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Post by mallexx222 on Feb 5, 2018 12:18:24 GMT -5
Okay ALL of this is just IMHO. I have no basis outside of observance and logic to make assumptions.
So my understanding was that Supply drops were supposed to mitigate tanking. Okay...how? I am in Expert II and my first, yes I said first so may be jumping the gun but I doubt it, was 41,000 Silver, 7 Chests and 45 Kumiho components. Okay so first off it was free and that is always a good thing so thank you Pix. However if this was intended to stop tanking, and on a personal note I do not and have never tanked but I suck enough to get beat down so don't really have to, I cannot see it as ANY deterant to tanking. (Lends credence to those of you who have always stated that Pix's goal is not to stop tanking as it leads to seal clubbing that leads those pilots that are willing to spend money to stop the clubbing in lower leagues to do so. Remember the VAST majority of pilots NEVER spend any significant RM on app games so getting to the ones that do is paramount.)
3.6. Now forces pilots into the hated TDM and this is what happened immediately to me. Can't stand this mode but I dutifully completed the match. I tried but could not care less who killed me with what or about ANY outcome save that it was over and managed to play down to the wire.
I have a long diatribe of Pix's revenue stream Business Model but I will spare you as it is a bit long. But in summary Pix/Mail.r.u. has a plan and I don't think it is going well. It's logical from a business perspective but in application it falls well short or desired revenue goals as it alienates the base. Word is the Specter bot is not selling well no word on the Strider. I also understand that Pix has fallen from as high as the top 20 app revenue generators to bellow 90. A definitive downward trajectory. Most companies would seek to stabilize by returning to solid ground but that is NOT pix's model.
I have long since predicted the end of a really great game and cannot help but feel we are on the very cusp of it's final significant fall. Significant meaning that what is left that limps on will not be worth the bullet to put it out of its misery.
We are I feel clearly being herded towards Pix's revenue streams as opposed to us finding the watering holes we prefer on our own.
So Lunar event: Lame out of the box and it has not even started but I do like and will go for the final prize so make of it as you will.
I have heard good things about X Hangar but it is not a draw for me at all. Seems like opening up gifts long before a Christmas that may never come. Supply drops near useless towards their stated intention. No surprise. Forced into game modes that are not enjoyable. KOTH is not catching on and I don't personally enjoy playing it. Turnover in any but the most devote clans is up and replacements are long to gain and quick to leave. (Again just IMHO) I loved this game but am now in an I can take it or leave it frame of mind. I am not angry, disappointed but not angry as it is what it is after all and I am F2P mainly because the downward direction of the game is painfully clear.
But I feel that with the new addition of Strider and Specter, forced game modes and weakening events the Pix business model failure or resale of this platform will come within this calendar year. I will go as far to say that come September or October it will be either dead, under new management or both.
What are your thoughts?
Happy Hunting.
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Post by SGT D00M! on Feb 5, 2018 12:29:46 GMT -5
IF....IF we could choose the components in the supply drop, it MIGHT make a difference. But I don't need a Kumiho and the difference between 3 and 7 keys is not enough to matter. I'm trying a little harder to break out of gold again back into diamond, but I was never a tanker, and I will not play a meta hangar just for this.
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Post by fizbanrapper on Feb 5, 2018 12:33:29 GMT -5
I agree with most of your post, but I'll keep to the subject line for my response.
They need to get rid of the 30m speed up for supply drops. Naturally I'd be a E2 and earning 45 components every 3 hours. The speed up has shifted the incentive for me. Instead of only going after silver and wins, I've shifted towards a more reckless style of play in order to get more games in. I do this for the speed ups because I want kumiho.
I find that I've slowly drifted down to E3 and will likely hit D1 before I get the bot. What is my penalty for this? Reduced components from 45 to 41, a mere 10%. If my games are 50% shorter, it is well worth the 10% drop in components per match. I'll get twice the number of speed ups which I'll use on an item that I know that I want. Adding more component weapons and bots makes BM much less appealing, by comparison.
Fully making up for the 10% drop is the fact that, after I get the bot, I'll be making a lot more silver in D1 than I would in E2.
The system should do a lot more to reward wins. Instead the system really rewards damage per second and games per hour. We're seeing worse gameplay because of it.
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Post by arakos on Feb 5, 2018 12:41:03 GMT -5
I mostly agree to what you said, but I have a question: where have you read that the spectre is not selling well?
