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Post by Ⅎ₹ѺC₭₩ELDEℲ₹ on Mar 6, 2017 10:59:13 GMT -5
This would also explain the huge differences in competition levels with IOS vs Android of equivalent league. The Android Gold div is equal to the Diamond/Experts on IOS...Players have a better control advantage. I'd actually be interested to know just what percentage of folks play this game on an emulator? Advantage be something upsetting to the mobile users? I played at first with a tablet...The controls were clunky and distracting compared to the traditional FPS set up...I would have to say quite a few in the silver and up leagues are Emulator...There are advanced maneuvers that can only be achieved by emulator, mouse keyboard/controller set ups. |
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Post by miatahead on Mar 6, 2017 14:07:57 GMT -5
I would agree that the differences in top tier play between platforms, emulator use is a big factor. In fact, I think it can be such an advantage that it is an exploit that should be eliminated.
For example, if I'm a treb user, it is so much easier to figure out how to shoot and if they are behind cover or not, on a 20" screen vs. a phone. Same with physical controls vs. virtual controls. Much easier to control. There is also the factor that Android has the capability to use game controllers, whereas iOS does not. Even if Pix decided to ban emulators (they won't), I don't know how they would ban controllers.
Regarding the use of Galahad, I'd be more interested in a correlation between average damage and Galahad than win rate. I would think platooning rather that a single bot, would correlate better with win rate.
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Post by Ⅎ₹ѺC₭₩ELDEℲ₹ on Mar 6, 2017 17:15:27 GMT -5
I would agree that the differences in top tier play between platforms, emulator use is a big factor. In fact, I think it can be such an advantage that it is an exploit that should be eliminated. For example, if I'm a treb user, it is so much easier to figure out how to shoot and if they are behind cover or not, on a 20" screen vs. a phone. Same with physical controls vs. virtual controls. Much easier to control. There is also the factor that Android has the capability to use game controllers, whereas iOS does not. Even if Pix decided to ban emulators (they won't), I don't know how they would ban controllers. Regarding the use of Galahad, I'd be more interested in a correlation between average damage and Galahad than win rate. I would think platooning rather that a single bot, would correlate better with win rate. Sorry, cant agree with you on it being an exploit...Any more then dude on his tablet has a bigger screen exploit than dude on his phone - ban the tablet!...The argument gets 「slow」 quickly...At any rate Pix could not ban emulators. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 6, 2017 17:25:01 GMT -5
miatahead there are wireless Bluetooth controllers for iPad, iPhone and iPod. And surely someone out there knows hows to get it to work with Apple TV. So you could possibly be playing on a 60" TV.
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Post by stygianumbra on Mar 6, 2017 18:46:01 GMT -5
This would also explain the huge differences in competition levels with IOS vs Android of equivalent league. The Android Gold div is equal to the Diamond/Experts on IOS...Players have a better control advantage. I'd actually be interested to know just what percentage of folks play this game on an emulator? Advantage be something upsetting to the mobile users? Or people like me who play with a controller, I can fire individual orkans to tap down that last bit of a carnages shield before spraying it, fire one orkan pod accurately around a corner, all that good stuff you d on an emu except instead of using keys and being limited in directional ability I can smoothly control my legs in any direction while doing the above. |
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RΛИDØM
Destrier
iOS - clan BMF
Posts: 91
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Post by RΛИDØM on Mar 6, 2017 22:06:46 GMT -5
There is a controller for iPhone called "GameVice" that claims to support the War Robots game. I haven't tried it so not sure if it is helpful. Apple isn't exactly known for gaming. Also not sure exactly which iPhones are compatible. Anyone tried it?
I suspect the memu emulator on the PC offers the best gameplay.
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Post by SuperHero on Mar 7, 2017 1:06:48 GMT -5
Ѕπλκε✵Σψεs uses a controller while playing on iOS. but some folks have complained of lag... That being said, perhaps this that requires another thread since it's off topic?
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Post by miatahead on Mar 7, 2017 13:02:42 GMT -5
Yes, there are controllers, my understanding is most, if not all lag or have performance issues, other than the Nvidia Shield. You can also get a Shield console which allows Android gaming on your TV with said controller.
I specifically did not bring up the tablet issue, as they can't (and shouldn't) restrict it and while I play on a tab, with a controller, I 100% believe that I do have an unfair advantage. I see it all the time when a guy in an RDB or Orkans hits me with only half his missiles and the others go both left and right. He can't control his shots. Same when a treb shoots my shield or hits the wall in front of me. On a phone, you can't see the detail.
