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Post by mandapan on Jul 8, 2017 4:44:39 GMT -5
Just out of curiosity, I wanted to know how long it would take to grind a level 10 Carnage with two level 10 Thunders.
13k research points. So if you could harvest 500 points a day, that's about a month for bot. The upgrades, about another two weeks? Something like that. Level 10 Thunders? Probably about a week each? Let's say a week. So if you could upgrade the thunders while researching for the carnage, about a month and a half. And you'd have to play a lot to get enough silver.
How long does it take if you have a bucket of gold? 5 minutes.
Pay to win. People with that class of equipment should not be in the same matches as people with robots that can't even scratch that.
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Post by Firebeard on Jul 8, 2017 4:56:04 GMT -5
So I crank up War Robots for a bit to study the reloading animations. It puts me in a match. There's some guy running around with level 10 bot, with energy shield, two level 10 thunders, and he killed pretty much everyone. No particularly special tactics, just kinda wandered around getting shot at by everyone, shrugging it off and killing people with one hit. I engaged from a distance, behind cover, with long range weapons at first, and none of them could dent his shield faster than it recharged, until he eventually ran up to me because of course his bot was much faster than mine, and one shot later, I was dead. War Robots sucks. This game is garbage. This was only possible because the MM removes Points for Losing. The Player purposely Lost Matches to gain access to a lower League. If you create a multiplayer aspect to your game .. add a proper Scoring system: Win = Points Lose = No Points Also, I spent 3 months to raise 5 weapons to L12 and 2 to L11 ..
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Post by mandapan on Jul 8, 2017 5:07:16 GMT -5
It will be multiplayer before it's anything else. I don't think I'll be doing any sort of point based tier system. I think it sounds more fair to evaluate what the value of the persons hanger is, and use that to match them with other people with similarly valued hangars.
I'm also considering the idea of 'bounties' on certain players based on how many people they've killed so far in the current match, so if someone kills 5 people and then you take them down, that gets you a nice bonus. If the MM system is unable to find value-matched opponents, perhaps it could mis-match but then put a large bounty on the head of whoever is overpowered, to entice less developed players to attack anyways for the possibility of a big payout.
I'm not sure the idea of weapons that can be leveled up is compatible with multiplayer. The reason Call of Duty works so well is that with skill, even a brand new account can still compete against people with everything unlocked. Those unlocks are helpful, and fun, but not essential. In War Robots however, they're essential. If you don't have the proper gear, you're just cannon fodder for the people who do. I wouldn't mind so much if maybe this was an oversight or an honest mistake, but it seems like a very deliberate and greed-based decision on the part of Pixonic, and abusive to gamers. I like gamers, and I don't appreciate seeing them (us) getting used like that.
My first robot will be done soon, I've been working on making a very accurate Griffin and of course it's a lot of work. I think I like mine a little better than the original though, actually. Mine has normal mapping (bump effect), shadows, and could have self illumination, ambient occlusion and reflections (although I'm still considering how much of that is actually necessary since it all slows down the frame rate).
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Post by Firebeard on Jul 8, 2017 9:59:15 GMT -5
It will be multiplayer before it's anything else. I don't think I'll be doing any sort of point based tier system. I think it sounds more fair to evaluate what the value of the persons hanger is, and use that to match them with other people with similarly valued hangars. I'm also considering the idea of 'bounties' on certain players based on how many people they've killed so far in the current match, so if someone kills 5 people and then you take them down, that gets you a nice bonus. If the MM system is unable to find value-matched opponents, perhaps it could mis-match but then put a large bounty on the head of whoever is overpowered, to entice less developed players to attack anyways for the possibility of a big payout. I'm not sure the idea of weapons that can be leveled up is compatible with multiplayer. The reason Call of Duty works so well is that with skill, even a brand new account can still compete against people with everything unlocked. Those unlocks are helpful, and fun, but not essential. In War Robots however, they're essential. If you don't have the proper gear, you're just cannon fodder for the people who do. I wouldn't mind so much if maybe this was an oversight or an honest mistake, but it seems like a very deliberate and greed-based decision on the part of Pixonic, and abusive to gamers. I like gamers, and I don't appreciate seeing them (us) getting used like that. My first robot will be done soon, I've been working on making a very accurate Griffin and of course it's a lot of work. I think I like mine a little better than the original though, actually. Mine has normal mapping (bump effect), shadows, and could have self illumination, ambient occlusion and reflections (although I'm still considering how much of that is actually necessary since it all slows down the frame rate). Sounds plausible. But real world testing will find any flaws. The simpler the better .. don't over complicate the system. As for framerate issue: if you have the Mecha and Weapons independent of the environment, you should be able to squeeze most of what you want in with little impact.
