goes up to 120 when its ability is active. Add Road Hog, Speed boosters, Speed modules (future), Adamant Road Hog... that thing will close the distance on an Ares quick. Charge an ares train.
Brilliant.
You'll be dead in 300m.
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Post by endyu on Jul 11, 2019 17:30:54 GMT -5
Not if you run head first, no ecu, from a distance away HB's have a normal running speed of 60 which goes up to 120 when its ability is active. Add Road Hog, Speed boosters, Speed modules (future), Adamant Road Hog... that thing will close the distance on an Ares quick. Charge an ares train.
Brilliant.
You'll be dead in 300m.
Oops sorry, I meant "yah if you run head first, no ecu from distance." You can get close and turn on your ability and charge the ares-train. |
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