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Post by Garbage game on Feb 25, 2021 0:41:52 GMT -5
So you’re comparing a lvl 1 Thermonuclear Reactor (which is only 1% better than a cheapass max normal Nuclear Reactor by the way) to a lvl 1 Last Stand? I’d still take the Last Stand over it. And stacking Last Stand does NOTHING. It doesn’t increase the duration, it just increases the trigger point, which is a detriment in most cases. A max Last Stand almost always guarantees that all your weapons are intact. If you didn’t bother upgrading it past lvl 1 and make your assumptions based on that I dunno what to say to you. My Last Stand and TNRs and ODUs are all maxed. Being invincible means you have control of the situation and an upper hand while your opponent has to guess when that invincibility ends and eats lead/plasma/fire in the meantime. Also when did I mention “extra damage?” You can’t deal damage if you get gibbed instantly either. Last Stand prevents that I used Thermonuclear Reactor as an example because it's a premium module. And even if it's crap percentage, it is always on no matter what. Last stand is situational an in no way gives you control of the situation . It gives you control over the time of your death or possibly escape. That's it. Total control is lockdown. You didn't mention extra damage, someone else did, but they meant in the sense that you cam fire longer while invulnerable/vs dead. And I have always been pretty clear and explicitly stated my argument was for unmaxed Last Stand, specifically level 1. A level 1 Last Stand is trash, that's what I think. And the Armorer main point is exclusively on silver gained Vs silver spent regardless of "winning" I don't have numbers to crunch but I believe a maxed Thermonuclear Reactor definitely returns more than maxLS on the investment in terms of STRAIGHT SILVER. By your metrics a lvl 1 Thermonuclear Reactor is trash too. 5000Au for a 1% boost in damage? Last Stand offers something totally unique and completely broken to the game. Invulnerability while being able to shoot and cap beacons. You mention "being focused by everyone in your vicinity." You could technically get hit by 500 MK2 Gausses. You are INVULNERABLE. There have been so many times where Last Stand lets me reactivate my ability or get out of range in Ao Jun, Nightingale, Leech, Loki, the list goes on. And yes, winning matters a lot in terms of silver earned. At the height of Hawk stupidity, one would instantly take my Phantom from full hp to Last Stand with the beam. If I didn't have it I'd die and not cap center beacon or whatever.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 25, 2021 3:03:18 GMT -5
I used Thermonuclear Reactor as an example because it's a premium module. And even if it's crap percentage, it is always on no matter what. Last stand is situational an in no way gives you control of the situation . It gives you control over the time of your death or possibly escape. That's it. Total control is lockdown. You didn't mention extra damage, someone else did, but they meant in the sense that you cam fire longer while invulnerable/vs dead. And I have always been pretty clear and explicitly stated my argument was for unmaxed Last Stand, specifically level 1. A level 1 Last Stand is trash, that's what I think. And the Armorer main point is exclusively on silver gained Vs silver spent regardless of "winning" I don't have numbers to crunch but I believe a maxed Thermonuclear Reactor definitely returns more than maxLS on the investment in terms of STRAIGHT SILVER. By your metrics a lvl 1 Thermonuclear Reactor is trash too. 5000Au for a 1% boost in damage? Last Stand offers something totally unique and completely broken to the game. Invulnerability while being able to shoot and cap beacons. You mention "being focused by everyone in your vicinity." You could technically get hit by 500 MK2 Gausses. You are INVULNERABLE. There have been so many times where Last Stand lets me reactivate my ability or get out of range in Ao Jun, Nightingale, Leech, Loki, the list goes on. And yes, winning matters a lot in terms of silver earned. At the height of Hawk stupidity, one would instantly take my Phantom from full hp to Last Stand with the beam. If I didn't have it I'd die and not cap center beacon or whatever. Sorry. But a lvl 1 thermonuke mod gives a 5% boost. You put the word invulnerable as if the 4.5 seconds of it is your whole game. The way I see it, last stand is like training wheels for a bicycle. Some will never take them off unless forced to. Others naturally wanna break them off to really learn how to RIDE. The investment part of the discussion is not really something you can argue. Numbers just are what they are. I've done some looking around and noticed that those with loads of last stands were relatively lower in silver counts (what's shown in screenshots anyway). And I'm not talking about by a few tens of millions. The armorer is in the half billion silver League so I'm inclined to think he got something figured out. Lol
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Post by Deleted on Feb 25, 2021 7:03:03 GMT -5
Maybe it's because I'm also a foreigner, but I understood it lol. He's right though, on a technical and practical level. Thermonuke Specifically always nets a Direct return of investment. Last stand is neutral Not really if you survive longer and get some extra damage, kill or beacon in because you used the safe time wisely then you get more silver. Also overall I get more wins, that means TWICE the silver. Just my take and opinion. All must do what they like and works for them. Again Problem with what you saying here is need of condition. When using thermonuke is always pay back. No need for condition. To make easy for argue think about mechanic skill or adamant mechanic. Most player rather have healing active all the time. Over time like many month of playing you add up all the heal you get from regular heal even at .5 beat what you get on condition at higher percentage. Is same here. Something no need condition to perform function is always better than something needing condition to perform same function. In this case function being to pay back for what spent on it while it being use. Also talking about you example. Even if you add up all the extra work you bot put in for the seconds last stand keep you alive and you count the silver intake for that time to give last stand credit for it. You must remember you bot making 10% less silver per last stand vs TN. Then you compare that vs what TN make for you. I no going to mention TN makin you live longer for giving you more power to kill because is more debating. For this discussion we will say compare what TN make for same time bot alive. You will see difference in silver intake is no close. No enough situation for last stand to compare with silver intake from Thermonuke mod.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 25, 2021 7:25:55 GMT -5
