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Post by Loganspawn on Oct 24, 2019 12:08:39 GMT -5
You do know theres is a better hover in the workshop. It has the same hp, about 3 times the amount of firepower and it has stealth, oh and its better looking. Oh and it flies faster... Im sorry you can be the best hover pilot but ill still laugh and slaugther you in a fight because its a hover with tarans lol. Its fun but its not a very good bot. I sold mine like 4 years ago. If you really wanna be useful hover run vortexes with aphids mk2 them and slap on shieldbreaker. Bull Dookie there were no hovers 4 years ago bwaaaa. Carry on.
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Post by ⓣⓡⓘⓒⓚⓨ48 on Oct 24, 2019 12:08:46 GMT -5
POLL: No, high ground is not OP. Useable and advantageous? Yes. OP, not at all. Random Remarks... I just threw mine back in the hangar I am using the most right now and am loving it.
It is extremely fun and while I haven't gotten my skills honed back to what they were before I shelved it, I have already had some great moments with it. Note, while I am not in Champs I face them often enough to say whether they can compete in non-top Champ Leagues, Solo matches. Yes they can, even against highly leveled hangars, and can still be used with great results. Once I get my Flying + Firing skills where I glide and shoot where I want to without thought again, I have no doubts it will be one of my stars. In fact, upgrade in progress to level 10, as of now.
Yes I have an Ao Jun and an AG:
At this point in the game, would rather play the Hover with the fun bots. So far, so good. It really is the king of the air as far as what you can do with it and where you can go. I agree completely about the high skill ceiling.
IMO, YMMV
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Post by reconnecting on Oct 24, 2019 12:17:30 GMT -5
1. Everybody sees you up there ! But they cant hit me very easily. See the beginning of this thread for one reason. Another thing is that when I get into a 1v1 with a red I can jump up, break any lock, advance a bit and land beyond him. Red is often confused for a moment, long enough to kill him. Hover is versatile and never as vulnerable as some think.
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Post by >bobby_digital< on Oct 24, 2019 13:22:16 GMT -5
This thread is making me want to pilot the ol’ hover...
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Post by Prowler on Oct 24, 2019 14:14:26 GMT -5
1. Everybody sees you up there ! But they cant hit me very easily. See the beginning of this thread for one reason. Another thing is that when I get into a 1v1 with a red I can jump up, break any lock, advance a bit and land beyond him. Red is often confused for a moment, long enough to kill him. Hover is versatile and never as vulnerable as some think. Spydra food !
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Post by reconnecting on Oct 24, 2019 14:21:42 GMT -5
But they cant hit me very easily. See the beginning of this thread for one reason. Another thing is that when I get into a 1v1 with a red I can jump up, break any lock, advance a bit and land beyond him. Red is often confused for a moment, long enough to kill him. Hover is versatile and never as vulnerable as some think. Spydra food ! Spydras are for sure pain in the asp bots. But before it can kill my Hover, I will have moved it to better cover. Or I could use his speedy glide over ground to make the rockets miss while homing in on that Spectre. Spydras are one of my favorite targets. ;-)
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Post by GuitarGuy on Oct 24, 2019 14:40:38 GMT -5
Its my opinion that taking High Ground (ie) the roof on Shenzhen is usually a bad move in general and makes you an easy target, further its hard to defend a beacon from up there. Once you get to Champ league your just cannon fodder if you try that tactic.
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Post by ⓣⓡⓘⓒⓚⓨ48 on Oct 24, 2019 15:25:27 GMT -5
Its my opinion that taking High Ground (ie) the roof on Shenzhen is usually a bad move in general and makes you an easy target, further its hard to defend a beacon from up there. Once you get to Champ league your just cannon fodder if you try that tactic. That's definitely a point... especially in higher league play.
On Dead City, Valley, and a few other places it can be good in certain situations to hold the high ground for an extended period of time. Personally I don't get into hidey wholes with mine and prefer to use high ground as either a defensive point or as a staging point for whatever I intend to do next.
Staying anywhere for too long in any bot is detrimental to any Beacon Mode, for the most part. TDM is a different story to a degree... but even there I want to be able to support a Blue and be supported by them as much as possible so I won't sit in a good spot if my peeps leave the area.