That surprised me a lot, it's clearly an OP bot
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Post by fizbanrapper on Feb 5, 2018 13:00:17 GMT -5
I agree with most of your post, but I'll keep to the subject line for my response. They need to get rid of the 30m speed up for supply drops. Naturally I'd be a E2 and earning 45 components every 3 hours. The speed up has shifted the incentive for me. Instead of only going after silver and wins, I've shifted towards a more reckless style of play in order to get more games in. I do this for the speed ups because I want kumiho. I find that I've slowly drifted down to E3 and will likely hit D1 before I get the bot. What is my penalty for this? Reduced components from 45 to 41, a mere 10%. If my games are 50% shorter, it is well worth the 10% drop in components per match. I'll get twice the number of speed ups which I'll use on an item that I know that I want. Adding more component weapons and bots makes BM much less appealing, by comparison. Fully making up for the 10% drop is the fact that, after I get the bot, I'll be making a lot more silver in D1 than I would in E2. The system should do a lot more to reward wins. Instead the system really rewards damage per second and games per hour. We're seeing worse gameplay because of it. I should also mention my motivation for wanting kumiho is a response to another one of mail.fu's gimmicks.... The beacon cap task. Get rid of those and I'd have no interest in that ugly gazelle-looking m-effer. I don't want to pay to win, but the hoops I have to jump through in order to avoid it wind up ruining the game itself. Like I've said before, pix is king when it comes to 「dookie」ting where one also eats. |
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Post by bronzeknee on Feb 5, 2018 14:14:47 GMT -5
They need to get rid of the 30m speed up for supply drops. Naturally I'd be a E2 and earning 45 components every 3 hours. The speed up has shifted the incentive for me. Instead of only going after silver and wins, I've shifted towards a more reckless style of play in order to get more games in. I do this for the speed ups because I want kumiho. I find that I've slowly drifted down to E3 and will likely hit D1 before I get the bot. What is my penalty for this? Reduced components from 45 to 41, a mere 10%. If my games are 50% shorter, it is well worth the 10% drop in components per match. I'll get twice the number of speed ups which I'll use on an item that I know that I want. Adding more component weapons and bots makes BM much less appealing, by comparison. And this is why everyone should do this if they want a certain item. It was intended. This game is all about farming, and Pixonic wants it to be that way. They want you to crave the new stuff so much you'll do anything to get it. And you admit you need the Kumiho for beacon tasks, even if you didn't want one! And then you'll think hard about tanking or paying money, as both choices violate the spirit of a competitive game.
But War Robots isn't a competitive game. It is a farming game. Pixonic just pretends it is. I don't want to pay to win, but the hoops I have to jump through in order to avoid it wind up ruining the game itself. Totally intended as I mentioned, you choose to violate the spirit of a competitive game by tanking. Pixonic is telling you that you can get around that by paying... but paying also happens to violate the spirit of a competitive game, because pay to win isn't competitive. |
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Post by mallexx222 on Feb 5, 2018 16:33:57 GMT -5
I mostly agree to what you said, but I have a question: where have you read that the spectre is not selling well? That surprised me a lot, it's clearly an OP bot A fair question and one I wish I could definitively answer. I myself heard this through another post which is why I say 'Word is' but I do not know this for a fact. At a guess I would say that enough whales are even disappointed with having their last toys given away and reduced in strength when they paid hundreds of $'s to get them. Maybe even they can see the pattern and will simply wait for them to be given away. After all they currently still hold an advantage over the rest of the majority of pilots. Point: They still own the top tech and do not need another OP bot to stay on top AND Pix has made certain that few can afford the Specter. ($300 for a single bot in an entire game...really. That is like one unit among many, a single knight on a chess board and you want what? Plus you will only nerf and give it away in an event in three months...okay well go luck with that.) Happy Hunting. |
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Post by T34 on Feb 5, 2018 17:21:51 GMT -5
I mostly agree to what you said, but I have a question: where have you read that the spectre is not selling well? That surprised me a lot, it's clearly an OP bot A fair question and one I wish I could definitively answer. I myself heard this through another post which is why I say 'Word is' but I do not know this for a fact. At a guess I would say that enough whales are even disappointed with having their last toys given away and reduced in strength when they paid hundreds of $'s to get them. Maybe even they can see the pattern and will simply wait for them to be given away. After all they currently still hold an advantage over the rest of the majority of pilots. Point: They still own the top tech and do not need another OP bot to stay on top AND Pix has made certain that few can afford the Specter. ($300 for a single bot in an entire game...really. That is like one unit among many, a single knight on a chess board and you want what? Plus you will only nerf and give it away in an event in three months...okay well go luck with that.) Happy Hunting. I think the attitude of the whales will be very important to the new bots provided the new bots are OP. It could potentially make or break the game. If the spectre is OP but the whales (money whales and addict whales) do not purchase but persevere with their old stuff than the gig is up for Pixonic and for all players as under those circumstance their monetization strategy in its current form has failed. So we need to watch the speed of uptake of these bots and also the revenue generated. Its still too early but I sense the whales are holding their money so far (more than with the dashes). But how long will this continue before they will start purchasing because the other guy has bough it and now has an advantage over them. If it is a flop than Pix will buff the new stuff really fast. If the whales still don’t buy they will drop the price. At a certain price point they will sell for sure but will that be enough revenue to keep the company profitable. Lets see what happens next. Lets see the level of apathy amongst the whales. |
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lviss
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Post by lviss on Feb 5, 2018 17:33:27 GMT -5
Supply drops are not enough to stop tanking, I can gain much more playing in silver or gold League than w/supplies
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Post by bronzeknee on Feb 5, 2018 17:57:10 GMT -5
Supply drops are not enough to stop tanking, I can gain much more playing in silver or gold League than w/supplies Yeah it wasn't even close... unless you are in need of particular components, you're better off tanking. |
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Post by T34 on Feb 5, 2018 18:24:53 GMT -5
Supply drops are not enough to stop tanking, I can gain much more playing in silver or gold League than w/supplies Yeah it wasn't even close... unless you are in need of particular components, you're better off tanking. Silver and keys payouts are pitifully in terms of what Pix is offering. Every tanker has been piloting a kumi since 3 events ago so that also fails to capture their interest. In its current form and with the current components on offer a vast majority of tankers will not be interested. I think it is more reasonable to assume that this is a “please come back twice a day” mechanism (and don’t forget us). If you do come back we will give you something in return. As to Pix saying it is to kerb tanking. I’d say its more along the lines to satisfy those who do not like tanking and voicing an opinion against it. Its like “we are listening”….. “see what we have implemented”……”we are trying” |
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Post by U Camp = I Camp on Feb 5, 2018 18:31:44 GMT -5
There are few different reasons people tank. Supply drops attempt to address only one of them.
