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Post by frunobulax on Jan 25, 2017 8:28:56 GMT -5
You should link that thread if you quote it Seems to be a good read.
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Post by AηɗυηєɗнєƖ [ǀƬA] on Jan 25, 2017 8:36:59 GMT -5
you just have to click on the time stamp of the message quoted to get to the original thread, that's why I didn't. Thought it was universal knowledge, sorry. Anyway, here
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Post by Golden Sabre on Jan 25, 2017 8:44:21 GMT -5
I really do miss my lights, the cossack had become my favorite bot. Now with the new MM, it seems to believe I need to be running med and heavies at 6 bot and 7-8 weps. My little grasshoppers are getting bashed by even Hydras which coincidently seems to be it's kryptonite....or a good trebuchet shot to the face will do it too. RIP Grasshoppers
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Post by Pilot Moby_dic on Jan 25, 2017 9:42:06 GMT -5
Enjoying my Stalker (prefer with Pinata's) and Gary for capping and harassing. My two Gep's are resigned to the bin.
Missing my Schutze/Thunder gold Olympian....
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Post by boomsplat on Jan 25, 2017 10:49:40 GMT -5
Don't give up completely on light bots - just store them for now until things settle or grit your teeth for all the bumps.
In the first Pixo blog post on the new MM, they dropped more hints on understanding the desire for some pilots to not progress into heavies - the custom matches. No timeframe but they've mentioned this idea a couple of times so it has to be on the devs radar screen.
And the new league system they are implementing may make it easier to run equipment you want...just can't do it right now because of the craziness.
So I put my geps and Cossacks on ice - will pull them back out in the future once I can run them against comparable opponents (other geps).
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Post by ł⸰§ĦȺĐ◎ŴƧŦḀɌ on Jan 25, 2017 11:50:29 GMT -5
I've been biding my time on responding to this one, but sadly I've come to the conclusion that the OP is correct. Light bots have been outmoded, and similarly so has knife-fighting. On Android I've switched to nearly all medium bots because I had them upgraded more under the old MM. My heavy bots, however, are out-classed by being 4 levels lower than my mediums. In testing, my light bots are useless, especially with all the mid-range ordinance. I've had to convert most of my weapon sets to mid or long range setups, and my remaining knife-fighter loadouts are useful for 1 capture at best, so almost obsolete as well. The only saving grace is that I can predict that medium robots in the hands of skilled pilots will still be relevant in the new Meta, but unskilled pilots will compensate with OP heavies. On my iOS account it's worse. In spite of being more upgraded than my medium bots, my light bots will have to be maxed to be at all useful. In turn, that account is relatively young and all I have access to so far are Ag light and medium bots, except the one Gepard I spent RM on. I bought my first WSP bot last night, but of course it needs upgrades. My next Au purchase will be a Galahad. It's the only way I'll be able to stay competitive what with all the MM chaos still happening. Overall, ~600m has become the new Meta range of engagement, mostly using some long range for support, making Knife Fighting styles all but outmoded. Even the dreaded Aphid swarms have become more and more scarce. The new MM cannot fix this, only more weapon balance tweaks. Buy more Tridents.
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Post by SGT D00M! on Jan 25, 2017 11:56:51 GMT -5
I disagree with the OP. I have seen a great deal of relevance in hangars that have Gareths, Stalkers and even Gepards. I still see knife fighting as well and plasma is the main killer, not tridents. The Fury is a powerful bot and I see them often now, but they only domimate certain maps (SF). As players get used to the new balanced bot/weapon levels, the meta is likely to change again.
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Post by nocluevok on Jan 25, 2017 12:12:20 GMT -5
Even before the MM change some skillful player run Stalker & Gareth in Gold tier. Gep is also not rare after the Aphid buff. I still use a Gep, the role has just changed a bit. It does a decent job of pounding ECU shields into submission so my teammate can actually do damage.
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Post by buzzard on Jan 25, 2017 13:49:20 GMT -5
I love geps/aphids...no I am not and never have been a clubber. They are just fun and fit my style. The MM has settled down for me (I am IOS) and my poor 6/8 geps are routinely matched with 8/10+ heavies. I am OK on shen and PP and I mean just OK. Any other map and I am toast. I have a couple mediums in my line-up now, but I have come to the sad realization that I need to garage most of my geps (damn Pix for all the $$ I wasted). In the last day I have been getting nuked.
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Post by lephturn on Jan 25, 2017 19:31:56 GMT -5
I don't know if it's lights and meds vs. heavies or simply bot levels.
For me and just about everyone who I hear complaining about it,our lights are 3/9 or 2/10. Our meds are 2/6 or 4/8. In this MM that doesn't work anymore. I suspect what's happening is that heavies are closer to weapon levels, something like 6/7 or 8/8. I'm working on slowly levelling my lights and meds. I think they will have done something to balance lights vs. heavies but maybe not enough. Maybe what they did is allowing lights to be say +2 over weapon level without being penalized, mediums +1 over weapon level and heavies = weapon level. What is absolutely clear is the top weapon level combined with Elo rating are the determining factors.
When I get my lights and meds to 6 or 7 or 8 to match or exceed my weapon levels, and catch up to the levels of the heavies, I'm hoping things will get a bit better.
