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Post by creepshow on Nov 21, 2017 20:36:49 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Nov 21, 2017 20:45:04 GMT -5
Link comes back to here :/
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Post by ᎶƦ℮℮ƊᎽ ƤΛƝƊΛ on Nov 21, 2017 20:45:25 GMT -5
Your link is to this thread. I guess that's one way to make it look like you have a source! Lol
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Post by creepshow on Nov 21, 2017 20:47:02 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Nov 21, 2017 20:54:15 GMT -5
Interesting development. It would be nice if the EU follow through with it, but I guess it depends on who pays them more.
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Post by ogpondskum on Nov 21, 2017 20:59:33 GMT -5
This will be an interesting topic to watch as it plays out in the EU.
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Post by creepshow on Nov 21, 2017 21:00:40 GMT -5
Interesting development. It would be nice if the EU follow through with it, but I guess it depends on who pays them more. my guess would be that if they don't get banned through legislation, it will end up in court and be banned there. Precedent means other countries will start to follow suit, especially in EU where many regulatory authorities are shared between countries |
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Post by hon_shu on Nov 21, 2017 21:41:40 GMT -5
So I guess gambling is considered gambling, too? Awesome, no more black market and Casino Royal then.
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Post by T34 on Nov 21, 2017 21:53:10 GMT -5
good development. more focus will need to go into the game on the developer's end rather than focusing on how to fleece people's addictions/deep pockets.
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Post by anjian on Nov 21, 2017 22:59:31 GMT -5
Hawaii has also considered EA's loot boxes gambling.
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Post by T34 on Nov 21, 2017 23:15:33 GMT -5
Hawaii has also considered EA's loot boxes gambling. This is just as big as the Belgian development. Once the EU and US go down the same path many others will follow. |
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Post by darthbobafett on Nov 21, 2017 23:55:49 GMT -5
Hawaii has also considered EA's loot boxes gambling. This is just as big as the Belgian development. Once the EU and US go down the same path many others will follow. Notice how he says "Its a trap!" That Star Wars reference had to be intentional. |
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Post by ezekielcrow on Nov 22, 2017 0:00:59 GMT -5
good development. more focus will need to go into the game on the developer's end rather than focusing on how to fleece people's addictions/deep pockets. And game prices will go up unless other better earning models can be adopted. |
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Post by T34 on Nov 22, 2017 0:11:25 GMT -5
This is just as big as the Belgian development. Once the EU and US go down the same path many others will follow. Notice how he says "Its a trap!" That Star Wars reference had to be intentional. yes and also the words predatory and all that stuff. These exploitative game developers are scum. |
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Post by T34 on Nov 22, 2017 0:25:25 GMT -5
good development. more focus will need to go into the game on the developer's end rather than focusing on how to fleece people's addictions/deep pockets. And game prices will go up unless other better earning models can be adopted. No they wont. You are looking at it the wrong way. The game in a P2W form was there to support the exploitative mechanism. the exploitative mechanism was never there to support the game. They are milking those with deep pockets and the addicts via this mechanism.
These mechanisms open up an additional revenue stream that relies on gambling and not gaming. it also allows them to over price gear and hedge their bets on people's gambling inclinations. If this stuff goes through fortunately the developers will need to concentrate on how to make the game better instead of developing additional exploitative mechanisms to keep themselves afloat. How long for the gareth speed bug to be fixed? The kumiho still stumbles? is the targeting mechanism working well? ................ but the Royale spins well :-)
If the game does not get better and folds, so be it. if it gets better I can assure you it wont be via P2W and gambling mechanisms.
