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Post by FRΞΞDØM☆F1GHTΞR on May 21, 2017 13:18:57 GMT -5
To those who are telling me to simply max out my hangar to make everything equal... That literally takes thousands of matches to get to that point, even with premium. I have a job, family, volunteer work, and it's all grand. I'm not giving that up to achieve game balance. Not to mention, having everyone at 12 is not balanced. Having everyone at 8 produces a lot more variety in gameplay, as the test server demonstrates. Here's an idea: quit playing on the live server and only play the test server.
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phoenix232
GI. Patton
Posts: 132
Karma: 74
Pilot name: Phoenix-232
League: Diamond
Server Region: North America
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Post by phoenix232 on May 21, 2017 13:28:24 GMT -5
The game has a natural progression curve and you have the choice of keeping up or staying behind. Most players choose to follow the curve and upgrade their equipment because winning is generally more fun than losing. The biggest downside to upgrading is that eventually the equipment levels even out between players. At that point, one can no longer use that as the excuse for why they perform so poorly. I don't like being 'that guy', but this is the dumbest thing I've read on the internet today. You *contradicted yourself* and didn't even seem to grasp you were doing it. I'm not going to argue with someone who can't grasp simple logic. EDIT: Reading your posts, it seems you came here expressly to argue with people, so I think I get it. Maybe you should just stop posting, and let others who have constructive things to say talk among themselves.
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typewriter
Destrier
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Posts: 61
Karma: 42
Pilot name: Typewriter
Platform: Android
Clan: [Шικ²] ШικΣd
League: Silver
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Post by typewriter on May 21, 2017 14:03:04 GMT -5
If you don't want to upgrade and climb the ranks, then don't. Nobody is forcing you. The game is forcing you. By constantly placing you against players with higher level weaponry, it gimps your performance and your enjoyment. Nobody likes being +/-2(or more) weapon and bot levels behind their opponents. That was literally the entire point of his thread, and you missed it. How does the game constantly place you against players with higher level weaponry, while those other players are players themselves? If you are outgunned in one match, there has to be someone outgunning you in one match. And that someone, is a player.
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Post by War Child on May 21, 2017 14:40:27 GMT -5
To those who are telling me to simply max out my hangar to make everything equal... That literally takes thousands of matches to get to that point, even with premium. I have a job, family, volunteer work, and it's all grand. I'm not giving that up to achieve game balance. Not to mention, having everyone at 12 is not balanced. Having everyone at 8 produces a lot more variety in gameplay, as the test server demonstrates. Here's an idea: quit playing on the live server and only play the test server. Makes perfect sense
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Post by War Child on May 21, 2017 14:51:35 GMT -5
The game has a natural progression curve and you have the choice of keeping up or staying behind. Most players choose to follow the curve and upgrade their equipment because winning is generally more fun than losing. The biggest downside to upgrading is that eventually the equipment levels even out between players. At that point, one can no longer use that as the excuse for why they perform so poorly. I don't like being 'that guy', but this is the dumbest thing I've read on the internet today. You *contradicted yourself* and didn't even seem to grasp you were doing it. I'm not going to argue with someone who can't grasp simple logic. EDIT: Reading your posts, it seems you came here expressly to argue with people, so I think I get it. Maybe you should just stop posting, and let others who have constructive things to say talk among themselves. I also don't want to be that 'guy',but I'll point out that this is one of those post that doesn't make sense.Quoting someone who has a valid argument and calling it dumb. P.s. I've read something dumber,but I don't want to derail OP.
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Post by ΜØØSE on May 21, 2017 15:07:49 GMT -5
Here's an idea: quit playing on the live server and only play the test server. Makes perfect sense Already happening, but the only constraint is the limited availability of the test server. Let's open that baby up full time. Of course, Pixonic won't do that. People would flock to it because it's more fun, but they haven't attached a revenue model to it.
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Post by trustmeimdoctor on May 21, 2017 16:00:35 GMT -5
I'd love to have the bot and weapon levels removed. It would balance the game. I don't think it will ever happen though.
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Post by mojoswagger1 on May 21, 2017 23:48:26 GMT -5
I think your both 100% right on one hand. multiplayer games in which the playing field is level appeal. On the other hand i think its extremely short sighted . i seriously have to question the replayability of the game if there is no want/need to upgrade. not to mention your statement that things could still cost gold is rediculous. pixonic might as well call itself war robots because it is there sole asset because of what a cash cow it is . the company haz 50 employees . 50 human beings and there families are supported by the income generated . and thats just payroll. so pardon me if i find your assesment lacking any merit as far as your economic solution and how it would play out on a level field . i have to admit though i dont have a fix . i tossed the idea of non league play around on clans messenger group and i got told all the reasons it wont happen .