For me, this whole concept belongs with situational awareness... if wherever you are isn't either A.) directly supporting a push for a beacon or B.) allowing you to push a beacon yourself or C.) directly defending against a hard push against one of your beacons, I will reassess the situation and reposition.
IMO, YMMV
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Post by Joopiter on Oct 24, 2019 15:30:24 GMT -5
If they showed the hover some love then it could be.
Throw an extra 5 seconds of fuel in the tank, increase the forward speed by a 5-10 kph, and give it a 30% hitpoint buff... for heavens sakes it get's brutalized by everything using it's ability.
With scourges it's pretty powerful if you can stay alive long enough to use them. Make it a high ground perched tank.
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Post by kamikazejohnson on Oct 24, 2019 16:47:04 GMT -5
If they showed the hover some love then it could be. Throw an extra 5 seconds of fuel in the tank, increase the forward speed by a 5-10 kph, and give it a 30% hitpoint buff... for heavens sakes it get's brutalized by everything using it's ability. With scourges it's pretty powerful if you can stay alive long enough to use them. Make it a high ground perched tank. Just needs a Legendary Skin (+5% Durability) and a Legendary Pilot (+15 Defense Points in the air and +10% fuel recovery rate). Goes from Specialists Only to Near-Meta.
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Post by kamikazejohnson on Oct 24, 2019 16:48:54 GMT -5
Its my opinion that taking High Ground (ie) the roof on Shenzhen is usually a bad move in general and makes you an easy target, further its hard to defend a beacon from up there. Once you get to Champ league your just cannon fodder if you try that tactic. I like using my Hover to take out Hydra Spectres perched on the High Ground.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 24, 2019 18:51:24 GMT -5
Its my opinion that taking High Ground (ie) the roof on Shenzhen is usually a bad move in general and makes you an easy target, further its hard to defend a beacon from up there. Once you get to Champ league your just cannon fodder if you try that tactic. You do realize there is a beacon under the Blue building. Hover can drop down on either side of any reds hiding under there, and can out flank them. After capturing that beacon, then clear any reds marching towards CB. Then if there are no reds here or in CB, then that means all the reds are pushing the other side beacon (parking lot) or camped at home. So take the Hover and attack the back line. Hover worked as a great counter during the HB horde epidemic. Gives some automatic distance between their Shotties and you. Now way they can climb up and get closer. Free dmg, and their splash can't reach you leaving them totally useless. Same goes with Phantom. Gotta stay away from those shotties.
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Post by heavypiece on Oct 24, 2019 19:11:59 GMT -5
I enjoy playing with the Hover every now and again. The last few times it was with the Scorge - Spark load out. After reading this post I think I will put it back in play for a bit. This time with the Bird head Hussars and a Marquee. As to the comments about the Dragon Bots riding on rails and not being able to get as high as the Hover... That is just not the case. If you land on something higher then the spot you took off from, the next flight will take the bot to a higher altitude. If you have a flight plan you can get to the top spots on the map. It just takes a bit more effort to do so.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 24, 2019 19:17:31 GMT -5
Its my opinion that taking High Ground (ie) the roof on Shenzhen is usually a bad move in general and makes you an easy target, further its hard to defend a beacon from up there. Once you get to Champ league your just cannon fodder if you try that tactic. That's definitely a point... especially in higher league play.
On Dead City, Valley, and a few other places it can be good in certain situations to hold the high ground for an extended period of time. Personally I don't get into hidey wholes with mine and prefer to use high ground as either a defensive point or as a staging point for whatever I intend to do next.
Staying anywhere for too long in any bot is detrimental to any Beacon Mode, for the most part. TDM is a different story to a degree... but even there I want to be able to support a Blue and be supported by them as much as possible so I won't sit in a good spot if my peeps leave the area.
For me, this whole concept belongs with situational awareness... if wherever you are isn't either A.) directly supporting a push for a beacon or B.) allowing you to push a beacon yourself or C.) directly defending against a hard push against one of your beacons, I will reassess the situation and reposition.
