Pateras
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Post by Pateras on Mar 3, 2017 16:20:07 GMT -5
I have noticed that when you play solo you really need to be on top of your game and dominate to earn points or less your gonna lose more then you earn. Do you guys think that you lose to much point when you lose compared to winning or is it perfect as is? |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 3, 2017 16:23:32 GMT -5
I tell you something, have a bad team and a bad game and your down 20. Kinda sucks. Then you win a few and you only gained 15?
Yeah a little wack-a-doodle in my books.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 3, 2017 16:25:44 GMT -5
I think my experience is counter to the overall forum, but I find great matchups when i play solo for the most part in the new system. Very even hangar levels to mine. I run 8/8-9 bots, and my comp is usually anywhere from 7/7's to 9/10's. I have not run into all of the beacon ignoring that others are seeing either.
When i squad in clans, most of my clan outguns me, so that's when i take the beatdowns for finishing low on damage.
Just my observations. I do wish everyone was getting the level matchups that I get.
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Post by Trogon on Mar 3, 2017 16:43:49 GMT -5
Yes, I've noticed the same thing. Having the points gained/lost be static instead of calculated based on specifics of the match outcome is very frustrating. I think top on the losing team should not earn anything, and maybe lose a little. As it is now, it is a disincentive to trying to win at all costs. Also, if a loss is very close with everyone playing strong, you could score close to the same as the top scorer in a loss and come in 6th - they get +7, you get -20. Definitely messed up.
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Pateras
Destrier
Posts: 122
Karma: 34
Pilot name: Pateras
Platform: Android
League: Diamond
Server Region: Europe
Favorite robot: Ancilot
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Post by Pateras on Mar 3, 2017 16:49:59 GMT -5
Yes, I've noticed the same thing. Having the points gained/lost be static instead of calculated based on specifics of the match outcome is very frustrating. I think top on the losing team should not earn anything, and maybe lose a little. As it is now, it is a disincentive to trying to win at all costs. Also, if a loss is very close with everyone playing strong, you could score close to the same as the top scorer in a loss and come in 6th - they get +7, you get -20. Definitely messed up. Totally agree it should be 20, 13, 7, 7, 7, 4 for winning and 0 , -4, -7, -7, -7, -13 for losing or something like that so you wont get anything for losing if your on the top but wont lose to much point for being on the bottom. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 3, 2017 16:53:24 GMT -5
Yes, I've noticed the same thing. Having the points gained/lost be static instead of calculated based on specifics of the match outcome is very frustrating. I think top on the losing team should not earn anything, and maybe lose a little. As it is now, it is a disincentive to trying to win at all costs. Also, if a loss is very close with everyone playing strong, you could score close to the same as the top scorer in a loss and come in 6th - they get +7, you get -20. Definitely messed up. Totally agree it should be 20, 13, 7, 7, 7, 4 for winning and 0 , -4, -7, -7, -7, -13 for losing or something like that so you wont get anything for losing if your on the top but wont lose to much point for being on the bottom. The point totals in the current system match each other, +39, and -39. If the award amounts are changed, I suspect Pix would still need them to balance out. Everyone keeps taking the -20's personal. It's not that bad of a thing. |
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Pateras
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Posts: 122
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Pilot name: Pateras
Platform: Android
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Post by Pateras on Mar 3, 2017 16:57:37 GMT -5
Totally agree it should be 20, 13, 7, 7, 7, 4 for winning and 0 , -4, -7, -7, -7, -13 for losing or something like that so you wont get anything for losing if your on the top but wont lose to much point for being on the bottom. The point totals in the current system match each other, +39, and -39. If the award amounts are changed, I suspect Pix would still need them to balance out. Everyone keeps taking the -20's personal. It's not that bad of a thing. I think that geting 13 for being on top of the winning team and geting -20 on the losing team is bit off and if your unlucky you get paird with total noobs and lose way to much point compared to winning. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 3, 2017 17:04:57 GMT -5
@heavypanda yes it is bad, it hurts so bad.?
