|
|
Post by frunobulax on Nov 15, 2017 13:55:02 GMT -5
My proposal for a new custom league seemed to find only few takers. But, as I don't want to give up this idea without a fight  I'd like to know if there is interest at all in such a thing. Again, I'd be open to a different rule set as long as it allows everybody to build a viable hangar and mediums/lights are viable. The main focus for me is to create a league where light and medium robots are viable, which I feel is not the case in the 6-pack league. I wanted rules to allow only weapons/robots that are easily accessible to all players. Basically, I don't want 6/6 Ancilots, DB Griffins or Haechis because few players will have gold/component stuff at low levels and this kills the viability of light robots. Personally, I do have 4 level 5 Aphids laying around from event winnings, but most players won't be able to build a 7/7 Aphid Pattons. Also I prefer a more spontaneous setup, where it's not necessary to register for a team - you can just come in at given times and play. Basically I'd like to play some old style games, running Boas, Golems and even Cossacks - basically what the old "low silver" league should have been, with heavy robots at low levels and medium/light robots at higher levels. The idea was to create a schedule with rotating times (so that all timezones can play), and have the following simple rules: (1) Level restrictions: 6/6 for heavy robots, 7/7 or 8/8 for medium robots, 9/9 or 10/10 for light robots. (2) Hardware restrictions: Only AG robots, only AG and WSP weapons. Read the linked article on why I think these restrictions are sensible. |
|
|
|
Post by bronzeknee on Nov 15, 2017 14:01:28 GMT -5
I really like the idea but I think it is too convoluted. It should be simpler, like: Weapons shouldn't go past level 6. Robots should be 6 for heavy, 7 for medium, 8 for light.
And I think you should allow anything except the Ember, Shocktrain, Dash Robots and Inquisitor. Because without shield robots, what you're going to get is a bunch of Plasma Griffins destroying everything. And if you allow shield robots, you need Orkans.
If you really want to get this started, I think you should lay down some money for a tournament.
|
|
|
|
Post by frunobulax on Nov 15, 2017 14:24:38 GMT -5
Could a 7/6 Boa go up against a 6/6 Ancilot? What could a 8/6 Gary do against 6/6 Thorkalots or even Thunder Punisher Leos?
To make light and medium robots viable, you'll need to allow both higher weapon and higher robot level, IMO.
|
|
|
|
Post by hi5 on Nov 15, 2017 16:19:04 GMT -5
I’m in for this in whatever capacity. I mostly like the idea of silver only, as it’s easy to get a hangar together and would really make it about fun and skill. I also like the pickup style, as organizing a team and meeting a very firm Times is hard with my RL schedule.
|
|
|
|
Post by sugarbird on Nov 15, 2017 17:25:55 GMT -5
What about forcing hanger composition and limiting heavy bots? For example say you can bring 10 points of bots to a match. H=3, M=2, L=1 so you could bring 5 mediums, or 2 heavies 1 medium and 2 lights, 1H 3M 1L, etc. Also I'm in favor of any sort of custom league that moves the deciding factor toward skill and away from wallet. I like this idea and also the 6 pack.
|
|
|
|
Post by moody on Nov 15, 2017 18:05:08 GMT -5
Could a 7/6 Boa go up against a 6/6 Ancilot? What could a 8/6 Gary do against 6/6 Thorkalots or even Thunder Punisher Leos? To make light and medium robots viable, you'll need to allow both higher weapon and higher robot level, IMO. This would be true if the concept was a pure death match. Light bots have an advantage in a beacon game which outweighs their ability to go toe with medium and heavy bots. This is especially true with domination games and games with fewer than 6v6 As a concept I would prefer to run this as a 'variant' of the 6 pack - which means that people do not have to diversify in order to have hangars for every variation of custom match out there. Have it as a silver only 6/6 - or even a light / medium bots only 6/6 A lot of people are running variant 6/6 games (e.g. ios wiki custom 6/6 room with no component bots). Even the 6 pack discord has people up for casual games that ignore gold and/or component equipment. |
|
|
|
Post by bronzeknee on Nov 15, 2017 18:30:34 GMT -5
Could a 7/6 Boa go up against a 6/6 Ancilot? What could a 8/6 Gary do against 6/6 Thorkalots or even Thunder Punisher Leos? To make light and medium robots viable, you'll need to allow both higher weapon and higher robot level, IMO. answered this when it comes to in game play. And remember, a level 8 light bot is nearly at max speed for that robot while a level 6 Leo is really slow. That would really accentuate the difference in speed and I think make light robots more than viable, every hanger would have at least one. I'm going to answer for out of game play: It makes managing a hanger for this league extremely difficult. By keeping all the weapons at level 6 you can easily swap them around. Requiring a different set for each type of robot would hurt the viability of the league.