IMO, YMMV
In champs, it's almost impossible to separate skill from the bot itself. That's why a lot of bots are deemed crap. My post is of the high ground, which is independent of the bot. They can try to nerf the Hover, or release a new better flying bot. But the fundamental properties of the high ground cannot be nerfed. They would have to redesign the whole game, and get rid of all the maps to make the high ground useless. That's why an old bot like the Hover has survived the ages, and my bulgasari, spec, and soon the ares and even the Ao Jun will be obsolete. All the meta bots rely on a gimmick. They can nerf it, or come out with a counter or green crack solution. Hover will remain consistently strong throughout the ages once you get good with it. Hover is also not a meta bot, so I don't see them nerfing it more. It's a high skill ceiling bot. So most players will do better playing meta bots. Yes, it requires a lot of situational awareness. But I didn't want to get into that or skill in my list. Think of the list as a top 5 reasons why your meta bot or past meta bots are going the way of the dodo, and why the high ground cannot be nerfed. Note i said why high ground cannot be nerfed, and not a specific bot like the Hover.
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Post by psychopsyd on Oct 24, 2019 23:26:37 GMT -5
DOOOOOODS!!!!
How's about not swingin your schlongs about....?
If you think a HOVER is an Ag sandwich....then kill them and be glad the pilot isn't in an Ao Jun.
If you think the HOVER is an Ag miner....then kill away. (And thank you for not piloting an Ao Jun.)
Having an opinion is one thing.... going all Neil Pert on Secretariat is another.
Ther will always be a pilot who excels with a specific bot that matches his play style...and most everyone else will get killed in it.
Strength of the HOVER....more firing angles, good ground/air speed, good weps, good durability....
Weaknesses..... exposure during flight, weps that do well from above don't do as well at ground level and vice/versa, steep learning curve.....
I tried one out and found I don't have the patience to learn how to pilot one...so I just kill them.... I've also been killed by them and didn't see where the shot came from till after my bot quit twitching.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 25, 2019 7:51:22 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Oct 25, 2019 10:28:21 GMT -5
Its my opinion that taking High Ground (ie) the roof on Shenzhen is usually a bad move in general and makes you an easy target, further its hard to defend a beacon from up there. Once you get to Champ league your just cannon fodder if you try that tactic. The amount of Champion league pilots (KAOS included) I’ve killed from high positions while Hover could over-fill all the virtual scrap yards in Pixonic’s servers. There is no bot that depends more on skill than Hover, and yes, higher positions make this bot very OP on a few maps, Shenzhen is one such, Castle (a few spots), Yam (also a few places), Dreadnaught, Valley. Rome, canyon, Springfield, Powerplant, Moon....not so much.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 25, 2019 10:32:33 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Oct 25, 2019 10:39:25 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Oct 25, 2019 10:53:31 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Oct 25, 2019 11:15:41 GMT -5
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Post by Lyte on Oct 25, 2019 11:23:56 GMT -5
Hmm?? Speedy glide? I've not heard of this before. How do you make a Hover glide? Thanks! Spydras are for sure pain in the asp bots. But before it can kill my Hover, I will have moved it to better cover. Or I could use his speedy glide over ground to make the rockets miss while homing in on that Spectre. Spydras are one of my favorite targets. ;-)
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Post by reconnecting on Oct 25, 2019 14:03:56 GMT -5
Hmm?? Speedy glide? I've not heard of this before. How do you make a Hover glide? Thanks! Spydras are for sure pain in the asp bots. But before it can kill my Hover, I will have moved it to better cover. Or I could use his speedy glide over ground to make the rockets miss while homing in on that Spectre. Spydras are one of my favorite targets. ;-) Start the Hover walking the direction you want to go. Barely tap the ability button, dont hold it. He will glide forward, keep just tapping enough to keep him off thegroung. Shazam! You're gliding! ;-) You can also walk Hover off a ledge and keep tapping the button to keep him gliding. Do NOT hold the button down.