As of now the only light I see being moderately successful out there is the Stalker, which I suppose is reasonable. I'm struggling to see a role for mediums, but maybe if they can be 1 or 2 levels over a comparable weapon level heavy it could work. Maybe.
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Post by critter667 on Jan 26, 2017 13:43:43 GMT -5
I have to disagree with the OP. I habe a hangar of 2 Cossacks (1 taran, 1 orkan), 1 gepard with Pinatas and 1 Patton with Pinatas. All are at about level 6 with level 6 weapons. I have not been playing long enough to level items much more than this but did experience the MM both before and after the server changes.
Honestly, I have seen little difference between MMs and think any changes only stem from my upgrading of weapons as I flushed out my hangar.
As for lights on the battle field, they still work to capture beacons. In fact given the slow speed of the heavier mechs, quick beacon capture is vital. On the bigger maps, I've seen beacons that are contested once then never again. One line light can flip that quickly and swing the fight in your favor.
In addition, harassment and skirmishing is still an important role. I've had ample battles where I was able to get 2 heavies to focus on me. I retreated, pulling the 2 heavies with me. While they chased me, the rest of my team chewed through their allies, giving us the win.
Yes a light can't go against a heavy on an open area and win, nor can you stack the MM deck to give your light mechs an advantage. On the other hand, if you pilot the mechs well, know your surroundings, and stick to using cover and harassment, lights do great.
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Post by buzzard on Jan 27, 2017 11:47:11 GMT -5
It definitely depends on your MM. I found my 6/8 geps getting toasted much too quickly now that I am facing so many heavies (except SHen). I added a couple gareths to the line-up and retired the geps. They are awesome! My hangar is now a heavy, 2 meds, 2 gars and I am having a blast again.
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mr7q
Destrier
Posts: 71
Karma: 48
Pilot name: mr7q
Platform: Android
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Post by mr7q on Jan 27, 2017 11:58:35 GMT -5
The Gareth is fantastic, and is really, really handy to have as a toolbox. I imagine a Stalker is similar, as I know for sure I've run into a few of them piloted by folks that knew how to be very, very aggravating with them! A Gepard is also a fantastic Aphid platform, especially now that they're a little less easy to hit with where the maneuverability is of more use.
Either way, you definitely can't expect to go toe to toe with a heavy and come out ahead. Even the Gareth, the most durable, is going to get its shield popped off from concentrated fire. Engage, harass, distract, and use speed to disengage to help steer the battlefield in support of your team. Grabbing less protected beacons or flanking shielded opponents are excellent roles, and is quite a lot of fun to play. However, you'll definitely want to balance your hangar out to add a shield and a broadsword to your arsenal to complement the rapier.
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Post by Pilot Moby_dic on Jan 27, 2017 12:04:31 GMT -5
I have to disagree with the OP. I habe a hangar of 2 Cossacks (1 taran, 1 orkan), 1 gepard with Pinatas and 1 Patton with Pinatas. All are at about level 6 with level 6 weapons. I have not been playing long enough to level items much more than this but did experience the MM both before and after the server changes. Honestly, I have seen little difference between MMs and think any changes only stem from my upgrading of weapons as I flushed out my hangar. As for lights on the battle field, they still work to capture beacons. In fact given the slow speed of the heavier mechs, quick beacon capture is vital. On the bigger maps, I've seen beacons that are contested once then never again. One line light can flip that quickly and swing the fight in your favor. In addition, harassment and skirmishing is still an important role. I've had ample battles where I was able to get 2 heavies to focus on me. I retreated, pulling the 2 heavies with me. While they chased me, the rest of my team chewed through their allies, giving us the win. Yes a light can't go against a heavy on an open area and win, nor can you stack the MM deck to give your light mechs an advantage. On the other hand, if you pilot the mechs well, know your surroundings, and stick to using cover and harassment, lights do great. I agree with a lot of what you say. I've found the following playing 6/7 (the best I can field at moment) against 8/10 and above....MM has settled to 50% +\- Geps - I love the small of Geps in the morning.... Shultze - resigned to the dust bin Gossack - ditto Golum/Vit etc - hardly ever see them on the battle field. When they do they tend to be toast.... The one light I love is the Stalker. quality at harassment and drawing enemy bots (a keeper). To be competitive at 6/7 and above I'm finding you have to have AU or WSP bots - especially lights or mediums P.s. Is the Rog extinct? I've literally fought <10 in probably 1,500 games?!
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Post by SGT D00M! on Jan 27, 2017 19:47:32 GMT -5
I have had a couple of shocks under-estimating bots in the new MM. I went head on in a 6/10 Leo vs a Gareth and and a Vityaz in differnt matches. Both times they were suprisingly hardier then the level 4 easy kills I was used to in the old MM. On checking after the matches, the Gareth was lvl 8 and the Vityaz was lvl 9.
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Post by Loop_Stratos on Jan 27, 2017 20:08:57 GMT -5
I do better with Gareth than before the MM change... perhaps because it's now 8/10 from 6/10. And perhaps because I haven't been able to play that much(still unestablished PR) before yesterday because of school.
I wonder why many think MM means you have to run the most meta setup? I believe you can run 5 arty and win after the MM sorts your hangar to a suitable place?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2017 14:29:23 GMT -5
Medium bots are my favorite
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