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Post by hyderier on Jul 8, 2017 13:04:15 GMT -5
So I crank up War Robots for a bit to study the reloading animations. It puts me in a match. There's some guy running around with level 10 bot, with energy shield, two level 10 thunders, and he killed pretty much everyone. No particularly special tactics, just kinda wandered around getting shot at by everyone, shrugging it off and killing people with one hit. I engaged from a distance, behind cover, with long range weapons at first, and none of them could dent his shield faster than it recharged, until he eventually ran up to me because of course his bot was much faster than mine, and one shot later, I was dead. War Robots sucks. This game is garbage. Fortunately, a lot of players feel differently. War Robots has a bunch of issues, but for many it's still easily the best, most enjoyable mobile multiplayer FPS/TPS there is. And while the problem you describe exists, most games are still very good. What I'm trying to say here is, if you start from the assumption that War Robots sucks, that's generally a wrong assumption. That battle may have sucked. It may suck for you. But generally, it's pretty great.
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Post by mandapan on Jul 8, 2017 14:06:47 GMT -5
So I crank up War Robots for a bit to study the reloading animations. It puts me in a match. There's some guy running around with level 10 bot, with energy shield, two level 10 thunders, and he killed pretty much everyone. No particularly special tactics, just kinda wandered around getting shot at by everyone, shrugging it off and killing people with one hit. I engaged from a distance, behind cover, with long range weapons at first, and none of them could dent his shield faster than it recharged, until he eventually ran up to me because of course his bot was much faster than mine, and one shot later, I was dead. [ edit: I removed some very negative statements about Pixonic from here for being too harsh ] Fortunately, a lot of players feel differently. War Robots has a bunch of issues, but for many it's still easily the best, most enjoyable mobile multiplayer FPS/TPS there is. And while the problem you describe exists, most games are still very good. What I'm trying to say here is, if you start from the assumption that War Robots sucks, that's generally a wrong assumption. That battle may have sucked. It may suck for you. But generally, it's pretty great. [ Edit: I removed some snarky bs, in retrospect it seems too harsh. I'm going to keep the list of gripes though, in case these suggestions help development somehow. ] I understand that mobile platform can't handle as much as desktop, but it could do a lot more than what they're implementing so far. Shadows, illumination maps, deformable terrain, a weather system, and fog all come to mind as 'affordable' graphical enhancements. To it's credit, the modelling of the robots is actually pretty nice. The texturing... needs some work. The animation is acceptable. Better death animation sequences would be nice. Optional normal maps would really go a long way, for people with hardware that can handle it (pretty much any decent phone made in the last three years). Foot prints would be interesting and possibly add a nice gameplay element. The network is pretty bad sometimes. IOS and Android in separate realms = terrible. In game chat? Nope. Ability to review your opponents after the game? Only if you stick around to the end of the game. Game shows a constant stream of 'who won what big prize most recently' but won't update your Ag/Au unless you move around in the menu enough to force a reload of the profile data from the server. The gameplay is pretty bad. Barely tolerable. The targeting system is crude and tends to screw up a lot. There's no way to cycle between targets, that I know of. No mini-map. No 'aim mode'. No ability to influence your jump direction, even with robots that have thrusters and could conceivably alter their direction of flight mid-jump. Overall the game is boring and repetitive. Not enough game modes (only just the one, that I know of). Not enough maps. Way, way, WAYYY too slow movement. No desktop version. They are really shooting themselves in the foot there on that one. On a positive note, the audio is pretty good. No complaints there. And these are just the 'details', things I'm happy to overlook if the game itself is solid. But it's not, it's dominated by jumping griffins with rockets, useless teammates with flea-bots jumping to make a short-lived cap before dying, so they can get the gold if you manage to carry the game for them, team-mates blocking your kills so they can work on their challenges, team-mates with no interest in helping at all (tanking). And of course, there's the MM issue, which I've already complained about enough I'm sure you all know where I stand on that. So bad it has to be intentional, and the intent is a cash grab. Even that wouldn't be so bad except they are selling such incredibly