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Post by Lyte on Oct 25, 2019 14:44:34 GMT -5
Saweet! Gonna try that! Thanks! Hmm?? Speedy glide? I've not heard of this before. How do you make a Hover glide? Thanks! Start the Hover walking the direction you want to go. Barely tap the ability button, dont hold it. He will glide forward, keep just tapping enough to keep him off thegroung. Shazam! You're gliding! ;-) You can also walk Hover off a ledge and keep tapping the button to keep him gliding. Do NOT hold the button down.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 25, 2019 18:28:45 GMT -5
Its my opinion that taking High Ground (ie) the roof on Shenzhen is usually a bad move in general and makes you an easy target, further its hard to defend a beacon from up there. Once you get to Champ league your just cannon fodder if you try that tactic. The amount of Champion league pilots (KAOS included) I’ve killed from high positions while Hover could over-fill all the virtual scrap yards in Pixonic’s servers. There is no bot that depends more on skill than Hover, and yes, higher positions make this bot very OP on a few maps, Shenzhen is one such, Castle (a few spots), Yam (also a few places), Dreadnaught, Valley. Rome, canyon, Springfield, Powerplant, Moon....not so much. PP and Moon are literal kill zones for the Hover. Moon automatically corrals red bots toward the center. Then stay on the outside of the map, or on your side of the fence. Pick off reds one at a time. It's also small enough that Hover can fly on right flank to left flank safely in 1 hop in the friendly skies (your side of map). There's so much cover, but it looks like too open a map at first. I thought so too, but it's really good map for Hover. Same with PP. There is so much cover and tight alleyways for reds to hide in, that the better angles you get with high ground is soo soo soo useful on this map, one of the best. The map is usually divided by that big powerplant in the middle, but that doesn't exist for the Hover. Use surprise to attack from any direction. Or fly the friendly skies to get across the map fast. The lack of cool downs for high ground should not be understated. Most bots like Ao Jun will lose the high ground once they drop down. Hover can stay up there as that is how I play it. That makes it stronger for alot longer. Also if i'm using roof as cover, that doesn't disappear after 5s like most shields. Can't get broken either unless you can start breaking stuff. Stealth doesn't disappear after 10s, so can hide for a long time but will be dependent on red's awareness. Very very strong high ground. I'm finding ways to play on SF and Canyon. They both are open, but have lots of different levels, riverbed, ground level, and plateau. Like i said, it's up to the player to use their creativity to discover new ways to play the maps. You got natural formations, bridges, buildings, etc. to play with. Rome is just a weird map. There's open areas, and city area with lots of cover but it's not that great for Hover to exploit.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 25, 2019 18:50:11 GMT -5
Hmm?? Speedy glide? I've not heard of this before. How do you make a Hover glide? Thanks! Start the Hover walking the direction you want to go. Barely tap the ability button, dont hold it. He will glide forward, keep just tapping enough to keep him off thegroung. Shazam! You're gliding! ;-) You can also walk Hover off a ledge and keep tapping the button to keep him gliding. Do NOT hold the button down. You can combine this with the takeoff trick from lottie rose. Trick will give a little more distance to jumps, but i haven't confirmed it with Hover in custom mode. I still try to do it all the time. There's probably way more tricks with the glide, but I haven't messed with it enough. There might be different ways to glide if you want max distance, or you want to build up speed. Think of a car if you want max economy for a long distance road trip, so you go easy on the gas. Or peeling out of a stoplight will use up fuel, but gives you more speed. Also, it's possible to get a mario kart boost when flying. But it's mostly accidental. I've also had Phantoms 「grape」 my birds, so it doesn't get the high ground. They push me to a wall and literally try to get inside me, so my take off is lower. I also gave someone the high ground to protect me. I saw a bot dropping off the edge on moon, and went right below it so it would land on my head. My weps and ability were on reload. I figured it can't attack me if it's standing on my head, and most land bots don't have a way to unstuck themselves if they get caught on smtg.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 25, 2019 19:19:18 GMT -5