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Post by Joopiter on Feb 5, 2018 18:37:20 GMT -5
IMHO it's only there to add to an already crowded hangar screen. Eventually there will be little links, buttons, timers and meaningless exclamation points circling the screen. I guess the rewards are ok, but nothing spectacular. If you religiously grab your supply drops then it gets you a fraction of percentage of a decimal of the way to getting the full bot in a month. You'll have to invest other resources and RM in components to a great degree regardless.
By the time they're done adding weird tangents to a basic robot fighting game, you won't be able to click you're robot to equip them because you'll hit a button for the new 1 in 1,000,000 chance robot raffle for magnum components. Yes, in the future, everything gets converted to components....
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Post by mallexx222 on Feb 5, 2018 18:51:59 GMT -5
A fair question and one I wish I could definitively answer. I myself heard this through another post which is why I say 'Word is' but I do not know this for a fact. At a guess I would say that enough whales are even disappointed with having their last toys given away and reduced in strength when they paid hundreds of $'s to get them. Maybe even they can see the pattern and will simply wait for them to be given away. After all they currently still hold an advantage over the rest of the majority of pilots. Point: They still own the top tech and do not need another OP bot to stay on top AND Pix has made certain that few can afford the Specter. ($300 for a single bot in an entire game...really. That is like one unit among many, a single knight on a chess board and you want what? Plus you will only nerf and give it away in an event in three months...okay well go luck with that.) Happy Hunting. I think the attitude of the whales will be very important to the new bots provided the new bots are OP. It could potentially make or break the game. If the spectre is OP but the whales (money whales and addict whales) do not purchase but persevere with their old stuff than the gig is up for Pixonic and for all players as under those circumstance their monetization strategy in its current form has failed. So we need to watch the speed of uptake of these bots and also the revenue generated. Its still too early but I sense the whales are holding their money so far (more than with the dashes). But how long will this continue before they will start purchasing because the other guy has bough it and now has an advantage over them. If it is a flop than Pix will buff the new stuff really fast. If the whales still don’t buy they will drop the price. At a certain price point they will sell for sure but will that be enough revenue to keep the company profitable. Lets see what happens next. Lets see the level of apathy amongst the whales. My thinking on this: This is why Pix is GIVING away a Kamechi during the event, arguably the finest bot out there and then Nerfing it down to earth. This will remove the technology advantage and drive the whales straight into the out reaching arms of the Specter. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 5, 2018 19:22:08 GMT -5
I mostly agree to what you said, but I have a question: where have you read that the spectre is not selling well? That surprised me a lot, it's clearly an OP bot Most bots can already kill fast, really fast. Inquisitor can kill Ancile and shield bots. Roachis are the king of Orkans now. Taran can wipe most bots in 1 salvo. To me, that makes the Spectre redundant, that's if you want to put any type of "death button" on it (Tarans or Orkans). Most Whales will have enough of the Kbots and Inquisitor, so is there something that the Spectre can do better? Spectre is much better at being a support bot despite its massive arsenal. I mean, it's just overkill and a waste of resources at that point. For that much firepower to be useful, there would have to be really beefy bots on the battlefield, like more Raijins and something even stronger than the Bulgogi. So as a support bot, I would use those weapons that don't have high DPS, but have other benefits like more range. So Hydras, Shocktrain, Tulumbas are the main candidates. My guess is that the Shocktrain Spectre will make landfall first. Then maybe the Hydra Spectre will be used, mainly to counter the massive amounts of hiding to avoid all the instant zap-zap at top tier. I could be wrong, but the biggest Whales will "try out" and insta-buy-upgrade the Spectre of Death TM , so it does offer 33% more firepower that someone finds useful to kill a red .5s faster. But I think most smaller Whales have beached, and won't have enough funds, just like I see many stuck with too many Roachis and went hog wild thinking it was the best at release. On iOS platform, I know Roachi is in the past already, and now it's 2/5 bots Bulgogi, 2/5 bots are Inquisitor. |
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Post by r2d2 on Feb 5, 2018 19:25:12 GMT -5
Wasn’t suppose to stop tanking. Where in Pixonic articles did you read that it was meant to? The way I see it, Gold is more important than any other resource so where can you get tons of it?...Exactly...