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Post by mechtout on May 22, 2017 0:01:59 GMT -5
To those who are telling me to simply max out my hangar to make everything equal... That literally takes thousands of matches to get to that point, even with premium. I have a job, family, volunteer work, and it's all grand. I'm not giving that up to achieve game balance. Not to mention, having everyone at 12 is not balanced. Having everyone at 8 produces a lot more variety in gameplay, as the test server demonstrates. didnt say max out, said get to 10/10 and develop some skills to battle max players. a level 10 heavy cost 7M ag to upgrade, thats nothing. Unless you are trying to get to upgrade everything yesterday.....then i don't think you have the patience for these types of games. Overwatch might fit your requirements better.
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Post by Tatamat on May 22, 2017 2:37:49 GMT -5
Same as OP - I have no real desire to push weps behind 8 and bots behind 9. Seems that I'll spend some time at this level testing all combinations that sound either effective or fun to play.
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Post by frunobulax on May 22, 2017 11:04:11 GMT -5
Revelation 1: I crossed a threshold this week - I came to a point where I am no longer interested in upgrading my weapons or robots. [...] However, there is no point in upgrading them. [...] Revelation 2: I got on the test server today, and holy ?poo-poo?, it was fun. Refreshingly fun. Enough I had to ask myself why. [...] Revelation 3: New weapons and bots, not upgraded weapons and bots, make the game exciting and progressive. I can't wait for these new weapons and bots to come out. It's fun to experiment, even more fun to use them to innovate new tactics. For me, I wonder "what's the point" with a lot of things. I even don't care about winning anymore, because I know that for every win I get I will "earn" a loss later, as matchmaking pushes me towards my "fair" ranking. Deathmatch was fun. About the new weapons and bots, well, personally I think we have enough stuff in the game. The dash bots add a new dimension, but they are not that different from the jumping robots. The Dash robots would probably push some existing robots out of the game - I mean, is there something fundamentally different between Dash and Griffin? Is there a good reason to keep both of them? And I don't think the new weapons add something that is missing in the current gameplay. We have a rock-paper-scissors setup in the game both in distance and with damage/shield types, and so far I haven't seen something that adds a new dimension here. Bottom line, for me the fascination of war robots comes from a relatively simple setup that allows for complex strategies. Physical shields can be countered by rockets and by team tactics (flanking). Rockets can be countered by Anciles and speed. All short range weapons can be countered with long range weapons, and long range weapons can be countered with the right kind of shield and team tactics. But if you add a huge number of robots, or more new weapons, does it really help the game? There is some short term fun in figuring out how the new stuff works. But this wears off quickly. What would help (I've said it often) would be to drop this stupid new matchmaking, give us back the ability to use fun hangars (weapons and robots), get rid of tankers and exploiters. But Pixo won't do this, and therefore I have jumped on the "just passing the time until Battle Titans is ready" bandwagon a long time ago.
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Post by miatahead on May 22, 2017 12:21:46 GMT -5
OP fundamentally has no fundamental stance to recommend fundamental changes to the game since he fundamentally hasn't played the game long enough.
Level 8 is balanced? OP has been drinking too much Pix Kool-Aid. Bots aren't even at maxed speed at level 8, so how can the game be 'balanced'? That is just a ploy so people don't stop playing Last Stand and only play TS. Get a clue.
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Post by adrenachrome on May 22, 2017 12:50:17 GMT -5
I feel the same way as the OP. We live in a capitalist society which drives the freemium model. Pix doesn't know any better. In China ironically they have balanced the grind with the pay to win. Allowing in game trading. The grinders can earn gold to buy chests with random odds of a good bot or weapon depending on the chest. Then the pay to win guy can buy the bot from the grinder for gold not the in game store. Therefore achieving more balance allowing all to have access to all bots and weapons. Remove weapon levels and add a crew to the bots. Leveling the crew giving strategic advantages which would come from game play. So even buying the best bot doesn't give you the best bot till your crew is leveled, with a variety of crew skills makes each bot individual. Increase the price of premium to $20 a month for a more sold revenue base. It's hard to explain all the fine details... But there are better ways...
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Post by SATmaster728 on May 22, 2017 13:09:48 GMT -5
Hangar based game = hangar based MM Skill based game = skill based MM Unfortunately War Robots is a game heavily based on your hangar and its levels. Either get rid of the MM and put the old one back or set everything to a similar level. I like that idea. What i am saying is to combine them to make an accurate, fair, nearly impossible to tank system. there was this for a short while before the new mm was put in, you know. just use that.
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Post by make7upyours on May 22, 2017 17:45:38 GMT -5
The point is the be the very best you can be. If you don't care about climbing rank, then you won't care. Think of the top end of the game. Everyone is maxed out and the game is balanced again. Every competitive game needs this.
This will never happen in any of these cell phone games and I'll tell you why. Monetization. This whole game is build upon leveling up your items and getting new items. The closest thing the devs will never do is cap levels, which is what I always clamor for.