The amount of Champion league pilots (KAOS included) I’ve killed from high positions while Hover could over-fill all the virtual scrap yards in Pixonic’s servers. There is no bot that depends more on skill than Hover, and yes, higher positions make this bot very OP on a few maps, Shenzhen is one such, Castle (a few spots), Yam (also a few places), Dreadnaught, Valley. Rome, canyon, Springfield, Powerplant, Moon....not so much. PP and Moon are literal kill zones for the Hover. Moon automatically corrals red bots toward the center. Then stay on the outside of the map, or on your side of the fence. Pick off reds one at a time. It's also small enough that Hover can fly on right flank to left flank safely in 1 hop in the friendly skies (your side of map). There's so much cover, but it looks like too open a map at first. I thought so too, but it's really good map for Hover. Same with PP. There is so much cover and tight alleyways for reds to hide in, that the better angles you get with high ground is soo soo soo useful on this map, one of the best. The map is usually divided by that big powerplant in the middle, but that doesn't exist for the Hover. Use surprise to attack from any direction. Or fly the friendly skies to get across the map fast. The lack of cool downs for high ground should not be understated. Most bots like Ao Jun will lose the high ground once they drop down. Hover can stay up there as that is how I play it. That makes it stronger for alot longer. Also if i'm using roof as cover, that doesn't disappear after 5s like most shields. Can't get broken either unless you can start breaking stuff. Stealth doesn't disappear after 10s, so can hide for a long time but will be dependent on red's awareness. Very very strong high ground. I'm finding ways to play on SF and Canyon. They both are open, but have lots of different levels, riverbed, ground level, and plateau. Like i said, it's up to the player to use their creativity to discover new ways to play the maps. You got natural formations, bridges, buildings, etc. to play with. Rome is just a weird map. There's open areas, and city area with lots of cover but it's not that great for Hover to exploit. Canyon and SF are not good for Hover, at all, which is the OP point, right? You may do well on those maps (against who tho??), i usually don’t, but anyway, I’ve earned a fair share of creds with the bot...I’ve meched pretty much everyone in whatever bot ranked in the top 100 Champions League for over a year. If there was another alpha Hover out there in champ iOS, I would have noticed by now. Moon and PP are not necessarily bad maps for Hover, but they are not great maps either, where you can exploit high positions. I’d do better on those maps running something else, but Hover can still be used with good effect. I think the difference in your context and my context is WHO we are meching with Hover. I’ve meched the best of the best, and started to take vids, stemming from a few doubters on these forum threads like a year or so ago. If your meching strong Champions League players with your Hover on moon or power plant, and they run in A or S clans, by all means, post vids. I’m not saying you can’t, but I’d like to see this to validate your claims. I know the hangars, players, squad with them etc of some of the game’s best, and I also understand where are how to beat them, and Also where I can’t. Hover is very strong against scrubs, that’s not what I’m talking about tho... Anyway, vids...
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Post by Deleted on Oct 25, 2019 22:49:49 GMT -5
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Post by Lyte on Oct 28, 2019 13:59:53 GMT -5
I'll have to try some of these tricks!
Yeah, I've noticed there's a lot of standing on heads lately. Maybe all heads should be removed so there's no chance of the head standers becoming OP.
Start the Hover walking the direction you want to go. Barely tap the ability button, dont hold it. He will glide forward, keep just tapping enough to keep him off thegroung. Shazam! You're gliding! ;-) You can also walk Hover off a ledge and keep tapping the button to keep him gliding. Do NOT hold the button down. You can combine this with the takeoff trick from lottie rose. Trick will give a little more distance to jumps, but i haven't confirmed it with Hover in custom mode. I still try to do it all the time. There's probably way more tricks with the glide, but I haven't messed with it enough. There might be different ways to glide if you want max distance, or you want to build up speed. Think of a car if you want max economy for a long distance road trip, so you go easy on the gas. Or peeling out of a stoplight will use up fuel, but gives you more speed. Also, it's possible to get a mario kart boost when flying. But it's mostly accidental. I've also had Phantoms ?grape? my birds, so it doesn't get the high ground. They push me to a wall and literally try to get inside me, so my take off is lower. I also gave someone the high ground to protect me. I saw a bot dropping off the edge on moon, and went right below it so it would land on my head. My weps and ability were on reload. I figured it can't attack me if it's standing on my head, and most land bots don't have a way to unstuck themselves if they get caught on smtg.
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Post by RightOn on Oct 28, 2019 21:10:38 GMT -5
Dead City, Shenzen, and Valley especially are Hover's dream. But all I do is sling aphex with it. It keeps me under even more cover and I can't even count how many Ao Jun's get pissed they can't fly that high. Dreadnaught is also killer too, you can fly from one side of the map to the other, right over the roof the whole way. Castle is one map I'd like to have more moments under that bridge (not the beacon on the one side of map, the hidden cove underneath the bridge above the ravine, there's 2 spots on either side, but the shadowy area is safest). I can actually still escape back above ground with some finesse.
That and trying to catch the ship we'll never catch on carrier...
I'll get a pic of what I'm talking about in Castle...
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