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Post by Deleted on Feb 5, 2018 19:40:33 GMT -5
IMHO it's only there to add to an already crowded hangar screen. Eventually there will be little links, buttons, timers and meaningless exclamation points circling the screen. I guess the rewards are ok, but nothing spectacular. If you religiously grab your supply drops then it gets you a fraction of percentage of a decimal of the way to getting the full bot in a month. You'll have to invest other resources and RM in components to a great degree regardless. By the time they're done adding weird tangents to a basic robot fighting game, you won't be able to click you're robot to equip them because you'll hit a button for the new 1 in 1,000,000 chance robot raffle for magnum components. Yes, in the future, everything gets converted to components.... They need to streamline the interface. It's crowded. Over crowded. I think some enjoy the meta-games. Trying to figure out the best way to spend their money, to save, and to acquire new stuff. That's an art in itself now. I know when components first came out, I wasted a lot of time following old advice. "Don't use AU to buy WSP". But now that's out the window. If you're good at managing your money, budgeting, planning, and tracking IRL. Then you'll probably use those same skills here. If you're allergic to numbers and touching a calculator, then this won't be fun for you. The math has already been done by Pix. Anyone in Expert or above, they will be able to collect 1 full bot (the Kumiho) this month. I just double-checked with the actual supply drop numbers for my tier, and I'll be able to get a free Kumiho. To me, that's huge. I get tons of resources for free: more silver, more keys, and a bot. Even if you don't need the bot, you can sell it for silver. I can make ~10M Ag this month from the sale of Kumiho components. That reminds me, they need a "sell all" component button. I gave up trying to sell my Storm and Gust components. I know, I say streamline the interface, then I say let's add another button lol. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 5, 2018 19:52:02 GMT -5
Okay ALL of this is just IMHO. I have no basis outside of observance and logic to make assumptions. So my understanding was that Supply drops were supposed to mitigate tanking. Okay...how? I am in Expert II and my first, yes I said first so may be jumping the gun but I doubt it, was 41,000 Silver, 7 Chests and 45 Kumiho components. Okay so first off it was free and that is always a good thing so thank you Pix. However if this was intended to stop tanking, and on a personal note I do not and have never tanked but I suck enough to get beat down so don't really have to, I cannot see it as ANY deterant to tanking. (Lends credence to those of you who have always stated that Pix's goal is not to stop tanking as it leads to seal clubbing that leads those pilots that are willing to spend money to stop the clubbing in lower leagues to do so. Remember the VAST majority of pilots NEVER spend any significant RM on app games so getting to the ones that do is paramount.) 3.6. Now forces pilots into the hated TDM and this is what happened immediately to me. Can't stand this mode but I dutifully completed the match. I tried but could not care less who killed me with what or about ANY outcome save that it was over and managed to play down to the wire. I have a long diatribe of Pix's revenue stream Business Model but I will spare you as it is a bit long. But in summary Pix/Mail.r.u. has a plan and I don't think it is going well. It's logical from a business perspective but in application it falls well short or desired revenue goals as it alienates the base. Word is the Specter bot is not selling well no word on the Strider. I also understand that Pix has fallen from as high as the top 20 app revenue generators to bellow 90. A definitive downward trajectory. Most companies would seek to stabilize by returning to solid ground but that is NOT pix's model. I have long since predicted the end of a really great game and cannot help but feel we are on the very cusp of it's final significant fall. Significant meaning that what is left that limps on will not be worth the bullet to put it out of its misery. We are I feel clearly being herded towards Pix's revenue streams as opposed to us finding the watering holes we prefer on our own. So Lunar event: Lame out of the box and it has not even started but I do like and will go for the final prize so make of it as you will. I have heard good things about X Hangar but it is not a draw for me at all. Seems like opening up gifts long before a Christmas that may never come. Supply drops near useless towards their stated intention. No surprise. Forced into game modes that are not enjoyable. KOTH is not catching on and I don't personally enjoy playing it. Turnover in any but the most devote clans is up and replacements are long to gain and quick to leave. (Again just IMHO) I loved this game but am now in an I can take it or leave it frame of mind. I am not angry, disappointed but not angry as it is what it is after all and I am F2P mainly because the downward direction of the game is painfully clear. But I feel that with the new addition of Strider and Specter, forced game modes and weakening events the Pix business model failure or resale of this platform will come within this calendar year. I will go as far to say that come September or October it will be either dead, under new management or both. What are your thoughts? Happy Hunting. I think a lot of people can't do math. That's how sales people get their victims customers to buy something really expensive. It'll only cost you a dollar a day if you buy this super expensive gizmo! "Sure! When you put it that way, I'll take it. Here's my credit card!" But seriously, they (Pixo) need to do a better job of selling the supply drops. Instead of saying, "here, here's a paltry amount of components", grumble grumble * what is this non-sense *. They need to put it in BOLD preferably. And large letters. WE'RE GIVING YOU A FREE KUMIHO THIS MONTH. |
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Post by T34 on Feb 5, 2018 20:17:02 GMT -5