overpriced game elements. And if you want to play for free, you have to be willing to play *forever* and until you get a decent machine, basically just being fodder (slowing down your progress even more). And as soon as you get a decent machine? They move you up a league so again, your equipment is (comparatively) terrible. [ edit: I'm removing some very negative statements about Pixonic from here for being too harsh. ] Anyways, I hope that we can still chat about this even though we're clearly on opposite sides of the fence when it comes to opinion of the game. I do appreciate everyones input even if i don't agree with it, and I hope when I get something playable together you'll all take a minute to try it out and let me know what I'm doing wrong, because I'm sure when it comes to the list of what's wrong with my game, it'll be a lot longer than this.
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Post by Thunderkiss on Jul 8, 2017 20:59:27 GMT -5
Fortunately, a lot of players feel differently. War Robots has a bunch of issues, but for many it's still easily the best, most enjoyable mobile multiplayer FPS/TPS there is. And while the problem you describe exists, most games are still very good. What I'm trying to say here is, if you start from the assumption that War Robots sucks, that's generally a wrong assumption. That battle may have sucked. It may suck for you. But generally, it's pretty great. To be fair, I didn't start with that assumption, I formed it after careful review. And I'm not just some angry gamer that's mad about losing a match (although that did obviously tick me off a bit). I've been a gamer for 30+ years. I write games and game-like applications for a living. Objectively, War Robots has a *lot* of issues: The graphics are... not good. I understand that mobile platform can't handle as much as desktop, but it could do a lot more than what they're implementing so far. Shadows, illumination maps, deformable terrain, a weather system, and fog all come to mind as 'affordable' graphical enhancements. To it's credit, the modelling of the robots is actually pretty nice. The texturing... not so much. The animation is acceptable. Better death animation sequences would be nice. Optional normal maps would really go a long way, for people with hardware that can handle it (pretty much any decent phone made in the last three years). Foot prints would be interesting and possibly add a nice gameplay element. The network is absolutely terrible. Flaky, slow, bogged down. What are they spending that two million a month they make in income on? Definitely not servers. IOS and Android in separate realms = terrible. In game chat? Nope. Ability to review your opponents after the game? Only if you stick around to the end of the game. Game shows a constant stream of 'who won what big prize most recently' but won't update your Ag/Au unless you move around in the menu enough to force a reload of the profile data from the server. The gameplay is pretty bad. Barely tolerable. The targeting system is crude and tends to screw up a lot. There's no way to cycle between targets, that I know of. No mini-map. No 'aim mode'. No ability to influence your jump direction, even with robots that have thrusters and could conceivably alter their direction of flight mid-jump. Overall the game is boring and repetitive. Not enough game modes (only just the one, that I know of). Not enough maps. Way, way, WAYYY too slow movement. No desktop version. They are really shooting themselves in the foot there on that one. On a positive note, the audio is pretty good. No complaints there. And these are just the 'details', things I'm happy to overlook if the game itself is solid. But it's not, it's dominated by jumping griffins with rockets, useless teammates with flea-bots jumping to make a short-lived cap before dying, so they can get the gold if you manage to carry the game for them, team-mates blocking your kills so they can work on their challenges, team-mates with no interest in helping at all (tanking). And these toxic gameplay elements are in place because Pixonic put them there. It's not just a couple random losers doing it. And of course, there's the MM issue, which I've already complained about enough I'm sure you all know where I stand on that. So bad it has to be intentional, and the intent is a cash grab. Even that wouldn't be so bad except they are selling such incredibly overpriced game elements. And if you want to play for free, you have to be willing to play *forever* and until you get a decent machine, basically just being fodder (slowing down your progress even more). And as soon as you get a decent machine? They move you up a league so again, your equipment is (comparatively) terrible. Please don't get me wrong. I'm not trying to convince you the game is terrible, just explaining why and how I came to that conclusion. If you're happy playing, great! But all I'm taking away from my time playing is a long list of what not to do in game development. The only redeeming feature