And one last thing, yes a Boa can go up against a Ancilot. I ran a Boa for a long time in Expert and while the Ancilot definitely had the edge in a 1vs1, if you can get inside the Ancile you can turn and move so fast the Ancilot has trouble strafing fast enough and you can kill him with your Thunder. And a Thunder + Taran does a lot more damage than two Tarans, and the Boa moves a lot faster (27 to 38 km/h).
I love the idea of league like this and I'd be willing to put a hundred bucks for the prizepool of a tournament for this league if the rules are similar to what I proposed. |
|
|
|
Post by frunobulax on Nov 17, 2017 5:27:44 GMT -5
I have argued and will always argue that in a game with decent players, light robots will always be at a big disadvantage and it comes down to firepower. It is so rare that a beacon is left undefended, that it is almost impossible to steal it with a fast robot. So what advantage does a medium or light robot have? Unless it has enough firepower to have at least a shot at killing a heavy robot (in the right circumstances), it won't do 「dookie」. That's precisely the reason why we see hardly any light/medium robots except for the rare Carnage or Fujin in any of the higher leagues (I don't count Dashs or Inquisitor as medium robots). To make light robots viable in a league, they need a level advantage, badly. And under my proposed rules we're talking only about Destrier, Schütze and Cossack, and I think we can all agree that any of them at level 9/9 will have trouble with any AG heavy robot at level 6/6.
In beacon rush, it is a valid strategy to have one fast robot that gets a contested beacon first, which would usually be a Rhino, Rogatka or of course a Kumiho. If the reds approach, that robot will be killed and can be replaced with a heavy robot. Basically it makes sense to have 1-2 fast robot _per squad_ for that reason. And I don't want a league where it is only feasible to have 2 light robots per squad, I'd like to have a league where a Golem, Boa or Patton is a viable alternative to a Natty, Leo or Griffin.
If we adjust the rules (and again, I'm open to that) to say allow WSP and gold robots, yeah, I guess a level 8 Gary might have a shot against a level 6 heavy robot. BTW, the main reason for excluding WSP robots was that I think a Carnage would break the system. I proposed 8/8 medium setups with 6/6 heavies, but 8/8 Carnage would be pretty much OP there. And I'd rather stick to a set of simple rules instead of a complicated one with exceptions (say 8/8 for AG mediums, 7/7 for AU/WSP mediums and the like).
But hey, the pragmatic approach would be to set some dates and just try out different rules. Then we discuss what worked best, and can organize a regular schedule and perhaps even a tournament with a prize, or whatever. (But I'm not a big fan of prize money here, I'd rather donate some money to an organization helping gambling addicts and indebted youths, as Pixo is actively exploiting people that may end up in either group.)
|
|
|
|
Post by SuperHero on Nov 17, 2017 5:44:05 GMT -5
Too much fine print will make it super difficult to manage and moderate.
Simplicity is the key. That’s why the 6 Pack concept has taken off. There’s now a 6 Pack discord with tournaments and matches being played on both iOS and Android. It makes it easier on everyone when you don’t have to keep checking to see what’s allowed or not.
|
|
|
|
Post by Poopface on Nov 17, 2017 9:19:35 GMT -5
There’s now a 6 Pack discord with tournaments and matches being played on both iOS and Android. It makes it easier on everyone when you don’t have to keep checking to see what’s allowed or not. Rrrreally now. I always thought it was Android-only. I never read the fine print from thinking it didn’t apply to me, but I like the concept. Where could I find some info for iOS contact info, gear requirements, etc? |
|
|
|
Post by ezekielcrow on Nov 17, 2017 9:37:53 GMT -5
I think I'd be looking forward to trying the 678 format with same level weapons then adjusting accordingly. But thats because I wont have to level up too many bots or weapons to get in.
|
|
|
|
Post by SuperHero on Nov 17, 2017 20:30:05 GMT -5
There’s now a 6 Pack discord with tournaments and matches being played on both iOS and Android. It makes it easier on everyone when you don’t have to keep checking to see what’s allowed or not. Rrrreally now. I always thought it was Android-only. I never read the fine print from thinking it didn’t apply to me, but I like the concept. Where could I find some info for iOS contact info, gear requirements, etc? Check with the WIKI clan, or PLAG, REAP or CarTel for more information. there is a discord link for it too somewhere |
|
|
|
Post by Thunderkiss on Nov 17, 2017 20:44:09 GMT -5
Could a 7/6 Boa go up against a 6/6 Ancilot? What could a 8/6 Gary do against 6/6 Thorkalots or even Thunder Punisher Leos? To make light and medium robots viable, you'll need to allow both higher weapon and higher robot level, IMO. LOTS of things take out 6/6 ancilots. The bot is bad in 6pack, altho i heartily encourage my opponents to run as many as possible, makes my job easier. |
|
|
|
Post by stokr on Nov 17, 2017 22:26:47 GMT -5
Too much fine print will make it super difficult to manage and moderate. Simplicity is the key. That’s why the 6 Pack concept has taken off. This is exactly the first thing that came to mind when I started reading this thread. Spot on... |
|
|
|
Post by Cdr. Crimmins on Nov 17, 2017 23:22:58 GMT -5
Not sure where the OP has the idea that Mediums and Lights have no place in 6 Pack. In Aurora's first match vs the Reapers (Bag of Soup's group) out of the 30 bots the Reapers brought to the table 12 were light or medium. Bag's hangar alone had 1 light, 2 mediums and 2 heavies. They whupped us 3-0.