By your metrics a lvl 1 Thermonuclear Reactor is trash too. 5000Au for a 1% boost in damage? Last Stand offers something totally unique and completely broken to the game. Invulnerability while being able to shoot and cap beacons. You mention "being focused by everyone in your vicinity." You could technically get hit by 500 MK2 Gausses. You are INVULNERABLE. There have been so many times where Last Stand lets me reactivate my ability or get out of range in Ao Jun, Nightingale, Leech, Loki, the list goes on. And yes, winning matters a lot in terms of silver earned. At the height of Hawk stupidity, one would instantly take my Phantom from full hp to Last Stand with the beam. If I didn't have it I'd die and not cap center beacon or whatever. Sorry. But a lvl 1 thermonuke mod gives a 5% boost. You put the word invulnerable as if the 4.5 seconds of it is your whole game. The way I see it, last stand is like training wheels for a bicycle. Some will never take them off unless forced to. Others naturally wanna break them off to really learn how to RIDE. The investment part of the discussion is not really something you can argue. Numbers just are what they are. I've done some looking around and noticed that those with loads of last stands were relatively lower in silver counts (what's shown in screenshots anyway). And I'm not talking about by a few tens of millions. The armorer is in the half billion silver League so I'm inclined to think he got something figured out. Lol I spend stupid millions doing conversion for workshop every day plus upgrade trying to dump silver. Silver count still go up. Im almost 600mill now.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 25, 2021 8:11:22 GMT -5
Personally I am not impressed much with the acid chip but haven't used them in a while (maybe they preform better now). I tried 3 maxed acid chips on all the different weapon chips also maxed and found I like other damage or affects chips better. As for the Mercury I have seen a number of them in champ play doing very well indeed depending on the situation (like all bots) IMO it is a option in champ play if done up and piloted correctly. Someone mind filing me in on the weapons chips? I may not be pairing my effects correctly. I have imitating rifle shooter, 2seeking cannons, and a minigun? Effects are knockdown, suppressor, acid and freezer This is depend on bot and weapon setup you want the drone for. If you have splash weapon like cryo or exodus then you want rocket shooter. I no know what effect is good with this because I use this setup with T2 freeze chip on 3x exo falcon and freeze help slow red down but never see snowflake fill up more than tiny tiny bit. Is really good if buddy also use cyro and no have enough rocket to fill snowflake because him trying to fight or brawl. Then you little freeze help him snowflake to fill up and kill enemy. This is best thinking sometime when plan you drone. Plan maybe to support effect from fellow blue. Cannon seem slow to fire but good damage per hit I think when pair with damage mitigation chip at least 20%. Acid chip also good with this setup I think because dot help with time between shooting. My beacon runner use drone with minigun shooter and many acid plus damage mitigation chip. To me is one of best drone fighter. The chip shoots fast and alot of firing. When this bot is my first drop last all match for fast beacon capping from all blue team? End of match this drone show almost 100k damage alone. To me this is very good for drone I think. After that I think the supressor and other effect chip go well with pulsar and eshotty like what everybody saying. So you must pair them chip with bot weapon then apply the drone shooter you think is better for the bot.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 25, 2021 8:47:31 GMT -5
Maybe it's because I'm also a foreigner, but I understood it lol. He's right though, on a technical and practical level. Thermonuke Specifically always nets a Direct return of investment. Last stand is neutral If it were a comparison between ODU and Last Stand a case could be made. But the damage from a Thermonuclear Reactor is simply not enough. Especially against all the bots with DR nowadays like Titans and Fenrirs. During the Titan phase of the game Last Stand lets you cap a crucial center or flank beacon while getting lit up by half the Red team. And in some cases paired with PS lets yoy get out alive. This is starting to sound like a desperate grasping of straws instead of a good argument against the financial advantage of TN over Last Stand. ODU is still highly conditional. Nevermind you have to manage incoming damage so you don't get killed while trying to stay in overdrive. Especially since now everyone is super focused on killing you when they see the ODU blinker is lit. And to say 10% more PER MOD isnt enough? Also... Corrosion. D.O.T. .. because I guess some people still never heard of it or how it bypasses damage resistance. I mean the guy showed a high lvl wasp sting tyr with 3 maxed TN and chips to boost 30% damage on a pushbutton. To not recognize that for the beast it is just wreaks of needing counseling lol.