I mostly agree to what you said, but I have a question: where have you read that the spectre is not selling well? That surprised me a lot, it's clearly an OP bot Most bots can already kill fast, really fast. Inquisitor can kill Ancile and shield bots. Roachis are the king of Orkans now. Taran can wipe most bots in 1 salvo. To me, that makes the Spectre redundant, that's if you want to put any type of "death button" on it (Tarans or Orkans). Most Whales will have enough of the Kbots and Inquisitor, so is there something that the Spectre can do better? Spectre is much better at being a support bot despite its massive arsenal. I mean, it's just overkill and a waste of resources at that point. For that much firepower to be useful, there would have to be really beefy bots on the battlefield, like more Raijins and something even stronger than the Bulgogi. So as a support bot, I would use those weapons that don't have high DPS, but have other benefits like more range. So Hydras, Shocktrain, Tulumbas are the main candidates. My guess is that the Shocktrain Spectre will make landfall first. Then maybe the Hydra Spectre will be used, mainly to counter the massive amounts of hiding to avoid all the instant zap-zap at top tier. I could be wrong, but the biggest Whales will "try out" and insta-buy-upgrade the Spectre of Death TM , so it does offer 33% more firepower that someone finds useful to kill a red .5s faster. But I think most smaller Whales have beached, and won't have enough funds, just like I see many stuck with too many Roachis and went hog wild thinking it was the best at release. On iOS platform, I know Roachi is in the past already, and now it's 2/5 bots Bulgogi, 2/5 bots are Inquisitor. Interesting take on things and I suspect there is a considerable amount truth to it.
Saying what you have expressed another way, the spectre is marginally OP when compared to the older bots but the marginal benefit provided by the use of a spectre may not equate to its price tag. That = flop.
If so this is a very interesting situation and Pix needs to respond to make that price tag worth while without introducing further unbalance and stress to the game. Otherwise this could be a significant bump in the selling power monetization strategy.
Cant wait to see how this unfolds.
Edit: is it possible Pix has overcooked it and rushed with this release (bots week, weapons too strong, hasn't nerfed the outgoing meta bots first)
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vball
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Post by vball on Feb 5, 2018 20:46:53 GMT -5
Okay ALL of this is just IMHO. I have no basis outside of observance and logic to make assumptions. So my understanding was that Supply drops were supposed to mitigate tanking. Okay...how? I am in Expert II and my first, yes I said first so may be jumping the gun but I doubt it, was 41,000 Silver, 7 Chests and 45 Kumiho components. Okay so first off it was free and that is always a good thing so thank you Pix. However if this was intended to stop tanking, and on a personal note I do not and have never tanked but I suck enough to get beat down so don't really have to, I cannot see it as ANY deterant to tanking. (Lends credence to those of you who have always stated that Pix's goal is not to stop tanking as it leads to seal clubbing that leads those pilots that are willing to spend money to stop the clubbing in lower leagues to do so. Remember the VAST majority of pilots NEVER spend any significant RM on app games so getting to the ones that do is paramount.) 3.6. Now forces pilots into the hated TDM and this is what happened immediately to me. Can't stand this mode but I dutifully completed the match. I tried but could not care less who killed me with what or about ANY outcome save that it was over and managed to play down to the wire. I have a long diatribe of Pix's revenue stream Business Model but I will spare you as it is a bit long. But in summary Pix/Mail.r.u. has a plan and I don't think it is going well. It's logical from a business perspective but in application it falls well short or desired revenue goals as it alienates the base. Word is the Specter bot is not selling well no word on the Strider. I also understand that Pix has fallen from as high as the top 20 app revenue generators to bellow 90. A definitive downward trajectory. Most companies would seek to stabilize by returning to solid ground but that is NOT pix's model. I have long since predicted the end of a really great game and cannot help but feel we are on the very cusp of it's final significant fall. Significant meaning that what is left that limps on will not be worth the bullet to put it out of its misery. We are I feel clearly being herded towards Pix's revenue streams as opposed to us finding the watering holes we prefer on our own. So Lunar event: Lame out of the box and it has not even started but I do like and will go for the final prize so make of it as you will. I have heard good things about X Hangar but it is not a draw for me at all. Seems like opening up gifts long before a Christmas that may never come. Supply drops near useless towards their stated intention. No surprise. Forced into game modes that are not enjoyable. KOTH is not catching on and I don't personally enjoy playing it. Turnover in any but the most devote clans is up and replacements are long to gain and quick to leave. (Again just IMHO) I loved this game but am now in an I can take it or leave it frame of mind. I am not angry, disappointed but not angry as it is what it is after all and I am F2P mainly because the downward direction of the game is painfully clear. But I feel that with the new addition of Strider and Specter, forced game modes and weakening events the Pix business model failure or resale of this platform will come within this calendar year. I will go as far to say that come September or October it will be either dead, under new management or both. What are your thoughts? Happy Hunting. They are just creating a further divide between the regular player and the rich player. You can't get anywhere in this game without spending an insane amount of money. So they are getting two types of players, the few rich players who have over powered bots already and the free addicted players. Unfortunately, a lot of the free players now were medium size pocket players that created a steady stream of income in the past and have recently closed their wallets. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 5, 2018 21:16:10 GMT -5