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Post by amidf on Nov 22, 2017 0:33:29 GMT -5
On mobile I can't see your original post, but I found malformed html addresses redirect back to the original post. In my case, after an iOS update "Smart Punctuation" was turned on, which meant "smart" curly quote characters were substituted for straight quotes in the html code I typed. I turned it off and am back to dumb punctuation that works. |
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Post by danny on Nov 22, 2017 1:03:23 GMT -5
This OP and this whole thread makes me very, very happy. I shall use my monthly gaming allowance to buy Belgian chocolate. Yummy! GuyLian. Double yummy!! |
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Post by ΜØØSE on Nov 22, 2017 1:05:49 GMT -5
In one of the quotes from an article from Belgium the authority stated that when real money is spent and you cannot determine exactly what for, it is gambling.
Amen, Belgium.
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Post by frunobulax on Nov 22, 2017 3:44:35 GMT -5
Nice. Won't stop game devs from making p2w games, won't rescue War Robots, but still nice.
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Post by ezekielcrow on Nov 22, 2017 3:49:47 GMT -5
And game prices will go up unless other better earning models can be adopted. No they wont. You are looking at it the wrong way. The game in a P2W form was there to support the exploitative mechanism. the exploitative mechanism was never there to support the game. They are milking those with deep pockets and the addicts via this mechanism.
These mechanisms open up an additional revenue stream that relies on gambling and not gaming. it also allows them to over price gear and hedge their bets on people's gambling inclinations. If this stuff goes through fortunately the developers will need to concentrate on how to make the game better instead of developing additional exploitative mechanisms to keep themselves afloat. How long for the gareth speed bug to be fixed? The kumiho still stumbles? is the targeting mechanism working well? ................ but the Royale spins well :-)
If the game does not get better and folds, so be it. if it gets better I can assure you it wont be via P2W and gambling mechanisms.
Im actually glad if this happens. I vehemently disagree with the exploitative relationship pixo has foisted on its players just to be competitive. Its like alternately being caressed by a velvet glove then hit with a plate mail gauntlet. I am however willing to pay a decent amount to get a good quality game. It really boils down to the value proposition. |
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Post by danny on Nov 22, 2017 3:54:57 GMT -5
No they wont. You are looking at it the wrong way. The game in a P2W form was there to support the exploitative mechanism. the exploitative mechanism was never there to support the game. They are milking those with deep pockets and the addicts via this mechanism.
These mechanisms open up an additional revenue stream that relies on gambling and not gaming. it also allows them to over price gear and hedge their bets on people's gambling inclinations. If this stuff goes through fortunately the developers will need to concentrate on how to make the game better instead of developing additional exploitative mechanisms to keep themselves afloat. How long for the gareth speed bug to be fixed? The kumiho still stumbles? is the targeting mechanism working well? ................ but the Royale spins well :-)
If the game does not get better and folds, so be it. if it gets better I can assure you it wont be via P2W and gambling mechanisms.
Im actually glad if this happens. I vehemently disagree with the exploitative relationship pixo has foisted on its players just to be competitive. Its like alternately being caressed by a velvet glove then hit with a plate mail gauntlet. I am however willing to pay a decent amount to get a good quality game. It really boils down to the value proposition. Same here. I like paying for games. In fact, I really have a monthly gaming allowance. I figure that since I don't have to buy these games I play, I should pay for something in-game. |
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Post by frunobulax on Nov 22, 2017 4:57:56 GMT -5
No they wont. You are looking at it the wrong way. The game in a P2W form was there to support the exploitative mechanism. the exploitative mechanism was never there to support the game. They are milking those with deep pockets and the addicts via this mechanism. This. If we just had the "money for weapons" offers, I'd say "tough break, game has gone p2w", but hey, if there are enough players out there that can pay up, it's Pixos business decision. Just as some restaurants have $200 menus and others have $10 menus. But the gambling exploits players without deep pockets, the guys with addicition and impulse control issues, and that's what needs to be outlawed. |
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Post by frunobulax on Nov 22, 2017 5:00:33 GMT -5
One more thing. Anyone knows if this is merely a proposition or if it is legally binding in Belgium? Because if it was, we could alert Google to the fact that the game is illegal unless Pixo removes the ability to purchase BM keys with RM. (I figure the BM isn't illegal, just the ability to convert RM into loot boxes.)