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Post by santaclaus on Feb 25, 2021 8:55:48 GMT -5
I used Thermonuclear Reactor as an example because it's a premium module. And even if it's crap percentage, it is always on no matter what. Last stand is situational an in no way gives you control of the situation . It gives you control over the time of your death or possibly escape. That's it. Total control is lockdown. You didn't mention extra damage, someone else did, but they meant in the sense that you cam fire longer while invulnerable/vs dead. And I have always been pretty clear and explicitly stated my argument was for unmaxed Last Stand, specifically level 1. A level 1 Last Stand is trash, that's what I think. And the Armorer main point is exclusively on silver gained Vs silver spent regardless of "winning" I don't have numbers to crunch but I believe a maxed Thermonuclear Reactor definitely returns more than maxLS on the investment in terms of STRAIGHT SILVER. By your metrics a lvl 1 Thermonuclear Reactor is trash too. 5000Au for a 1% boost in damage? Last Stand offers something totally unique and completely broken to the game. Invulnerability while being able to shoot and cap beacons. You mention "being focused by everyone in your vicinity." You could technically get hit by 500 MK2 Gausses. You are INVULNERABLE. There have been so many times where Last Stand lets me reactivate my ability or get out of range in Ao Jun, Nightingale, Leech, Loki, the list goes on. And yes, winning matters a lot in terms of silver earned. At the height of Hawk stupidity, one would instantly take my Phantom from full hp to Last Stand with the beam. If I didn't have it I'd die and not cap center beacon or whatever. Of course it's trash. But its trash that's always on. Last Stand in only on once and over forever. Everything else you described is purely situational. It worked for you in those cheery picked moments. Maybe even consistently. But you will never be guaranteed a certainty of xyz. Thermonuclear is guaranteed always providing.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 25, 2021 9:04:28 GMT -5
No, I'm saying thermonuclear. Everything you're saying is absolutely conditional on PRIME CONDITIONS. Thernonukes only condition is fire your weapon. Tell me how great last stand is if you got locked down, have no weapons and crippled out the box. What "extra damage" is happening? Thermonuclear is 100% uptime UNTIL YOU DIE. to reiterate, I'm talking about level1LS. I used 3, THREE level 1 last stands and it was trash. I triggered the stand. Blinked, and died. You aren't trying to engage in a serious conversation about the utility of last stand by citing and instance of use of THREE LEVEL 1 last stand modules on 1 bot are you?
Because that's a foolish argument at best.
Really shouldn't have been used as anything in a serious conversation......
How is this serious when you guys no mention MONEY in you side of the talking? Serious conversation should no forget important detail like you side of this try hard to cover with blanket. We talking INVESTMENT and VALUE so what santa saying is most valid in true. You get mod and to max you going to spend 200 million. And now you multiply by 3. So BEFORE you grind to spend the money... lets consider which one will help you make the money to help get it max? What He say is 3 TN give 15% more damage right from open the box. If you still no see how serious is that maybe the foolishness is in talking with people who like wearing glasses with wood lens.
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Post by raidenii on Feb 25, 2021 9:13:57 GMT -5
Putting 3x Last Stand at L1 on a bot is not a good gauge on how effective it is. No one does that, it is as good as not using it at all. Every module has it's advantages and disadvantages. You can say that Thermonuclear Reactor is value for money because it is always on all the time, BUT, there were just too many instances whereby the Last Stand saves the day. Take for example, sometimes my Phantom while grabbing a beacon might get fired in all directions. It blinked away alive because of Last Stand. Guess what? My Phantom can easily go back to reasonable HP (mechanic skill) and fight again, that makes a big difference.
And dealing with Death Squads. With Last Stand, I can squeeze every ounce of fire power and be Top 1 or 2 in the match most of the time. Death Squads allows me to easily get top damage/robot kills and get that 10PT task easily accomplished. Quick 3 minute battles, good returns as well on silver/OXPs/Honor Points. Putting Last Stand and Thermonuclear together, best of both worlds. Choose what works for you.