Most bots can already kill fast, really fast. Inquisitor can kill Ancile and shield bots. Roachis are the king of Orkans now. Taran can wipe most bots in 1 salvo. To me, that makes the Spectre redundant, that's if you want to put any type of "death button" on it (Tarans or Orkans). Most Whales will have enough of the Kbots and Inquisitor, so is there something that the Spectre can do better? Spectre is much better at being a support bot despite its massive arsenal. I mean, it's just overkill and a waste of resources at that point. For that much firepower to be useful, there would have to be really beefy bots on the battlefield, like more Raijins and something even stronger than the Bulgogi. So as a support bot, I would use those weapons that don't have high DPS, but have other benefits like more range. So Hydras, Shocktrain, Tulumbas are the main candidates. My guess is that the Shocktrain Spectre will make landfall first. Then maybe the Hydra Spectre will be used, mainly to counter the massive amounts of hiding to avoid all the instant zap-zap at top tier. I could be wrong, but the biggest Whales will "try out" and insta-buy-upgrade the Spectre of Death TM , so it does offer 33% more firepower that someone finds useful to kill a red .5s faster. But I think most smaller Whales have beached, and won't have enough funds, just like I see many stuck with too many Roachis and went hog wild thinking it was the best at release. On iOS platform, I know Roachi is in the past already, and now it's 2/5 bots Bulgogi, 2/5 bots are Inquisitor. Interesting take on things and I suspect there is a considerable amount truth to it.
Saying what you have expressed another way, the spectre is marginally OP when compared to the older bots but the marginal benefit provided by the use of a spectre may not equate to its price tag. That = flop.
If so this is a very interesting situation and Pix needs to respond to make that price tag worth while without introducing further unbalance and stress to the game. Otherwise this could be a significant bump in the selling power monetization strategy.
Cant wait to see how this unfolds.
Edit: is it possible Pix has overcooked it and rushed with this release (bots week, weapons too strong, hasn't nerfed the outgoing meta bots first)
It's not marginal, but it's just the breaking point of some Whales. Remember MKII has a 20% boost, so this is new Spectre can hold 33% more firepower than a Kbot. To me, MIKII broke the game more than just the Kbots or even the Shocktrain. When you put all 3 together, then a legacy hanger at 9/10 just cannot compete anymore. Let's compare the firepower of the different plasma platforms, normalized to 1 Taran. Bulgogi: 3x Inquisitor with Taran/Redeemer: 3.2x for both burst and cycle DPS Spectre: 4x So if you compare Spectre to the previous best plasma platform, then 4x/3.2 = 25% more firepower. That should give a hefty boost like MKII did and make it desirable, but MKII also boosted HP and it allowed every bot to be stronger. So we need to see how much health it has for a fair comparison. At MKI L12 Bulgogi: 190K HP + 305K Inquisitor: 165K HP Spectre: 110K HP Let's normalize the everything to the Spectre. Bulgogi: 1.73x + 2.77x Inquisitor: 1.5x Spectre: 1x So Spectre is really a glass cannon. Most Whales don't have the skill since they offset it with their wallet, so this bot is not for them. I'm not sure it's worth it even if you do have the skills. Reading the bio, it has 18s cool down vs 20s of Inquisitor. Main benefit (besides firepower) is its top speed of 55kph vs 40kph of Inquisitor. To conclude, this bot does seem balanced at release. Maybe even a little underpowered (health wise). It feels like the Doc all over again. Still a good bot. Maybe a replacement for the Stalker for some? And those pros will really know how to use their Inquisitor. Definitely niche. Edit: I'm not sure the Shocktrain is a good platform for this in top tier. Bulgogi Shocktrain Champions really need that shield and HP to protect themselves out there. Same with using Tulumbas, and having 2 dash and shield for defense against the multitude of threats out there. So the only viable support build for the avg Whale is the Hydra Spectre, not the other 2. |
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Post by Danny Linguini on Feb 5, 2018 21:17:42 GMT -5
They are just creating a further divide between the regular player and the rich player. You can't get anywhere in this game without spending an insane amount of money. So they are getting two types of players, the few rich players who have over powered bots already and the free addicted players. Unfortunately, a lot of the free players now were medium size pocket players that created a steady stream of income in the past and have recently closed their wallets. I would really like to see how much revenue each of these groups of players represent. How much do they make off the few whales vs the once more numerous moderate spenders? How much, if anything, have they lost by marketing to the whales? Another thing they probably miscalculated was the saturation point. The dash bots were the first foray into over-the-top pricing, they offered an immediate and ridiculous advantage, and they were obviously successful looking at the sheer numbers of them. But there was really nothing quite like them before, as opposed to now where they're introducing OP gear on top of other OP gear. I figured they'd eventually reach this point where even the whales say that's enough, but I didn't think they'd reach it on only their second wave. Personally I think they'd have a more sustainable model marketing to the moderate spenders who'd be willing to part with smaller amounts over a longer period of time. But what do I know -- I only have a MBA from a 'murcan college school. |
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Post by T34 on Feb 5, 2018 22:10:54 GMT -5