Only thing they may give is another mode where it's fair levels. But the main game will never be fair because that's not what makes money. This is the root of everything. Money.
BTW, if this is like any other game of it's business model, they make most their money from about 2% of their customers. The whales. As it stands, the only way for a new player to catch up is to use gold to speed up upgrades.
That said, I'd love some new game modes like 1 bot deathmatch.
It's not the game forcing you. It's other players making the choice to tank. This is the age old argument in all these freemium games. Game is putting you where your skill level is, just like those that are bad at the game. Maybe you only need level 4 items to get to silver, but what about 「slow」 little johnny who needs level 7 to get to the same rating?
I personally don't agree, but that's the way it is.
We will never get a fair game because that doesn't make money like this model does.
That makes no sense. Everyone is 12 or everyone is 8. Why is one balanced and the other not balanced? Different doesn't mean unbalanced btw. It's like saying lightweight boxer vs lightweight boxer is not as fair as heavyweight vs heavyweight. Logic does not compute.
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psychoticwolf13
GI. Patton
When you hear my howl, you know there's no escape
Posts: 139
Karma: 26
Pilot name: Psychotic_Wolf13
Platform: iOS
Clan: The Wolf Clan
League: Expert
Server Region: North America
Favorite robot: Bulwark, Lancelot, Mercury
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Post by psychoticwolf13 on May 22, 2017 21:09:46 GMT -5
I see what you are saying in a sense. It would make it so that the game would be more balanced. However, it would make the game fade out quickly. With nothing to upgrade, people will not feel as if there is any goal to the game. To make sure that you know that I understand your pain, I suggest a new MM system: All your weapon levels would be added up and be divided by the number of weapon slots. All your bot levels are added, doubled, then added to your weapon score. This would be your loadout score. Your skill score would be from +15 to -15. The skill score determines the range of your opponents. For example: if you are bad, you would have a low score (such as -15). That means that, on average, other players would have 15 less loadout score than you. Have you done the math on what a hangar with 4 L1 weaponless pattons and a 5/12 taran ancilot would be? weapon score is 36 / 19 = 1.89 bot score is 9*2 = 18 total score = 20, rounding up meanwhile a 3 slot hangar with stock L3 Golem, vityaz and Boa would equal (14/8)+18=20 rounding up i like the intention but I believe it would be problematic in practice. Exactly. the ancilot would be the only bot worth running in that senario. The other player would be able to eventually take him out as all of his bots are useful. However, a +2 to premium and a +1 to workshop would balance it even further
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Post by Cdr. Crimmins on May 22, 2017 23:00:11 GMT -5
Have you done the math on what a hangar with 4 L1 weaponless pattons and a 5/12 taran ancilot would be? weapon score is 36 / 19 = 1.89 bot score is 9*2 = 18 total score = 20, rounding up meanwhile a 3 slot hangar with stock L3 Golem, vityaz and Boa would equal (14/8)+18=20 rounding up i like the intention but I believe it would be problematic in practice. Exactly. the ancilot would be the only bot worth running in that senario. The other player would be able to eventually take him out as all of his bots are useful. However, a +2 to premium and a +1 to workshop would balance it even further I'm pretty sure that Ancilot would handily destroy those three bots one at a time. No plasma, no pinatas. KWK main armament. They would be quicker, generally, but he still has rush. How are they supposed to get through that ancile? The four pattons are there purely to drive his hangar score into the toilet, but heck, one of them could still cap beacons early on and then eject into the Ancilot.
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Post by anjian on May 22, 2017 23:07:55 GMT -5
To those who are telling me to simply max out my hangar to make everything equal... That literally takes thousands of matches to get to that point, even with premium. I have a job, family, volunteer work, and it's all grand. I'm not giving that up to achieve game balance. Not to mention, having everyone at 12 is not balanced. Having everyone at 8 produces a lot more variety in gameplay, as the test server demonstrates. Here's an idea: quit playing on the live server and only play the test server. Been thinking of doing this. However you also experience huge imbalances thanks to weapons that are being tested.
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Post by SATmaster728 on May 23, 2017 10:22:38 GMT -5
Exactly. the ancilot would be the only bot worth running in that senario. The other player would be able to eventually take him out as all of his bots are useful. However, a +2 to premium and a +1 to workshop would balance it even further I'm pretty sure that Ancilot would handily destroy those three bots one at a time. No plasma, no pinatas. KWK main armament. They would be quicker, generally, but he still has rush. How are they supposed to get through that ancile? The four pattons are there purely to drive his hangar score into the toilet, but heck, one of them could still cap beacons early on and then eject into the Ancilot. that is just like the old sealclubbing. high level weapons, low level bots. same idea, but with that high bot, you would get pused up higher and have to fail to get bck down. would not work anymore then the old seal clubbing.
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Post by adrenachrome on May 23, 2017 11:55:30 GMT -5
Seal clubber in gold 1.... This is what I have issue with
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