**Note** No denying the fact that Thermonuclear at L6 , staked, will give additional 10% firepower for every unit you have.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 25, 2021 9:23:21 GMT -5
You aren't trying to engage in a serious conversation about the utility of last stand by citing and instance of use of THREE LEVEL 1 last stand modules on 1 bot are you?
Because that's a foolish argument at best.
Really shouldn't have been used as anything in a serious conversation......
Ya man....Last Stand at L1, I don't bother using it until it is at least L4. Really? And somebody said something about serious conversation about this thing? So 200 million BEFORE it's 'worth it'? Oooohhhh Kaye... I totally know whose opinions I'll be actually paying attention to from now on. Thanks for such an enlightening perspective:)
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Post by Deleted on Feb 25, 2021 9:35:28 GMT -5
Putting 3x Last Stand at L1 on a bot is not a good gauge on how effective it is. No one does that, it is as good as not using it at all. Every module has it's advantages and disadvantages. You can say that Thermonuclear Reactor is value for money because it is always on all the time, BUT, there were just too many instances whereby the Last Stand saves the day. Take for example, sometimes my Phantom while grabbing a beacon might get fired in all directions. It blinked away alive because of Last Stand. Guess what? My Phantom can easily go back to reasonable HP (mechanic skill) and fight again, that makes a big difference. And dealing with Death Squads. With Last Stand, I can squeeze every ounce of fire power and be Top 1 or 2 in the match most of the time. Death Squads allows me to easily get top damage/robot kills and get that 10PT task easily accomplished. Quick 3 minute battles, good returns as well on silver/OXPs/Honor Points. Putting Last Stand and Thermonuclear together, best of both worlds. Choose what works for you. **Note** No denying the fact that Thermonuclear at L6 , staked, will give additional 10% firepower for every unit you have. I think a major point you guys seem to consistently overlook is that 30% more damage output goes a Hella long way towards keeping you out of the 'need last stand to stay alive' zone. To me it's much more important to spend money on my soldiers and making them as strong as possible in destroying the enemy. Colin powell apply overwhelming force type. I don't think it's a good idea sending troops in with pea shooters even if their vests can protect them from a nuke blast. Just my opinion.
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Post by raidenii on Feb 25, 2021 9:38:57 GMT -5
Putting 3x Last Stand at L1 on a bot is not a good gauge on how effective it is. No one does that, it is as good as not using it at all. Every module has it's advantages and disadvantages. You can say that Thermonuclear Reactor is value for money because it is always on all the time, BUT, there were just too many instances whereby the Last Stand saves the day. Take for example, sometimes my Phantom while grabbing a beacon might get fired in all directions. It blinked away alive because of Last Stand. Guess what? My Phantom can easily go back to reasonable HP (mechanic skill) and fight again, that makes a big difference. And dealing with Death Squads. With Last Stand, I can squeeze every ounce of fire power and be Top 1 or 2 in the match most of the time. Death Squads allows me to easily get top damage/robot kills and get that 10PT task easily accomplished. Quick 3 minute battles, good returns as well on silver/OXPs/Honor Points. Putting Last Stand and Thermonuclear together, best of both worlds. Choose what works for you. **Note** No denying the fact that Thermonuclear at L6 , staked, will give additional 10% firepower for every unit you have. I think a major point you guys seem to consistently overlook is that 30% more damage output goes a Hella long way towards keeping you out of the 'need last stand to stay alive' zone. To me it's much more important to spend money on my soldiers and making them as strong as possible in destroying the enemy. Colin powell apply overwhelming force type. I don't think it's a good idea sending troops in with pea shooters even if their vests can protect them from a nuke blast. Just my opinion. Agree, that's why I am upgrading 2x Overdrive units (free again from events....he he he) and put them on my Taser Phantom. That gives a whooping 50% extra damage.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 25, 2021 9:40:11 GMT -5
I think a major point you guys seem to consistently overlook is that 30% more damage output goes a Hella long way towards keeping you out of the 'need last stand to stay alive' zone. To me it's much more important to spend money on my soldiers and making them as strong as possible in destroying the enemy. Colin powell apply overwhelming force type. I don't think it's a good idea sending troops in with pea shooters even if their vests can protect them from a nuke blast. Just my opinion. Agree, that's why I am upgrading 2x Overdrive units (free again from events....he he he) and put them on my Taser Phantom. That gives a whooping 50% extra damage. ouch lol
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Post by Deleted on Feb 25, 2021 9:49:41 GMT -5