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Post by Trogon on Mar 3, 2017 17:06:59 GMT -5
Totally agree it should be 20, 13, 7, 7, 7, 4 for winning and 0 , -4, -7, -7, -7, -13 for losing or something like that so you wont get anything for losing if your on the top but wont lose to much point for being on the bottom. The point totals in the current system match each other, +39, and -39. If the award amounts are changed, I suspect Pix would still need them to balance out. Everyone keeps taking the -20's personal. It's not that bad of a thing. I'm not taking it personally, but because of the new MM and the tankers clubbing their way back up, I can win 3 or 4 games placing in the middle with good competition, and then get pulled into a master/champion battle where I place 6th on the losing team because my weapons can't keep up, and on one loss, I lose all the league point gains I just got from my wins. It's not personal, but it's still poo-poo. |
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Pateras
Destrier
Posts: 122
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Pilot name: Pateras
Platform: Android
League: Diamond
Server Region: Europe
Favorite robot: Ancilot
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Post by Pateras on Mar 3, 2017 17:08:43 GMT -5
The point totals in the current system match each other, +39, and -39. If the award amounts are changed, I suspect Pix would still need them to balance out. Everyone keeps taking the -20's personal. It's not that bad of a thing. I'm not taking it personally, but because of the new MM and the tankers clubbing their way back up, I can win a few games placing in the middle with good competition, and then get pulled into a master/champion battle where I place 6th on the losing team because my weapons can't keep up, and lose all the gains I just got from my wins. It's not personal, but it's still poo-poo. I dont take it personal but as for now i think the points system is a bit backwards. |
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Post by Team Alpha Strike on Mar 3, 2017 17:22:31 GMT -5
Totally agree it should be 20, 13, 7, 7, 7, 4 for winning and 0 , -4, -7, -7, -7, -13 for losing or something like that so you wont get anything for losing if your on the top but wont lose to much point for being on the bottom. The point totals in the current system match each other, +39, and -39. If the award amounts are changed, I suspect Pix would still need them to balance out. Everyone keeps taking the -20's personal. It's not that bad of a thing. Minus 20 is huge when you get it on matches you have not even played. I've gotten at least 5 of these "Return to Hangar" non-matches where it appears the match is on, but I can't get in. That's minus 100 points I had to make up --- which I did, but it is a royal pain. Ive also been in matches where it is clear that there is a server problem because other pilots on both sides are statues and the final damage scores show it all around. This screws the bottom 2 on the loser's side too much and the -20 is too much of a penalty for something you can't control. |
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Pateras
Destrier
Posts: 122
Karma: 34
Pilot name: Pateras
Platform: Android
League: Diamond
Server Region: Europe
Favorite robot: Ancilot
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Post by Pateras on Mar 3, 2017 17:24:36 GMT -5
The point totals in the current system match each other, +39, and -39. If the award amounts are changed, I suspect Pix would still need them to balance out. Everyone keeps taking the -20's personal. It's not that bad of a thing. Minus 20 is huge when you get it on matches you have not even played. I've gotten at least 5 of these "Return to Hangar" non-matches where it appears the match is on, but I can't get in. That's minus 100 points I had to make up --- which I did, but it is a royal pain. Ive also been in matches where it is clear that there is a server problem because other pilots on both sides are statues and the final damage scores show it all around. This screws the bottom 2 on the loser's side too much and the -20 is too much of a penalty for something you can't control. Yeah totally agree happened to me twice. |
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Post by ⓣⓡⓘⓒⓚⓨ48 on Mar 3, 2017 17:27:40 GMT -5
I think my experience is counter to the overall forum, but I find great matchups when i play solo for the most part in the new system. Very even hangar levels to mine. I run 8/8-9 bots, and my comp is usually anywhere from 7/7's to 9/10's. I have not run into all of the beacon ignoring that others are seeing either. When i squad in clans, most of my clan outguns me, so that's when i take the beatdowns for finishing low on damage. Just my observations. I do wish everyone was getting the level matchups that I get. This is exactly my experience, to a tee... I have mostly 8/9 hangar, as well. |
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Post by SlowReflexes on Mar 3, 2017 17:36:27 GMT -5
I keep slowly gaining league points, *and I'm trying not to*.
If you find that you cannot get any higher, perhaps that's where MM thinks you belong.
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Post by Thumpmonkey1 on Mar 3, 2017 17:46:10 GMT -5
I guess I don't get the hubub...
If you finish last in damage on a losing team, you really didn't do much. Obviously you might have grabbed a bunch of beacons and I'm all for beacons being taken into account, but if you place there often you probably don't belong in that league.
I hear lots of people complain that they face too stiff competition for their hangars, and I hear people complain they are penalized for #6 too much... Isn't the second just the game working to fix the first more quickly?