They are just creating a further divide between the regular player and the rich player. You can't get anywhere in this game without spending an insane amount of money. So they are getting two types of players, the few rich players who have over powered bots already and the free addicted players. Unfortunately, a lot of the free players now were medium size pocket players that created a steady stream of income in the past and have recently closed their wallets. I would really like to see how much revenue each of these groups of players represent. How much do they make off the few whales vs the once more numerous moderate spenders? How much, if anything, have they lost by marketing to the whales? Another thing they probably miscalculated was the saturation point. The dash bots were the first foray into over-the-top pricing, they offered an immediate and ridiculous advantage, and they were obviously successful looking at the sheer numbers of them. But there was really nothing quite like them before, as opposed to now where they're introducing OP gear on top of other OP gear. I figured they'd eventually reach this point where even the whales say that's enough, but I didn't think they'd reach it on only their second wave. Personally I think they'd have a more sustainable model marketing to the moderate spenders who'd be willing to part with smaller amounts over a longer period of time. But what do I know -- I only have a MBA from a 'murcan college school. I think its too early to declare that the whales have had enough. I think we will know in a week or two. What puzzles me is why they didn’t nerf the old gear first. Without the nerfing this new bot does not seem to be worth its price (price = transition). As above the marginal difference seems to be on the small side. But if the whales are saying enough on the second wave than Pix and players may be in trouble. Hard to tell without seeing the financials. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 5, 2018 22:45:29 GMT -5
I would really like to see how much revenue each of these groups of players represent. How much do they make off the few whales vs the once more numerous moderate spenders? How much, if anything, have they lost by marketing to the whales? Another thing they probably miscalculated was the saturation point. The dash bots were the first foray into over-the-top pricing, they offered an immediate and ridiculous advantage, and they were obviously successful looking at the sheer numbers of them. But there was really nothing quite like them before, as opposed to now where they're introducing OP gear on top of other OP gear. I figured they'd eventually reach this point where even the whales say that's enough, but I didn't think they'd reach it on only their second wave. Personally I think they'd have a more sustainable model marketing to the moderate spenders who'd be willing to part with smaller amounts over a longer period of time. But what do I know -- I only have a MBA from a 'murcan college school. I think its too early to declare that the whales have had enough. I think we will know in a week or two. What puzzles me is why they didn’t nerf the old gear first. Without the nerfing this new bot does not seem to be worth its price (price = transition). As above the marginal difference seems to be on the small side. But if the whales are saying enough on the second wave than Pix and players may be in trouble. Hard to tell without seeing the financials. I think it's part of their plan all along. Most everyone who's an adult should know that the big spending season is the latter part of the year, specifically around Xmas time. I think that's why they waited to release everything in the 3rd and 4th quarter of last year. Before the Kbots came out in September (also a big back to school time, where word of mouth is huge), they released the WW bots in Dec of the previous year! That's Dec 2016 for you folks. So nothing was released for months and months, and all of a sudden, you believe that we get the 3 new Kbots, MKII, and Inquisitor, Hover, Ember all at once!? I don't think it was a coincidence that it was so dry in terms of new releases for the first 9 months of last year, and that allowed us to get too comfortable with the BritBot era and for how long that meta lasted. |
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Post by T34 on Feb 5, 2018 23:18:38 GMT -5
I think its too early to declare that the whales have had enough. I think we will know in a week or two. What puzzles me is why they didn’t nerf the old gear first. Without the nerfing this new bot does not seem to be worth its price (price = transition). As above the marginal difference seems to be on the small side. But if the whales are saying enough on the second wave than Pix and players may be in trouble. Hard to tell without seeing the financials. I think it's part of their plan all along. Most everyone who's an adult should know that the big spending season is the latter part of the year, specifically around Xmas time. I think that's why they waited to release everything in the 3rd and 4th quarter of last year. Before the Kbots came out in September (also a big back to school time, where word of mouth is huge), they released the WW bots in Dec of the previous year! That's Dec 2016 for you folks. So nothing was released for months and months, and all of a sudden, you believe that we get the 3 new Kbots, MKII, and Inquisitor, Hover, Ember all at once!? I don't think it was a coincidence that it was so dry in terms of new releases for the first 9 months of last year, and that allowed us to get too comfortable with the BritBot era and for how long that meta lasted. It think they were focusing on implementing the enablers for the monetization strategy during the first 9 months starting with the MM. They also hired new employees so they had to settle in as well. But …. I still don’t know what their current plan is in regards to the strider and spectre. These are not Hover bots. |
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Post by snk on Feb 5, 2018 23:41:41 GMT -5
SD may not stop all tanking, but it gives some reward for the people staying higher League. The rewards actually very good, 15 keys, 61000Ag, 65 components every 3 hours. Which means in a month
3600 keys = 3.6 gold chest = easier to open 1 superchest
14.6m = not a lot but that’s few hours farming with VIP
15600 components = 1 and half bot. This is pretty good, F2P players can’t get 1 component bot a month.