Putting 3x Last Stand at L1 on a bot is not a good gauge on how effective it is. No one does that, it is as good as not using it at all. Every module has it's advantages and disadvantages. You can say that Thermonuclear Reactor is value for money because it is always on all the time, BUT, there were just too many instances whereby the Last Stand saves the day. Take for example, sometimes my Phantom while grabbing a beacon might get fired in all directions. It blinked away alive because of Last Stand. Guess what? My Phantom can easily go back to reasonable HP (mechanic skill) and fight again, that makes a big difference. And dealing with Death Squads. With Last Stand, I can squeeze every ounce of fire power and be Top 1 or 2 in the match most of the time. Death Squads allows me to easily get top damage/robot kills and get that 10PT task easily accomplished. Quick 3 minute battles, good returns as well on silver/OXPs/Honor Points. Putting Last Stand and Thermonuclear together, best of both worlds. Choose what works for you. **Note** No denying the fact that Thermonuclear at L6 , staked, will give additional 10% firepower for every unit you have. I think a major point you guys seem to consistently overlook is that 30% more damage output goes a Hella long way towards keeping you out of the 'need last stand to stay alive' zone. To me it's much more important to spend money on my soldiers and making them as strong as possible in destroying the enemy. Colin powell apply overwhelming force type. I don't think it's a good idea sending troops in with pea shooters even if their vests can protect them from a nuke blast. Just my opinion. Is why them NEED last stand so much. Is because them always going to NEED it. lol if them beef up them guns for fighting instead of dying maybe they understand why some feel no need for it. Until then you cant apply word to feeling of NEED. Can lead horse to water but cant make it drink
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Post by Loganspawn on Feb 25, 2021 10:31:53 GMT -5
I think a major point you guys seem to consistently overlook is that 30% more damage output goes a Hella long way towards keeping you out of the 'need last stand to stay alive' zone. To me it's much more important to spend money on my soldiers and making them as strong as possible in destroying the enemy. Colin powell apply overwhelming force type. I don't think it's a good idea sending troops in with pea shooters even if their vests can protect them from a nuke blast. Just my opinion. Is why them NEED last stand so much. Is because them always going to NEED it. lol if them beef up them guns for fighting instead of dying maybe they understand why some feel no need for it. Until then you cant apply word to feeling of NEED. Can lead horse to water but cant make it drink I think many forget there is a ton of difference between high level play and the rest. S clans wont even look at a guy without last stands on most bots. This is current as of right now and no FFA games. all games were solo or duo Dom and BR mode. Oh and a few drone shots thrown in. Believe it or not this is a dolphin hangar not a whale no more than a little entertainment money and smart use of resources and deals.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 25, 2021 11:03:20 GMT -5
I think a major point you guys seem to consistently overlook is that 30% more damage output goes a Hella long way towards keeping you out of the 'need last stand to stay alive' zone. To me it's much more important to spend money on my soldiers and making them as strong as possible in destroying the enemy. Colin powell apply overwhelming force type. I don't think it's a good idea sending troops in with pea shooters even if their vests can protect them from a nuke blast. Just my opinion. Agree, that's why I am upgrading 2x Overdrive units (free again from events....he he he) and put them on my Taser Phantom. That gives a whooping 50% extra damage. Ok now you're speaking my language lol
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Post by Deleted on Feb 25, 2021 11:05:32 GMT -5
Is why them NEED last stand so much. Is because them always going to NEED it. lol if them beef up them guns for fighting instead of dying maybe they understand why some feel no need for it. Until then you cant apply word to feeling of NEED. Can lead horse to water but cant make it drink I think many forget there is a ton of difference between high level play and the rest. S clans wont even look at a guy without last stands on most bots. This is current as of right now and no FFA games. all games were solo or duo Dom and BR mode. Oh and a few drone shots thrown in. Believe it or not this is a dolphin hangar not a whale no more than a little entertainment money and smart use of resources and deals. Looks like you missed the post about S clans. Apparently last stand doesn't mean as much to them as many like to think it does.
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Post by Loganspawn on Feb 25, 2021 11:09:39 GMT -5
I think many forget there is a ton of difference between high level play and the rest. S clans wont even look at a guy without last stands on most bots. This is current as of right now and no FFA games. all games were solo or duo Dom and BR mode. Oh and a few drone shots thrown in. Believe it or not this is a dolphin hangar not a whale no more than a little entertainment money and smart use of resources and deals. Looks like you missed the post about S clans. Apparently last stand doesn't mean as much to them as many like to think it does. Well seeing how I have been in the same one since they started the ranking and we are still standing I will take my own advice and ignore the others. I see many people come, spend to get to champ then fade away............