I see about War Robots (other than the audio) is the community. There are people playing it and that almost makes it enjoyable. And it works out great for Pixonic, because as soon as they can convince someone to pay them, that person becomes an advocate for Pixonic. No one wants to admit that they got ripped off, or that they pay to win. So instead they'll talk about what a great game it is, and how anyone who doesn't like it is just a loser, and that it's not pay-to-win, it's actually super strategic, etc etc. That's a brilliant marketing strategy on their part, but they basically make their customers into two-fold victims to do it. It's sad... as a developer I really hate seeing that. Anyways, I hope that we can still chat about this even though we're clearly on opposite sides of the fence when it comes to opinion of the game. I do appreciate everyones input even if i don't agree with it, and I hope when I get something playable together you'll all take a minute to try it out and let me know what I'm doing wrong, because I'm sure when it comes to the list of what's wrong with my game, it'll be a lot longer than this. There isn't an online game around that doesn't suffer from these issues. Because the real issue at hand is human nature. As far as graphics are concerned, I think you're being incredibly optimistic about what could/should be in game. Pixonic took a page straight from Blizzard here. You know why WoW was/is so popular? Because EVERY pc could run it, no sweat. You really want the lag involved with what youre suggesting here AND still have a large player base? Not gonna happen, and it's totally fine the way it is.
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Post by hyderier on Jul 9, 2017 4:00:42 GMT -5
mandapanFirst of all, I agree partly with what you say. I just don't see them as critical issues. Then some comments: Graphics: The game runs on incredibly low-end hardware. Unity-based game is going to have a lot smaller potential player base. My kid plays it with LG Spirit, and it's quite fine. F'ing Pokemon Go won't work on that phone. I'm fine with the graphics on my S8 as well (and there are robot shadows). They could be better, sure, but for most a total non-issue. Targetting: in the hangar screen menu you can switch on target lock. It adds extra button to controls, which allows locking on a target snd switching locked target (unlock is by looking 90° another direction which us a bit clunky but works). Sounds: I actually play sound off, and I think many do. In game chat would be bad. Game is international with language barriers, and too fast paced to have meaningful chat during the battle. If everybody on a team spends just 30 secs writing/readong chat, that'd mean a lost game in higher leagues. More serious clans solve this with Discord or similar external voice comms. Also chats are somewhat casual unfriendly. War Robots is geared very much towards just playing, no distractions, no social pressures. However, some kind of non-chat signalling system would be good. It could be optional like target lock. The reconnecting thing is broken. That's maybe my biggest cripe about the game, as I play a lot in a bus etc. As long as a battle is going, you should be able to connect back to it. Could comment on other things but no time now. If you want an opinion on some single thing, feel free to ask. Finally, check out Battle Titans (on this forum there are a few threads about it too).
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Post by mandapan on Jul 9, 2017 8:25:00 GMT -5
There isn't an online game around that doesn't suffer from these issues. Because the real issue at hand is human nature. As far as graphics are concerned, I think you're being incredibly optimistic about what could/should be in game. Pixonic took a page straight from Blizzard here. You know why WoW was/is so popular? Because EVERY pc could run it, no sweat. You really want the lag involved with what youre suggesting here AND still have a large player base? Not gonna happen, and it's totally fine the way it is. Nothing I mentioned would impact frame rate much. Shadows, a bit... but like I said, make these elements optional. I have a $40 android tablet sitting here I test on for worst case scenario and it handles everything I mentioned just fine. The biggest lag factor with War Robots right now is the network. I think when I post some screenshots of my version of the Griffin, you'll agree that turning on things like 'specular highlights', 'normal mapping', 'ambient occlusion', hires textures and shadows add a lot of value, graphically. And all these elements could easily be optional, just have two sets of materials for the robots, one with nothing but diffuse texture channel (as it is now), and another with the fancy stuff for newer devices. If Pixonic wasn't asleep at the wheel, they'd already have done that. Instead they're too busy trying to figure out the best way to con people out of $80 for a single robot in a phone game. You could buy an actual robot for that much!
