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Post by ѻﻭɼﻉ on Sept 9, 2020 16:59:56 GMT -5
EDIT: see Redfiends reply below. Excellent clarification of some misunderstanding I had about the upgrade process in Mech Arena
Just wanna make a case of why I’m mainly focussed on upgrading weapons. Now, it does depend on whether a particular mech can hold the type of weapons you want; if it can’t, then ranking that mech up a level becomes a priority. But, in general, the logic is the same as it is in War Robots - with lower level mechs you can be a bit more cautious in order to maintain combat longevity, but the higher your weapons the more effective you will be at damaging and destroying higher level mechs. So here is an example to make my case:
In one of my last matches, my MR6 Guardian was dropped to a sliver of health right out the gate by Longarms. With this literal sliver of health I proceeded to get Mvp with 13 kills and still didn’t even lose the Guardian by the end of the match.
I am currently in D2 and will be progressively facing stronger and stronger mechs, so upgrading weapons that can do strong work against opponents is a priority. There’s been a lot of great advice in this MA section for upgrading, and here’s my contribution - rather than evenly get mechs and weapons up together, with a few exceptions on mech upgrades for load out carry increase, top performing weapons as high as possible are priority
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Post by Redfiend on Sept 9, 2020 17:36:19 GMT -5
Actually, it's the opposite of War Robots. Bot health grows exponentially faster than weapon damage. Even if you upgrade weapons first, the AI is going to level you off against bots that are a full rank higher on both fronts.
Rank 4 Missile rack 8 compared to Rank 6 Missile rack 8? 5000 damage per cycle difference, for 14 levels and 2 rank ups.
Squishy bots shoot up to around 50K, Tanks around 80. From what I've seen from assorted disco screenshots, Missile Rack 8 taps out at around 20K per cycle. Juggernaut tops out around 92K, with 20K shield.
A more tangible example would be Rank 2 Plasma Cannon 6 to Rank 4 PlC 6. 9k at base, 10k at R3 base, 11k R4 base.
Bumping your weapons is just going to have you kill the fairer AI enough times, that they're going to feed you a boot for your trouble.
Get used to fighting smart, and engagements taking longer.
Youtubers are only OP because they only show their squad games(Lowbie friends dropping AI), and Tournament(Where AI is based on bracket before player power).
If you just focus on weapons you're going to be spending a ~long~ time being stuck at a plateau where everything else will outlast you by having 50% more ~health~ and only marginally higher damage.
That's the wall I'm at in D1. The enemy weapons o
do only marginally more damage than mine, but they all have 10-15k health advantage on me(which is about 50% more than my current health pools)
At rank ups, bots gain a significant chunk of health, while weapons get a buff to one of their underlying mechanics, with no damage increase.
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Post by ѻﻭɼﻉ on Sept 9, 2020 19:03:21 GMT -5
Redfiendthx for the clarification, very helpful
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Post by Redfiend on Sept 9, 2020 20:15:48 GMT -5
Redfiendthx for the clarification, very helpful Yea, the big bumps in weapon damage come from moving up to the higher cost energy weapons over the actual upgrade of the weapon itself. That's also attached to bot upgrades with the rank ups. Graduating from a 6 en cost weapon set to a 8 en cost weapon set is a bigger boost than any level on that 6 cost weapon is going to get through upgrades. The soft cap for individual weapon ceilings is 8. Rank 4 on bots is where Mediums hit 16 en cap and heavies hit 20, which is why I said Rank 4 is the equivalent of Y1-2 war robots "Gold Tier"(9/12-12/12), where power/health difference is noticeable against maxed bots, but not insurmountable. Heavy loadouts can't really be fully utilized until weapons are rank 6, as 10 cost weapons only give a second copy at that rank, so in ranks 4, you'll mainly be playing around with slightly oddball setups at or slightly better than what a max energy medium would be able to carry(18/20) The 10/12 cost weapons would be more of a priority when your Bots are Rank 5 and you want to give Panther/Guardian their gats. In terms of the upgrade importance for weapons, it's in the boosted functionality of weapons, like accuracy and Blast radius(Pulse/MR) and the second copy of Carbine 10/12, Stasis and Railgun. If I'm rambling, my apologies ? |
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Post by ѻﻭɼﻉ on Sept 9, 2020 22:10:58 GMT -5
Redfiend, naa, your input is valued. The system is a bit confusing tbh, a bit like trying to figure out drones lol, but you have given excellent clarification, it’s just a matter of me looking at the content and reading your posts together so it makes sense. I know it would surprise many to know I’m more a visual learner, considering I am often long winded
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Post by hicycles on Sept 10, 2020 2:43:48 GMT -5
Thanks for posting this. If I'm reading everything correctly, the best thing to do is to max your bot at a given rank (eg rank 3 level 7), then bring your weapons up. Once your bots and weapons are at rank 3 level 7, then rank everything to rank 4. This will make sure that you're maximizing your effectiveness against ai, as the tendency is for the ai to be a rank higher. If you pick up a weapon or bot at a rank higher than the rest of your hangar, you'll be in a world of hurt.