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Post by raidenii on Feb 25, 2021 11:29:30 GMT -5
Agree, that's why I am upgrading 2x Overdrive units (free again from events....he he he) and put them on my Taser Phantom. That gives a whooping 50% extra damage. Ok now you're speaking my language lol lol...but still, the last slot is still reserved for the Last Stand. I use what is free, if I was given a Thermonuclear, of course I would use it. I don't spend on this game anymore. Gold is not easy to accumulate, Silver is (at least for me).
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Post by Deleted on Feb 25, 2021 12:13:55 GMT -5
Looks like you missed the post about S clans. Apparently last stand doesn't mean as much to them as many like to think it does. Well seeing how I have been in the same one since they started the ranking and we are still standing I will take my own advice and ignore the others. I see many people come, spend to get to champ then fade away............ I can respect you position. At the same time in the top 1, 2 and number 3 clan I see many player no use Last Stand at all. Is why I ask them. I battle some of these guy every day same guys and the one you no see dark HP bar is the one break my tyr shield or knock down mi titan fast if no careful. The rest of them mi caan fight and win against them because I target all dark HP bar bot for knowing my damage is more. Easy to know exactly how much last stand them have by look at bar size. Easy to know how many shot to fire and relax to wait for corrosion to trigger them Last Stand. The kill shot is candy taking from baby next. Is joy to me killing them big money guy when mi no spend none. Is motivation for play and reason why the position for me will stay. In this game is like saying but more than million way to die. Everybody just arguing which grim reaper you saying no to. But one going to come take you bot to dance if you got last stand or TN or ODU or candy cane and marshmallow in you bot slot. Only question here is music you like dancing to before you go lol
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Post by Pilot #RG# on Feb 25, 2021 12:59:13 GMT -5
At the same time in the top 1, 2 and number 3 clan I see many player no use Last Stand at all. Is why I ask them. I battle some of these guy every day same guys and the one you no see dark HP bar is the one break my tyr shield or knock down mi titan fast if no careful. The rest of them mi caan fight and win against them because I target all dark HP bar bot for knowing my damage is more. Easy to know exactly how much last stand them have by look at bar size. Easy to know how many shot to fire and relax to wait for corrosion to trigger them Last Stand. some of these guy every day same guys and the one you no see dark HP bar is the one break my tyr shield or knock down mi titan fast if no careful. The rest of them mi caan fight and win against them because I target all dark HP bar bot for knowing my damage Can you list these top 1,2, 3 clans which intelligently don’t use last stand and you had your discussion with ? Last time I checked, all big clans almost use last stand. Unfortunately I can’t go and check clanwise data. I sampled the top 5 from legends league here for your knowledge. It’s no surprise, each and every bot uses last stand. Apart from that, below are module usage from the top clan members in legend league. I can’t collect all players data since I am lazy bum lol. But here’s a player from each of popular clans I noticed in legends league. SIN clan Sol clan Moon clan USSR clan Thai clan One clan Real clan God clan Vox clan
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Post by hi5 on Feb 25, 2021 13:33:09 GMT -5
At the same time in the top 1, 2 and number 3 clan I see many player no use Last Stand at all. Is why I ask them. I battle some of these guy every day same guys and the one you no see dark HP bar is the one break my tyr shield or knock down mi titan fast if no careful. The rest of them mi caan fight and win against them because I target all dark HP bar bot for knowing my damage is more. Easy to know exactly how much last stand them have by look at bar size. Easy to know how many shot to fire and relax to wait for corrosion to trigger them Last Stand. some of these guy every day same guys and the one you no see dark HP bar is the one break my tyr shield or knock down mi titan fast if no careful. The rest of them mi caan fight and win against them because I target all dark HP bar bot for knowing my damage Can you list these top 1,2, 3 clans which intelligently don’t use last stand and you had your discussion with ? Last time I checked, all big clans almost use last stand. Unfortunately I can’t go and check clanwise data. I sampled the top 5 from legends league here for your knowledge. It’s no surprise, each and every bot uses last stand I think someone stated @thearmorer is on steam, which is still a different MM pool and I assume different clans - but I didn’t see any confirmation of platform. I’m curious too about which clans are taking this path. This has been a lively and interesting thread, so kudos to OP. Sometimes things get heated but I much prefer these types of conversations on strategy. I agree with some of the things said about Last Stand being less effective on some bots or builds. I do still believe most Champions League players have Last Stand because lately I dip into M more so than the last few years and it’s very noticeable there are fewer Last Stand in M. Could be this is just carryover as Last Stand was always “the” module to have and there are more long timers in Champions League. But I also believe Last Stand is more effective at helping your team win, which IMO is the primary differentiator on silver winnings. A few years ago damage was king and Thermonuclear Reactor earned. Now it’s HP and damage is only one kpi for earning. My last note on investment value - Last Stand has never been nerfed, has no competition aka the balance mod, and never came out of my top 5 bots over the years. Easily the best 200M per mod I’ve expended in War Robots (notorious for wiping out resource investments with new gear and balancing). Can’t say the same for my 4 lv12 Griffs, 3 MK2 shocktrains, etc - even the regular damage mods I initially leveled when they released, all rusting in my inventory. Last Stand as they say is “still standing after all this time”.