Even on my tablet, I have a hard time seeing exactly what and where my target is with trebs or zeus. But when I plug my tablet into my 25" 16:9 monitor, I can tell exactly what 6 bots have dropped in the opposite spawn from the beginning and can even see what weapons they have. Again, IMHO an advantage with a larger screen.
Also, play on a PC with an emulator can allow exploits. I used to play Rage of Bahamut, which was a big money game, and in its early days, people were massively exploiting loopholes using Bluestacks. Eventually, they figured out how to ban it. I'm not saying War Robots can ban it or if exploits still exist, but PC play IS a competitive advantage, IMHO.
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Post by careyfan on Mar 7, 2017 13:43:37 GMT -5
'Work for what" is the question? I see a couple examples of guys setting up specifically to do damage at the expense of wins there, i.e. sitting back in Trebs or charging in rather than playing strategically. A strong unselfish player should be able to average well north of 50% in Champions soloing. If your goal is purely to accumulate championship points then that damage focused stratagy makes sense, but note that the guys around or below 50% are less mobile than the average with both more Lance and long range vs the guys with more wins. If you're willing to sacrifice wins that's a valid stratagy, but it's not one I support. I'd personally go for the high win rate model above. That blend of mobility and firepower is very close to what I've found to be most effective in all purpose play, both squadding and solo. Hi Pete, Long time lurker. I respect a lot of what you say in this forum. Your results and track record speak for themselves. That said, I think you've made some presumptuous statements. First, a strong, unselfish player may struggle to stay well north of 50% while soloing. I've seen plenty of evidence for this. One such player (who shall remain nameless) was well into the 90s and plays for EVIL, whom nobody would argue, is one of the very best clans in War Robots. Said player has been solo grinding, and was recently in the low 60s. Said player is an extremely strong player (I've played against him several times). But said player is clearly having challenges and is up against some pretty stiff competition while solo. There are clearly SOME examples of folks who are only going for damage on their quest to rise to the top of Legend League. But in general, I've found nearly all the matches in Champion bracket to be bitterly contested fights. In other words, people care about winning, and are not just sitting back camping hoping to pile up damage. As mentioned, there are some exceptions. But in general, solo grinders, even strong ones, may struggle to stay above 50%. Panja, for example, was a top 10-ranked player, and barely maintaining above 50%. He definitely cares about winning; I've seen him bitterly contesting center beacon on Yam, and not hanging out trying to pile up damage. If damage is all they care about, they wouldn't be putting bots like Ancilots (which as you know, lowers ones overall damage, but contributes to winning) in their hangars. Going for the "high win rate model," using a balanced hangar, is always desirable. But not realistic for some players. Running said "balanced hangar" makes perfect sense-- -when running with similarly minded players. But not every player has the name or clan recognition to just jump on and get a squad of top tier players to run with. So they play with hangars that give them a reasonable balance of good winning chances and good damage. I've very rarely found players who are solo warriors, maintaining win rates into the 70s. As such, I've learned NOT to judge a player's strength purely based on win %. It's an indicator, yes. But it doesn't correlate with playing strength very accurately for the solo warrior. One of your clanmates himself, Ol' Pappy, is a strong player...and is on record stating that he has difficulty hitting and maintaining a win percentage above 60. He's well known as a solo grinder (he likes the challenge...I respect that!). Were he to play with you, Spartan, Adriann and his other VOX teammates, I'm sure his win rate would easily reach 80s or higher. The challenge for the solo grinder is that while under normal circumstances he may win well over half of his games in a pure random vs. random scenario, in the other portion of he is up against against partial or full clans of top tier players, where no matter how strong he is, he basically cannot carry a team of randoms. And the further up the ranks he moves, the more competent the competition. So he may struggle to stay above 50%. I think a great experiment would be to have players from top tier clans like VOX, CDXX or EVIL take the "solo grind" challenge. Play only solo games for the next 50 games, and then see what your winning percentage is.  |
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Post by petevb on Mar 7, 2017 15:35:26 GMT -5