Does that sound about right?
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Post by Koalabear on Sept 10, 2020 7:43:14 GMT -5
I must be doing it backwards...but it works for me. I have certain fave weapons and my priority up to this point has been to upgrade mechs to the point it can carry those weapons and then move on to the next build I want to achieve. I did this with Killshot and Jug, and now I'm saving my resources for Shadow (if I can ever get enough blueprints for it that is).
I've been happy with Guardian using MR8, Ares with LS8, Panther with PC8 and Killshot with Jav6. My goal is to get my Shadow to the point it can use RPG6 or MR6 and then I'll be set and can then focus on a balanced upgrade plan. The only other mech I would love to get my greedy little hands on is the Zephyr. That thing is nasty! But, I figure it would be a beast to upgrade too, so I'm in no rush.
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Post by Redfiend on Sept 10, 2020 13:04:06 GMT -5
Thanks for posting this. If I'm reading everything correctly, the best thing to do is to max your bot at a given rank (eg rank 3 level 7), then bring your weapons up. Once your bots and weapons are at rank 3 level 7, then rank everything to rank 4. This will make sure that you're maximizing your effectiveness against ai, as the tendency is for the ai to be a rank higher. If you pick up a weapon or bot at a rank higher than the rest of your hangar, you'll be in a world of hurt. Does that sound about right? Yea. Same rank: Get everything within a rank to the max level for that rank. If you have weapons that you intend to bring to the next rank that aren't leveled up that far, catch them up before ranking everything up. Ex Rank 2: the first month of playing. Important items that start at rank 2: Panther Killshot Plasma Cannon 4/6 Long Arm 8/10 Items that start at rank 1 that should be brought to Rank 2 before progressing to rank 3 RPG 4/6 Thermal lance 4/6 Lancer Paragon Juggernaut. Once those are all at R2, lv7, then work on ranking them up to R3. After everything is brought up to R3, get all of the above to R3 lv7, then catch up by bringing the following items to that cieling: Pulse 6/8 Javelin 4/6 Guardian Ares Shadow Optional: Rocket Mortar 8/10/12 When that's ready,you're going to be spending quite a bit of time getting the coins for the rank ups. It's your choice whether you want to rank weapons or bots first(weapons are cheaper, but mechs get to carry bigger guns) This is also the point where you can buy the following if you didn't get them earlier, because they're a step up for mediums/heavies at Rank 4: Missile Rack 6/8 Stasis Beam 12/16 Then it's the long haul to get all of that to t4 lv 7, with the option to buy Cheetah and Zephyr when they become available. At rank 5, all bots have their maximum energy capacity, and you'll have plenty of weapons to cycle through to make use of that energy, this is the point where leveling up to get to the next, final rank, slows down considerably. Because of that, you won't need coins for Rank ups for a considerable amount of time, and can use them for Credits for upgrades and items you haven't acquired yet, or A-coin items you haven't acquired yet that are expensive, like Carbines/Railgun. |
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