A 6/6, 7/7, 8/8 heavy medium light league does sound interesting though.
|
|
|
|
Post by frunobulax on Nov 18, 2017 14:15:32 GMT -5
OK, what about this then as an experiment: 6/6 heavy, 7/7 medium, 8/8 light, everything allowed except components stuff (no Mk2 obviously). If I ever see a Shocktrain in a custom league - I promise I'll barf and uninstall on the spot I run a classical hangar in the moment, 10/9 Thunder Taran Boa, 7/9 Thunder Taran Boa, 9/9 Punisher Galahad and 9/9 Aphid Jesse and a 6/9 Orkan Doc. Interesting, it gives you some sense of pride to win and get 650k damage with that hangar in Diamond 1 on Android |
|
|
|
Post by frunobulax on Nov 18, 2017 14:22:23 GMT -5
Too much fine print will make it super difficult to manage and moderate. Simplicity is the key. That’s why the 6 Pack concept has taken off. This is exactly the first thing that came to mind when I started reading this thread. Spot on... 2 rules with a total of 23 words and some numbers is too complicated for you? I can make it even shorter: (1) Max 6/6 for heavy robots, 7/7 for medium robots, 9/9 for light robots. (2) Only AG robots, only AG and WSP weapons. |
|
|
|
Post by BB on Nov 18, 2017 15:01:18 GMT -5
How about an ALL MAX LIGHT BOT LEAGUE?
I can be the head fool since I actually maxed 8 light bots??
|
|
|
|
Post by stokr on Nov 18, 2017 15:03:40 GMT -5
This is exactly the first thing that came to mind when I started reading this thread. Spot on... 2 rules with a total of 23 words and some numbers is too complicated for you? I dunno...I'm a kinda simple guy. Damn near everything is too complicated for me. |
|
|
|
Post by bronzeknee on Nov 18, 2017 15:47:10 GMT -5
OK, what about this then as an experiment: 6/6 heavy, 7/7 medium, 8/8 light, everything allowed except components stuff (no Mk2 obviously). If I ever see a Shocktrain in a custom league - I promise I'll barf and uninstall on the spot I run a classical hangar in the moment, 10/9 Thunder Taran Boa, 7/9 Thunder Taran Boa, 9/9 Punisher Galahad and 9/9 Aphid Jesse and a 6/9 Orkan Doc. Interesting, it gives you some sense of pride to win and get 650k damage with that hangar in Diamond 1 on Android The weapons levels differing by robots is too complicated. Play in the 6 pack League and I think you'll get a feel for why that it unnecessary. |
|
|
|
Post by sugarbird on Nov 18, 2017 20:43:44 GMT -5
For me the question is what is wrong with the game as it is and how do I change it be the game I want to play, because now we can. My issues: Damage emphasis, OP/low skill and not easily accessible items. Simplicity. I've rarely had a fair fight in War Robots and the few times were glorious. Level the playing field so that the contest is skill based. How hard you can punch is only part of your contribution to the fireteam.
I challenge you to Cossacks at high noon! |
|
|
|
Post by Thunderkiss on Nov 18, 2017 23:35:00 GMT -5
This is exactly the first thing that came to mind when I started reading this thread. Spot on... 2 rules with a total of 23 words and some numbers is too complicated for you? I can make it even shorter: (1) Max 6/6 for heavy robots, 7/7 for medium robots, 9/9 for light robots. (2) Only AG robots, only AG and WSP weapons. You'd be surprised at how many questions we get over 6pack, which seemed like simplicity itself. |
|
|
|
Post by moody on Nov 19, 2017 5:38:33 GMT -5
2 rules with a total of 23 words and some numbers is too complicated for you? I can make it even shorter: (1) Max 6/6 for heavy robots, 7/7 for medium robots, 9/9 for light robots. (2) Only AG robots, only AG and WSP weapons. You'd be surprised at how many questions we get over 6pack, which seemed like simplicity itself. Yep, changes between matches, who is allowed to compete once season has started, are dash bots allowed etc. |
|
I'd like to know if there is interest at all in such a thing. Again, I'd be open to a different rule set as long as it allows everybody to build a viable hangar and mediums/lights are viable.