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Post by mandapan on Jul 9, 2017 8:31:10 GMT -5
mandapan First of all, I agree partly with what you say. I just don't see them as critical issues. Then some comments: Graphics: The game runs on incredibly low-end hardware. Unity-based game is going to have a lot smaller potential player base. My kid plays it with LG Spirit, and it's quite fine. F'ing Pokemon Go won't work on that phone. I'm fine with the graphics on my S8 as well (and there are robot shadows). They could be better, sure, but for most a total non-issue. Targetting: in the hangar screen menu you can switch on target lock. It adds extra button to controls, which allows locking on a target snd switching locked target (unlock is by looking 90° another direction which us a bit clunky but works). Sounds: I actually play sound off, and I think many do. In game chat would be bad. Game is international with language barriers, and too fast paced to have meaningful chat during the battle. If everybody on a team spends just 30 secs writing/readong chat, that'd mean a lost game in higher leagues. More serious clans solve this with Discord or similar external voice comms. Also chats are somewhat casual unfriendly. War Robots is geared very much towards just playing, no distractions, no social pressures. However, some kind of non-chat signalling system would be good. It could be optional like target lock. The reconnecting thing is broken. That's maybe my biggest cripe about the game, as I play a lot in a bus etc. As long as a battle is going, you should be able to connect back to it. Could comment on other things but no time now. If you want an opinion on some single thing, feel free to ask. Finally, check out Battle Titans (on this forum there are a few threads about it too). Interesting, thanks. I get no shadows on any of my devices, not sure why. Tried it on three different phones / tablets. Why would a unity game have a smaller base? It runs on everything, very nicely. There could be a PC/Mac version, Xbox/ps4 console versions, iphone and android could play in the same arenas (along with the desktops and consoles). That would make a much larger base. Maybe you're thinking of poorly made Unity games? Some developers aren't good at optimizing, but that's not Unity's fault. Yeah maybe chat isn't the right type of communication, but some way to co-ordinate team efforts is necessary. Distress beacons, rally points, something like that. Thanks for the tip about the target lock, I'll have to give that a try. The default is clunky. I'll have a look at Battle Titans, thanks. Have a nice day
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Post by mandapan on Jul 9, 2017 8:46:56 GMT -5
Here's some concepts I'm considering for my 'remix' of War Robots:
Fuel supply for 'burst movement' and 'hover' for bots with the proper equipment. Variable sized fuel tanks. Destroyed robots can be looted for scavenged fuel.
Limited supply of rockets, each team has a resupply point at their spawn.
Weight based movement speed. So the more your equipment / current load out weighs, the slower you move. As you use fuel / rockets / ammo, your reserves diminish and your weight goes down, you move faster.
Thermal overload for lasers: As you use them, the overheat but can be cooled off by moving around, using a better radiator, jumping and/or finding some water to immerse the robot in.
Build-your-own-robot: Mix and match upper / lower bodies, engines, radiators, etc. Some lowers might be hover / quadrocopter style and can fly for short periods of time (and skim along the ground otherwise on "impulse power"). Another lower might be something like rollerblades, which would combine well with upper jets that push the robot rapidly forward ala 'Bubblegum Crisis'. Of course there would be some lowers that specialize in jumping, others run speed, others slow but carry the most weight. Uppers would largely focus on how many hardpoints they have available, what types, how much armor, how big of an engine they can hold, etc.
Melee weapons like swords and hook/chains.
Ability to knock over robots. Not all robots can get up as fast as others. Robots could assist other fallen robots to help them get back up.
Smoke bombs to temporarily jam targeting systems.