Hi Pete, Long time lurker. I respect a lot of what you say in this forum. Your results and track record speak for themselves. That said, I think you've made some presumptuous statements. First, a strong, unselfish player may struggle to stay well north of 50% while soloing. I've seen plenty of evidence for this. One such player (who shall remain nameless) was well into the 90s and plays for EVIL, whom nobody would argue, is one of the very best clans in War Robots. Said player has been solo grinding, and was recently in the low 60s. Said player is an extremely strong player (I've played against him several times). But said player is clearly having challenges and is up against some pretty stiff competition while solo. There are clearly SOME examples of folks who are only going for damage on their quest to rise to the top of Legend League. But in general, I've found nearly all the matches in Champion bracket to be bitterly contested fights. In other words, people care about winning, and are not just sitting back camping hoping to pile up damage. As mentioned, there are some exceptions. But in general, solo grinders, even strong ones, may struggle to stay above 50%. Panja, for example, was a top 10-ranked player, and barely maintaining above 50%. He definitely cares about winning; I've seen him bitterly contesting center beacon on Yam, and not hanging out trying to pile up damage. If damage is all they care about, they wouldn't be putting bots like Ancilots (which as you know, lowers ones overall damage, but contributes to winning) in their hangars. Going for the "high win rate model," using a balanced hangar, is always desirable. But not realistic for some players. Running said "balanced hangar" makes perfect sense-- -when running with similarly minded players. But not every player has the name or clan recognition to just jump on and get a squad of top tier players to run with. So they play with hangars that give them a reasonable balance of good winning chances and good damage. I've very rarely found players who are solo warriors, maintaining win rates into the 70s. As such, I've learned NOT to judge a player's strength purely based on win %. It's an indicator, yes. But it doesn't correlate with playing strength very accurately for the solo warrior. One of your clanmates himself, Ol' Pappy, is a strong player...and is on record stating that he has difficulty hitting and maintaining a win percentage above 60. He's well known as a solo grinder (he likes the challenge...I respect that!). Were he to play with you, Spartan, Adriann and his other VOX teammates, I'm sure his win rate would easily reach 80s or higher. The challenge for the solo grinder is that while under normal circumstances he may win well over half of his games in a pure random vs. random scenario, in the other portion of he is up against against partial or full clans of top tier players, where no matter how strong he is, he basically cannot carry a team of randoms. And the further up the ranks he moves, the more competent the competition. So he may struggle to stay above 50%. I think a great experiment would be to have players from top tier clans like VOX, CDXX or EVIL take the "solo grind" challenge. Play only solo games for the next 50 games, and then see what your winning percentage is. "Well north of 50%" is relative. Maybe better to call it somewhat above 50%- I just looked at my last 40 completely solo games and I've run 58%. That includes a lot of drop losses, including a match against a full squad where four of my teammates decided not to play. There is no question it's tough out there these days- hit a squad when you're running solo and you're still more likely than not going to lose. The previous point is also well made: 10 out of the top 11 above were from either EVIL or CDXX. They are running full squad and at least in many cases picking maps (avoiding range maps) so this will certainly skew the numbers. That said I still think their hangers are generally a good model. Consider: if I spawn in a Lancelot on Springfield I'm unlikely to be the one running for the farm or dam beacon. Instead I'll likely go straight at them, and I'm guaranteed to score damage in the process. But everyone can't do that or we'll lose the game. If you're solo running an all Lance hanger you're relying on a teammate to go do that, but if you're playing full squad someone's got to do it or you know you'll lose. Hence the squad hanger above still represent a good balance of mobility and ramming power because they're sharing the load of running and gunning. Back to your example, I have no doubt Panja fights for center tooth and nail on Yam. However with his hanger IMHO he pretty much has to: he's not going to get 3 lance into action without going directly to center. And while that strategy is going to do lots of damage it also means a lack of mobility and flexibility that can cost games. Thus you don't need to be sitting back in Trebs or Tridents all game with the beacon bar winding down to be going for damage over wins. I agree it's a matter of degrees, and everyone needs to find their own balance between damage and winning. My point was, and remains, that you should take care not to model off of particularly low win rate player (if you care about winning) because they are likely doing something wrong. And I still think that's true, though as you say it's very hard to tell how strong a payer truly is by win-rate these days. |
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Post by dms12008 on Mar 8, 2017 20:40:59 GMT -5
I just looked at my last 40 completely solo games and I've run 58%. That includes a lot of drop losses, including a match against a full squad where four of my teammates decided not to play. I see this all the time and I'm pretty sure it's 100% fallacy to say 'my win rate is 58% (eg) but it would have been higher if my team didn't quit' This is MEANINGLESS bc statistically, however many times u had matches where a teammate quit, u had that many matches where reds quit. Lol GOD IF ONLY THESE PEOPLE WOULD STOP INTENTIONALLY JOINING MY TEAM JUST TO QUIT SO THEY CAN PUSH MY WIN% DOWN. SUCH BS. THEY NEVER QUIT WHEN THEY'RE ON THE RED TEAM  |
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Post by SATmaster728 on Mar 9, 2017 13:28:22 GMT -5
I'm surprised at the number of Griffins. As a silver-bot, Pix could make some money if it was necessary to replace Griffins with a gold bot. Oh, wait... shhhhhh! don't let them hear you! I don't want a 5000 au priced griffin! |
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