If you ask me, I won’t tank just because component bots / weapons is much better than what you you get from tanking.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 6, 2018 0:20:10 GMT -5
I would really like to see how much revenue each of these groups of players represent. How much do they make off the few whales vs the once more numerous moderate spenders? How much, if anything, have they lost by marketing to the whales? Another thing they probably miscalculated was the saturation point. The dash bots were the first foray into over-the-top pricing, they offered an immediate and ridiculous advantage, and they were obviously successful looking at the sheer numbers of them. But there was really nothing quite like them before, as opposed to now where they're introducing OP gear on top of other OP gear. I figured they'd eventually reach this point where even the whales say that's enough, but I didn't think they'd reach it on only their second wave. Personally I think they'd have a more sustainable model marketing to the moderate spenders who'd be willing to part with smaller amounts over a longer period of time. But what do I know -- I only have a MBA from a 'murcan college school. I think its too early to declare that the whales have had enough. I think we will know in a week or two. What puzzles me is why they didn’t nerf the old gear first. Without the nerfing this new bot does not seem to be worth its price (price = transition). As above the marginal difference seems to be on the small side. But if the whales are saying enough on the second wave than Pix and players may be in trouble. Hard to tell without seeing the financials. I have looked through the top 25 in League of Legends just now, some 14hrs after the iOS update. I have found that there are 5 spectres only across all of the line ups and hangars these players currently use. One of the players has 3 of the 5 and the other two are with individuals. Looking back on the Kbot drop I was seeing full (or near full) hangars by this stage. I just wonder if that is not a rough indicator of saturation or disillusion as a result of the constant push for revenue? As you say, another week will be telling. |
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Post by leavemealone on Feb 6, 2018 4:00:35 GMT -5
They need to get rid of the 30m speed up for supply drops. Naturally I'd be a E2 and earning 45 components every 3 hours. The speed up has shifted the incentive for me. Instead of only going after silver and wins, I've shifted towards a more reckless style of play in order to get more games in. I do this for the speed ups because I want kumiho. I find that I've slowly drifted down to E3 and will likely hit D1 before I get the bot. What is my penalty for this? Reduced components from 45 to 41, a mere 10%. If my games are 50% shorter, it is well worth the 10% drop in components per match. I'll get twice the number of speed ups which I'll use on an item that I know that I want. Adding more component weapons and bots makes BM much less appealing, by comparison. And this is why everyone should do this if they want a certain item. It was intended. This game is all about farming, and Pixonic wants it to be that way. They want you to crave the new stuff so much you'll do anything to get it. And you admit you need the Kumiho for beacon tasks, even if you didn't want one! And then you'll think hard about tanking or paying money, as both choices violate the spirit of a competitive game.
But War Robots isn't a competitive game. It is a farming game. Pixonic just pretends it is. I don't want to pay to win, but the hoops I have to jump through in order to avoid it wind up ruining the game itself. Totally intended as I mentioned, you choose to violate the spirit of a competitive game by tanking. Pixonic is telling you that you can get around that by paying... but paying also happens to violate the spirit of a competitive game, because pay to win isn't competitive. exactly it's the craving that get the player reaching in for their wallet. Hint why the portions is so tinny in return if you play it through the free method. This game is toxic and pix don't even care about curing it. This game is going down in sprial as the way I see it . This is the worst p2w game in history I have ever came across |
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Post by protodrake on Feb 6, 2018 4:51:40 GMT -5
Technically, they can 'squad tank' in a way. By squad tanking it means to play in a squad or about 2 to 3 people then ejecting yourself until all his/her bots are gone.
The chances of his/her team winning is down to ZERO. Unless you are 'fortunate' enough to get OP teammates.
The tankers will be in spectate mode and at that time they can afk until the match ends.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 6, 2018 5:48:10 GMT -5
I mostly agree to what you said, but I have a question: where have you read that the spectre is not selling well? That surprised me a lot, it's clearly an OP bot A fair question and one I wish I could definitively answer. I myself heard this through another post which is why I say 'Word is' but I do not know this for a fact. At a guess I would say that enough whales are even disappointed with having their last toys given away and reduced in strength when they paid hundreds of $'s to get them. Maybe even they can see the pattern and will simply wait for them to be given away. After all they currently still hold an advantage over the rest of the majority of pilots. Point: They still own the top tech and do not need another OP bot to stay on top AND Pix has made certain that few can afford the Specter. ($300 for a single bot in an entire game...really. That is like one unit among many, a single knight on a chess board and you want what? Plus you will only nerf and give it away in an event in three months...okay well go luck with that.) Happy Hunting. Imo, spectre isnt worth the instabuy price, just like the inquisitor. But i bet enough ppl spend 100-200 bucks a month to buy gold and then shop trough the deals. I dont see pix surprised or concerned about low initial sales. These folks are on top of their game. What kept me guessing a bit tho, is on their site they are offering a job as comunity manager for the english folks. Thats kinda open for interpretation, may mean something, may not. |
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