EMP weapons to temporarily disable robots in near proximity.
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Post by Firebeard on Jul 9, 2017 10:28:28 GMT -5
Not all devices support Shader 2.0. Also, the largest impact to fps will be your resolution.
1080p can only safely achieve 60fps but 720p can handle upwards of 96fps. Furthermore, your pixel square will define the visual fidelity. If you run 1080p @ 1-1, you'll introduce jutter. You'd be better to run 2-4.
Net code is a priority if you plan on running a multiplayer aspect. I suggest a P2P network over a dedicated Server. Servers will always sync to the lowest Ping and faster Clients will lagg. On average, an open pipeline - Server to Client - should allow for minimum of 8MB of throughput, more if you want Voice.
Lastly, a lot of people have several Apps on their devices. Make sure you have a large enough Heap pile to offload the Trash without impact. I suggest you download 8 to 10 Apps on a control device for testing.
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Post by mandapan on Jul 9, 2017 22:26:16 GMT -5
Hey I think I've been too harsh on Pixonic, and it's probably better to stay positive, so I wanted to apologize for talking such trash about them in this thread. There's a lot that's right about War Robots, and it's pretty great that they provide so much freely. I've edited some of my posts to be less mean.
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Post by Danny Linguini on Jul 9, 2017 23:17:06 GMT -5
Hey I think I've been too harsh on Pixonic, and it's probably better to stay positive, so I wanted to apologize for talking such trash about them in this thread. There's a lot that's right about War Robots, and it's pretty great that they provide so much freely. I've edited some of my posts to be less mean. Sometimes this game and its players just put you in that kind of mood. I know -- i was just told I should maybe stop playing because I've been so negative on it lately. Truth is, it's a very cool game that does a lot for being played on mobile devices. There's some really good stuff in it, and there are bits in and about it that just suck. Overall I enjoy playing it, and if I just put myself in a mindset to have fun shooting stuff up, stop being so damned competitive about every little challenge and milestone, and just take whatever comes from that, I'd probably enjoy it a lot more.
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ipwng0dz
Destrier
Posts: 81
Karma: 47
Pilot name: Ipwng0ds
Platform: Android
Clan: Yippee Kay Yay
League: Diamond
Server Region: North America
Favorite robot: Gareth
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Post by ipwng0dz on Jul 10, 2017 1:39:21 GMT -5
Here's some concepts I'm considering for my 'remix' of War Robots: Fuel supply for 'burst movement' and 'hover' for bots with the proper equipment. Variable sized fuel tanks. Destroyed robots can be looted for scavenged fuel. Limited supply of rockets, each team has a resupply point at their spawn. Weight based movement speed. So the more your equipment / current load out weighs, the slower you move. As you use fuel / rockets / ammo, your reserves diminish and your weight goes down, you move faster. Thermal overload for lasers: As you use them, the overheat but can be cooled off by moving around, using a better radiator, jumping and/or finding some water to immerse the robot in. Build-your-own-robot: Mix and match upper / lower bodies, engines, radiators, etc. Some lowers might be hover / quadrocopter style and can fly for short periods of time (and skim along the ground otherwise on "impulse power"). Another lower might be something like rollerblades, which would combine well with upper jets that push the robot rapidly forward ala 'Bubblegum Crisis'. Of course there would be some lowers that specialize in jumping, others run speed, others slow but carry the most weight. Uppers would largely focus on how many hardpoints they have available, what types, how much armor, how big of an engine they can hold, etc. Melee weapons like swords and hook/chains. Ability to knock over robots. Not all robots can get up as fast as others. Robots could assist other fallen robots to help them get back up. Smoke bombs to temporarily jam targeting systems. EMP weapons to temporarily disable robots in near proximity. Caution: Constructive Critism I'm seeing 'scope creep' catching up to you. Basic project management is to state your deliverables then deliver them lol. These ideas you have are awesome but would be better done as updates to an already working game imo. I'm not saying this to discourage you, I'm interested in what you're making and will definitely give your game a go once it running... so get something running! In the mean time support your muse and contribute to the game because it's their hard work that you're trying to profit off of. When you get some time for a break between coding and real-life read this thread: war-robots-forum.freeforums.net/thread/1681/pro-tips-tactics-best