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Post by Pilot #RG# on Feb 25, 2021 13:39:05 GMT -5
Can you list these top 1,2, 3 clans which intelligently don’t use last stand and you had your discussion with ? Last time I checked, all big clans almost use last stand. Unfortunately I can’t go and check clanwise data. I sampled the top 5 from legends league here for your knowledge. It’s no surprise, each and every bot uses last stand I think someone stated @thearmorer is on steam, which is still a different MM pool and I assume different clans - but I didn’t see any confirmation of platform. I’m curious too about which clans are taking this path. This has been a lively and interesting thread, so kudos to OP. Sometimes things get heated but I much prefer these types of conversations on strategy. I agree with some of the things said about Last Stand being less effective on some bots or builds. I do still believe most Champions League players have Last Stand because lately I dip into M more so than the last few years and it’s very noticeable there are fewer Last Stand in M. Could be this is just carryover as Last Stand was always “the” module to have and there are more long timers in Champions League. But I also believe Last Stand is more effective at helping your team win, which IMO is the primary differentiator on silver winnings. A few years ago damage was king and Thermonuclear Reactor earned. Now it’s HP and damage is only one kpi for earning. My last note on investment value - Last Stand has never been nerfed, has no competition aka the balance mod, and never came out of my top 5 bots over the years. Easily the best 200M per mod I’ve expended in War Robots (notorious for wiping out resource investments with new gear and balancing). Can’t say the same for my 4 lv12 Griffs, 3 MK2 shocktrains, etc - even the regular damage mods I initially leveled when they released, all rusting in my inventory. Last Stand as they say is “still standing after all this time”. You are right. I understand the difference in platforms, but almost every top clan in Android too uses last stand. Maybe steam doesn’t have any serious players like in mobile platforms. Then still I am curious to see which bots and modules steam top clans uses....
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Post by Garbage game on Feb 25, 2021 14:21:06 GMT -5
I think someone stated @thearmorer is on steam, which is still a different MM pool and I assume different clans - but I didn’t see any confirmation of platform. I’m curious too about which clans are taking this path. This has been a lively and interesting thread, so kudos to OP. Sometimes things get heated but I much prefer these types of conversations on strategy. I agree with some of the things said about Last Stand being less effective on some bots or builds. I do still believe most Champions League players have Last Stand because lately I dip into M more so than the last few years and it’s very noticeable there are fewer Last Stand in M. Could be this is just carryover as Last Stand was always “the” module to have and there are more long timers in Champions League. But I also believe Last Stand is more effective at helping your team win, which IMO is the primary differentiator on silver winnings. A few years ago damage was king and Thermonuclear Reactor earned. Now it’s HP and damage is only one kpi for earning. My last note on investment value - Last Stand has never been nerfed, has no competition aka the balance mod, and never came out of my top 5 bots over the years. Easily the best 200M per mod I’ve expended in War Robots (notorious for wiping out resource investments with new gear and balancing). Can’t say the same for my 4 lv12 Griffs, 3 MK2 shocktrains, etc - even the regular damage mods I initially leveled when they released, all rusting in my inventory. Last Stand as they say is “still standing after all this time”. You are right. I understand the difference in platforms, but almost every top clan in Android too uses last stand. Maybe steam doesn’t have any serious players like in mobile platforms. Then still I am curious to see which bots and modules steam top clans uses.... Steam playerbase is so small that once you hit Diamond you get matched against death squads. Also PC gamers in general are not kind to p2w mechanics so you get a weird subset of people in Steam War Robots. So I take their input with a box of salt. Maybe someone from Steam can enlighten us as to what their Legend League Ladder runs. Someone already posted iOS Legend League ladder so kudos to them
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Post by Loganspawn on Feb 25, 2021 14:32:29 GMT -5
You are right. I understand the difference in platforms, but almost every top clan in Android too uses last stand. Maybe steam doesn’t have any serious players like in mobile platforms. Then still I am curious to see which bots and modules steam top clans uses.... Steam playerbase is so small that once you hit Diamond you get matched against death squads. Also PC gamers in general are not kind to p2w mechanics so you get a weird subset of people in Steam War Robots. So I take their input with a box of salt. Maybe someone from Steam can enlighten us as to what their Legend League Ladder runs. Someone already posted iOS Legend League ladder so kudos to them A whole BOX of salt...... In my day it was a grain and they better be grateful for it.