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Pateras
Destrier
Posts: 122
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Pilot name: Pateras
Platform: Android
League: Diamond
Server Region: Europe
Favorite robot: Ancilot
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Post by Pateras on Mar 3, 2017 17:57:46 GMT -5
I guess I don't get the hubub... If you finish last in damage on a losing team, you really didn't do much. Obviously you might have grabbed a bunch of beacons and I'm all for beacons being taken into account, but if you place there often you probably don't belong in that league. I hear lots of people complain that they face too stiff competition for their hangars, and I hear people complain they are penalized for #6 too much... Isn't the second just the game working to fix the first more quickly? You can get disconnected and lose alot of point that way, no matter how good you are. |
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Post by HEATHEN HERETIC on Mar 3, 2017 18:00:13 GMT -5
Totally agree it should be 20, 13, 7, 7, 7, 4 for winning and 0 , -4, -7, -7, -7, -13 for losing or something like that so you wont get anything for losing if your on the top but wont lose to much point for being on the bottom. The point totals in the current system match each other, +39, and -39. If the award amounts are changed, I suspect Pix would still need them to balance out. Everyone keeps taking the -20's personal. It's not that bad of a thing. I beg to differ on that last point. Managed to get into bronze a few times only to be paired with morons, idiots and fools repeatedly who just wanted to shoot'em up instead of obtaining the objectives. Time runs out very quickly when the opposing team takes 4 or all the beacons. So there I stand at the end of a match in my light or medium bot with cold weapons and 5-6 beacons under my belt but a big fat -20 in the scoring because we lost. I've had this happen multiple times. It's not fun trying to scale the rankings in such conditions. As the OP stated, one step forward, two steps back. I just gave up on the rankings and ignore it now. I don't enjoy being frustrated but I do like just playing the game. Maybe when I get all my equipment to 10s & 12s I'll be ranked a bit higher than private when I too can stomp lower leveled bots to death in seconds. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 3, 2017 18:01:53 GMT -5
Trogon and Pateras , I was not trying to be insensitive, and I didn't mean that you were taking the 20's personally. My point though is that 8 of 12 guys get positive points. Only 4 dudes lose points in each game. If you started monkeying with point totals and upping the rewards for winning and lowering the negatives, the end result would be all of us (literally: ALL OF US) qualifying for Champions league within 60-90 days from now. That's not how the leagues are supposed to work. Yes, it hurts to lose 20. Yes, sometimes it's not your fault. And yes, it is fun to progress forward. But in a game where upgrading gear from level 9 to level 10 takes 2-3 months, I would expect the time it takes to climb the leagues to take some real time and effort as well. A league bracket is only 200 points wide. You can cross it in a day with the right hangar and some luck. Any faster, and we may as well not even have leagues. Cheers mates.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 3, 2017 18:06:21 GMT -5
I guess I don't get the hubub... If you finish last in damage on a losing team, you really didn't do much. Obviously you might have grabbed a bunch of beacons and I'm all for beacons being taken into account, but if you place there often you probably don't belong in that league. I hear lots of people complain that they face too stiff competition for their hangars, and I hear people complain they are penalized for #6 too much... Isn't the second just the game working to fix the first more quickly? Not always true, sometimes no matter how hard you try, it just doesn't work out. I sincerely doubt that my Galahad and 4 heavies could ever be considered beacon cappers. You know the old saying, poo poo happens. I have also scored 7 kills 700k plus damage 2 or 3 beacons and be last on a losing team. |
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Post by HEATHEN HERETIC on Mar 3, 2017 18:17:27 GMT -5
I guess I don't get the hubub... If you finish last in damage on a losing team, you really didn't do much. Obviously you might have grabbed a bunch of beacons and I'm all for beacons being taken into account, but if you place there often you probably don't belong in that league. I hear lots of people complain that they face too stiff competition for their hangars, and I hear people complain they are penalized for #6 too much... Isn't the second just the game working to fix the first more quickly? Not always true, sometimes no matter how hard you try, it just doesn't work out. I sincerely doubt that my Galahad and 4 heavies could ever be considered beacon cappers. You know the old saying, poo poo happens. I have also scored 7 kills 700k plus damage 2 or 3 beacons and be last on a losing team. Holy ?!! |
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Post by CΛΜΡΞΓ™ on Mar 3, 2017 18:20:41 GMT -5
I guess I don't get the hubub... If you finish last in damage on a losing team, you really didn't do much. Obviously you might have grabbed a bunch of beacons and I'm all for beacons being taken into account, but if you place there often you probably don't belong in that league. I hear lots of people complain that they face too stiff competition for their hangars, and I hear people complain they are penalized for #6 too much... Isn't the second just the game working to fix the first more quickly? Not always true, sometimes no matter how hard you try, it just doesn't work out. I sincerely doubt that my Galahad and 4 heavies could ever be considered beacon cappers. You know the old saying, poo poo happens. I have also scored 7 kills 700k plus damage 2 or 3 beacons and be last on a losing team. sounds like you've been placed in the wrong league to me, god damn that's rough.. The only time im on the decline in league points is when i play with friends that are 2-3 leagues above me  |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 3, 2017 18:21:32 GMT -5
I have also scored 7 kills 700k plus damage 2 or 3 beacons and be last on a losing team. If I were dropped into matches where 7 kills and 700k+ damage was the 12th best output, I would welcome the -20. Just sayin' |
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Post by [apotheosis] on Mar 3, 2017 18:23:17 GMT -5
I am only in silver 2, so my thoughts may be largely irrelevant.