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Post by WilsonK on Jul 10, 2017 1:58:09 GMT -5
My level 6 lame-bots can't hang against 10's with maxed out guns etc. I'm not interested in playing this game for 4 months just to eventually get a bot that can hang in the league I'm in, just in time to get sent to a new league where I'm, again, totally outclassed. I guess this is a rant but really I'm just trying to see if I'm missing something important before I just uninstall this and get back to work making my own similar game in Unity. Seems like this is a system to force players into paying so they can compete against better equipped players in the league they've been pushed into. I've only been playing a couple days though so maybe I just can't find the right button to step down to a league with similarly equipped players? Other people "tank" (lose on purpose?) to deal with this? That sounds pretty lame too. Leagues seem to be a real problem with this game, but I'm sure it makes Pixonic a ton of money. $70 for a mediocre bot? And that's "special price"? Who the hell pays that much to play a free phone game? My honest-est advice? Ignore leagues, just play the game, enjoy and improve. Period. Cheers, WilsonK
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Post by mandapan on Jul 10, 2017 11:50:40 GMT -5
Caution: Constructive Critism I'm seeing 'scope creep' catching up to you. Basic project management is to state your deliverables then deliver them lol. These ideas you have are awesome but would be better done as updates to an already working game imo. I'm not saying this to discourage you, I'm interested in what you're making and will definitely give your game a go once it running... so get something running! In the mean time support your muse and contribute to the game because it's their hard work that you're trying to profit off of. When you get some time for a break between coding and real-life read this thread: war-robots-forum.freeforums.net/thread/1681/pro-tips-tactics-bestOK I have braced myself for the constructive criticism... READY I agree that scope creep is a real killer. However, the way I like to plan out projects is to figure out what type of features I might eventually want to support and then make sure my code structure plans for those features before any coding has started (as much as possible, anyways). My experience has been that if you add these concepts in later, you spend more time retrofitting the code with bolted-on new features than you would have spent planning on them initially. That said, I'm not 100% sold on anything I outlined above, just tossing them out there to see what people think of them. As for supporting my 'muse'... I don't see myself giving Pixonic any money at any time. As stated previously, I find their business practices abusive. I'm trying to restrain myself from being too negative about voicing those opinions but I do still feel the same regardless of what I'll rant about here. If the only thing you could actually buy, in the game, was cosmetic stuff like vanity hats or special skins for the bots that don't actually affect gameplay, then I would be more inclined to buy something. But since you can pay to win, I don't want to contribute anything to that business practice. Just participating in the game is about as much contribution as I can justify. If Pixonic cares to read this thread, then they will benefit from my suggestions and critique and if they act on some of those suggestions they will gain far more from that than any little couple dollars I might muster together for them. Currently I'm optimizing my gun/robot model structure to better support 'instancing' which allows the GPU to batch multiple similar objects into one draw call instead of many separate ones. I like to do that early in the process so I don't have to go back into my models later and restructure them, since sometimes it's a considerable amount of fiddling to get that working. For example the gun barrels on the punisher... if I have all 6 barrels merged together as one mesh, it exceeds the vertex attribute count that Unity has in place as an upper limit to what can be batched... but since I've now taken each barrel and made it a separate object, it can combine all of them into one draw call and even though 6 objects (2 barrel sets for MK2, one per side, one barrel set for mk1, one per side) becomes 36 objects, it ultimately runs much faster because if I have 12 of my griffin models on the screen at once, they take almost no additional time versus just drawing one. It's a little tricky but so far the results are promising, I can have 12 griffins on the screen in highest-detail level at once, with shadows, normal maps, hires textures and specular highlights enabled, all of them dynamic (animate-able), and on a $40 amazon fire tablet I still get 40fps. Without shadows, 50+ fps. Screenshots soon, still working on the legs. Everyone on this thread, thanks for your thoughts.