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Post by santaclaus on Feb 25, 2021 14:36:57 GMT -5
You are right. I understand the difference in platforms, but almost every top clan in Android too uses last stand. Maybe steam doesn’t have any serious players like in mobile platforms. Then still I am curious to see which bots and modules steam top clans uses.... Steam playerbase is so small that once you hit Diamond you get matched against death squads. Also PC gamers in general are not kind to p2w mechanics so you get a weird subset of people in Steam War Robots. So I take their input with a box of salt. Maybe someone from Steam can enlighten us as to what their Legend League Ladder runs. Someone already posted iOS Legend League ladder so kudos to them Lol but actually. That's a fairly accurate description of PC players. I feel that. F2p I mean.
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Post by Thunderkiss on Feb 25, 2021 18:03:24 GMT -5
As you can see, there is ONE instance in the top 10 of random "anarchy" for players not using last stand. The robots that don't use it are VERY specific, and it's done for VERY specific reasons. Facebook is a smaller player base, but just as savage as any other platform. If you are a moron and aren't using it in top level play, well, you aren't going to do well at the top against the top players. I know all these guys, and their hangars mean 「fluffernutter」ing business. THEY mean business. They didn't show up to lose, they came to WIN. Their hangars show it. No level 1 Last Stand bull「dookie」.
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Post by Thunderkiss on Feb 25, 2021 18:08:25 GMT -5
You aren't trying to engage in a serious conversation about the utility of last stand by citing and instance of use of THREE LEVEL 1 last stand modules on 1 bot are you?
Because that's a foolish argument at best.
Really shouldn't have been used as anything in a serious conversation......
How is this serious when you guys no mention MONEY in you side of the talking? Serious conversation should no forget important detail like you side of this try hard to cover with blanket. We talking INVESTMENT and VALUE so what santa saying is most valid in true. You get mod and to max you going to spend 200 million. And now you multiply by 3. So BEFORE you grind to spend the money... lets consider which one will help you make the money to help get it max? What He say is 3 TN give 15% more damage right from open the box. If you still no see how serious is that maybe the foolishness is in talking with people who like wearing glasses with wood lens. Dude, WHAT are you talking about?!? Who said anything about money? take a mod then x3? for last stand? it's x5, we weren't discussing every mod on a bot, just Last Stand. Again, no one mentioned spending MONEY, not sure why you keep bringing it up. Then you compare 15% damage to last stand somehow. I'm seriously getting the impression that we aren't having the same discussion.
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Post by santaclaus on Feb 25, 2021 18:19:08 GMT -5
How is this serious when you guys no mention MONEY in you side of the talking? Serious conversation should no forget important detail like you side of this try hard to cover with blanket. We talking INVESTMENT and VALUE so what santa saying is most valid in true. You get mod and to max you going to spend 200 million. And now you multiply by 3. So BEFORE you grind to spend the money... lets consider which one will help you make the money to help get it max? What He say is 3 TN give 15% more damage right from open the box. If you still no see how serious is that maybe the foolishness is in talking with people who like wearing glasses with wood lens. Dude, WHAT are you talking about?!? Who said anything about money? take a mod then x3? for last stand? it's x5, we weren't discussing every mod on a bot, just Last Stand. Again, no one mentioned spending MONEY, not sure why you keep bringing it up. Then you compare 15% damage to last stand somehow. I'm seriously getting the impression that we aren't having the same discussion. Not to speak for him but I'm pretty sure he means money as a factor for upgrading said gear. IE, calculating REAL money into the "investment Vs return ". You don't know who spent cash. That's a factor in the argument that he (and Artemis) has been discussing since page 1. Investment Vs return.
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Post by Thunderkiss on Feb 25, 2021 19:02:59 GMT -5
Dude, WHAT are you talking about?!? Who said anything about money? take a mod then x3? for last stand? it's x5, we weren't discussing every mod on a bot, just Last Stand. Again, no one mentioned spending MONEY, not sure why you keep bringing it up. Then you compare 15% damage to last stand somehow. I'm seriously getting the impression that we aren't having the same discussion. Not to speak for him but I'm pretty sure he means money as a factor for upgrading said gear. IE, calculating REAL money into the "investment Vs return ". You don't know who spent cash. That's a factor in the argument that he (and Artemis) has been discussing since page 1. Investment Vs return. Ok, silver never entered my brain for that. If it's silver then fine. My bad.
Edit: now MY comprehension skills are disintegrating. Too tired. N/M
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