Every game nets me AG and experience. Not ezperience points, but time spent piloting in varying scenarios. I consider that getting ahead at least long term.
I could care less what tier I am in, and what cups I win or lose, I take something from every battle and mostly have good match up.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 3, 2017 18:35:55 GMT -5
CΛΜΡΞΓ™ seems like I have been stuck playing a bunch of people in the Masters league lately 1 to 3 levels higher than me. Definitely not complaining, some of the best fights I have had for a while, and learning a lot from them. Hangar setup's, some new styles and tactics. Haven't moved up much, but haven't dropped to much either. I think it is making me a better player. When I saw those stats and the loss, it stung a little bit, till I checked who I was playing against and that took the sting away. I will get there.
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Post by amidf on Mar 3, 2017 18:43:28 GMT -5
If you have been placed in the right league, it should be very hard to move up. The only reasons you would get net progress (ignoring the necessary ups and downs from the random part of match placement) is if you are consistently playing better (experience) or if you are using gradually better equipment from upgrades.
It's a zero sum game. As others have pointed out, every match ends with 0 total league points awarded. If you are well placed, you'll be earning 0 on average too. It just happens in fits and starts.
Sometimes you get -20 due to a disconnect. Sometimes you place one higher because someone else disconnected. If you disconnect more frequently than average (accidental tanking) you should have an easier time on average winning points when your connection is good.
Get it?
-Amid
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Post by HEATHEN HERETIC on Mar 3, 2017 18:49:53 GMT -5
At Old man
Yeah, once you just forget about the league stuff and just play your game you can concentrate on just fighting and piloting your bot. Win or lose you learn something that will help next time and further on. Enjoy the game and not the drama.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 3, 2017 18:57:47 GMT -5
amidf no I don't get it. I play on a high speed fiber optic network from home with the newest equipment available on an iPad for iOS. Haven't had a disconnect in over a year. Granted I'm only Expert League I and equipment is constantly being upgraded, well as fast as time allows at my level. Which is a combination of days and hours plus large amounts of silver. And am moving up in Android from where initially placed only 21 from popping to next level. So no I don't get it.
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Post by The VVatcher on Mar 3, 2017 19:01:12 GMT -5
All I do now is solo because I'm 3 to 4 sub-leagues above my clanmates.
It's a slow climb but it makes sense unless you want to rush into fighting against max level bots. Your stuff needs time to upgrade as you move up.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 3, 2017 19:04:51 GMT -5
"@" + "dangit" = dangitThat way it notifies him you responded. No snark at all here, just pointing this out, as it took me a little while to learn it too  |
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Post by SlowReflexes on Mar 3, 2017 19:12:59 GMT -5
CΛΜΡΞΓ™ seems like I have been stuck playing a bunch of people in the Masters league lately 1 to 3 levels higher than me. Definitely not complaining, some of the best fights I have had for a while, and learning a lot from them. Hangar setup's, some new styles and tactics. Haven't moved up much, but haven't dropped to much either. I think it is making me a better player. When I saw those stats and the loss, it stung a little bit, till I checked who I was playing against and that took the sting away. I will get there. My winning % is too high. Currently 62. So, I've been getting some nasty matches.  Like this one. Most of the match I was getting my ?bum-bum? handed to me, though I did contribute a few nifty bits. Turns out, each team had 1 guy from Expert, 3 from Diamond and 2 from Gold. I'm from Gold, I was one of the schmucks. I won. Got gold and league points, despite being outclassed. My league is tough enough, playing guys multiple leagues above me is rough. I play a lighter than optimal hangar, so as to *not* climb in leagues too quickly. My league point total, even with MM trying to punish a high win % ,is still going up. My point - if you feel you're not getting all the league points you 'deserve', you are almost certainly wrong. In addition, if you are deliberately trying to climb leagues, and *failing*, you're doing something seriously wrong. Tactically, philosophically, spiritually, I have no idea, but somewhere you are in terrible error. |
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