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Post by [CK]erazor on Nov 23, 2017 2:21:08 GMT -5
To contribute to this thread, have a look at a source I found: www.koengeens.be/news/2017/11/21/geens-wil-gokken-in-games-verbiedenThis seems to be the website of the Belgium minister of justice and it seems like at the current state, it's a proposal and it is not legally binding yet. Maybe someone with better knowledge of the language can help us out here? |
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Post by TravLar on Nov 23, 2017 5:34:31 GMT -5
To contribute to this thread, have a look at a source I found: www.koengeens.be/news/2017/11/21/geens-wil-gokken-in-games-verbiedenThis seems to be the website of the Belgium minister of justice and it seems like at the current state, it's a proposal and it is not legally binding yet. Maybe someone with better knowledge of the language can help us out here? Translates as:
Minister of Justice wants to prohibit purchases in video games, if you do not know what you exactly mean with that purchase. "Mixing gambling and gaming, especially at a young age, is dangerous for the mental health of the child."
The fuss arose last week around the new game Star Wars: Battlefront. In it you could first buy so-called 'loot crates', virtual boxes that could provide certain benefits for the game. Only you do not know in advance what the content of such a lootcrate entails.
"The mixing of money and addiction is gambling", the Kanspel Committee then ruled. VTM NIEUWS brought the news and a few days later removed maker Electronic Arts the function from the game, including after criticism from Disney, which has the rights to the Star Wars merchandising.
Geens now wants to prevent such functions from being able to occur in games at all. "But that takes time, because we have to go to Europe. We will certainly try to ban it. "
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Post by mallexx222 on Nov 23, 2017 13:00:48 GMT -5
Very much like 'On line' Gambling. Texas Hold'em, Black Jack etc.., this case will set the precedent for mobile app and game companies who have relied on such tactics to boost the bottom line. It does not preclude them coming up with other ways to exploit behavior but a big win none-the-less. In the past the argument has always been let the consumer decide whether to play or not. This assumed that ALL individuals knew and could make sense of the dangers that they were in. Analytically an addict or child does NOT have the where with all or the ability to resist such allures. Gaming companies are now and rightly so altering ALL their up coming games to NOT include this feature. The monetary fall out, green dollar appeal and loss of reputation is just too great.
All that being said the power truly is in the hands of the consumer to note predatory practices escalate them to authorities and not participate. If no one spun the wheel it would have quickly been eliminated. (I know this is ideal thinking BTW, diversity and desire make a complete practice unlikely which is why regulation is needed in some cases.)
Conclusion: An excellent and impactful ruling but P2W will still prevail until gamer behavior controls and targets spending to ethical (Can be subjective) gaming revenue streams.
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roadbot
GI. Patton
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Post by roadbot on Nov 23, 2017 14:11:30 GMT -5
Beautiful, just beautiful :')
Yet... My distrust for the government tells me it could go either way. Once the lobbyists get involved, who knows...
But one good thing is all these people are ALREADY defining these practices as gambling. Its no longer in question, it is gambling. That alone is hopefully enough firepower so that at least SOMETHING is done about it.
Lastly, THANK YOU to EA! If they hadn't been such complete idiots about it, maybe it wouldn't get this far. Good job to EA
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rydag
Destrier
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Post by rydag on Nov 23, 2017 15:00:11 GMT -5
I'd prefer a small monthly fee model over the current pay to win gambling modes.
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Post by piginapoke on Nov 23, 2017 17:27:56 GMT -5
Well, yes but what if, as the link says, it may be considered an exception if the users are old enough to accept responsibility? The link mentions children, does it not? All the developers might have to do is use age verification.
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Post by orkanhappy on Nov 24, 2017 0:57:22 GMT -5
Boxes are somewhat random, with a .0001 percent chance of getting something good. Now, the wheel is rigged, you always get the prizes in the order it wants you too.
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"Kill'em all."
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