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Post by hurtbot on Jul 11, 2017 22:18:45 GMT -5
My level 6 lame-bots can't hang against 10's with maxed out guns etc. I'm not interested in playing this game for 4 months just to eventually get a bot that can hang in the league I'm in, just in time to get sent to a new league where I'm, again, totally outclassed. I guess this is a rant but really I'm just trying to see if I'm missing something important before I just uninstall this and get back to work making my own similar game in Unity. Seems like this is a system to force players into paying so they can compete against better equipped players in the league they've been pushed into. I've only been playing a couple days though so maybe I just can't find the right button to step down to a league with similarly equipped players? Other people "tank" (lose on purpose?) to deal with this? That sounds pretty lame too. Leagues seem to be a real problem with this game, but I'm sure it makes Pixonic a ton of money. $70 for a mediocre bot? And that's "special price"? Who the hell pays that much to play a free phone game? My honest-est advice? Ignore leagues, just play the game, enjoy and improve. Period. Cheers, WilsonK Just curious... how is he supposed to enjoy the game when his only contribution is to absorb damage for teammates who actually have the equipment to compete? Another query... how is he supposed to improve when he's playing against douchebags with maxed out treb butches who will happily kill him before he gets out of spawn?
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Post by WilsonK on Jul 11, 2017 22:39:19 GMT -5
My honest-est advice? Ignore leagues, just play the game, enjoy and improve. Period. Cheers, WilsonK Just curious... how is he supposed to enjoy the game when his only contribution is to absorb damage for teammates who actually have the equipment to compete? Another query... how is he supposed to improve when he's playing against douchebags with maxed out treb butches who will happily kill him before he gets out of spawn? Just imagine yourself playing a game on nightmare difficulty, if you can find a way to play it better, it is much more satisfying than climbing leagues. Oh and another point, at the start of a match, depends on where you decide to move towards, when to engage, when to take cover bla bla bla, 1001 factors to either lengthen or shorten your survivability. Lastly, if you are getting hellfired by trebs or spawn trapped, just suck it up like every other player does, even I myself get hammered at times. Cheers, WilsonK
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Post by hurtbot on Jul 11, 2017 22:50:30 GMT -5
Just curious... how is he supposed to enjoy the game when his only contribution is to absorb damage for teammates who actually have the equipment to compete? Another query... how is he supposed to improve when he's playing against douchebags with maxed out treb butches who will happily kill him before he gets out of spawn? Just imagine yourself playing a game on nightmare difficulty, if you can find a way to play it better, it is much more satisfying than climbing leagues. Oh and another point, at the start of a match, depends on where you decide to move towards, when to engage, when to take cover bla bla bla, 1001 factors to either lengthen or shorten your survivability. Lastly, if you are getting hellfired by trebs or spawn trapped, just suck it up like every other player does, even I myself get hammered at times. Cheers, WilsonK There you go... so you do have some advice after all. To think... you'd have nothing to reply to if I'd just said, "That advice isn't helpful."
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Post by WilsonK on Jul 11, 2017 22:56:53 GMT -5
Just imagine yourself playing a game on nightmare difficulty, if you can find a way to play it better, it is much more satisfying than climbing leagues. Oh and another point, at the start of a match, depends on where you decide to move towards, when to engage, when to take cover bla bla bla, 1001 factors to either lengthen or shorten your survivability. Lastly, if you are getting hellfired by trebs or spawn trapped, just suck it up like every other player does, even I myself get hammered at times. Cheers, WilsonK There you go... so you do have some advice after all. To think... you'd have nothing to reply to if I'd just said, "That advice isn't helpful." Hahaha!! All in all, it's just a game afterall! Real-life responsibilities are still priority
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Post by hurtbot on Jul 11, 2017 23:02:46 GMT -5
There you go... so you do have some advice after all. To think... you'd have nothing to reply to if I'd just said, "That advice isn't helpful." Hahaha!! All in all, it's just a game afterall! Real-life responsibilities are still priority Ah, but of course! However, we DO really need to hold the people from whom we purchase services responsible for their products. Anyone who spends any money on this game has a reasonable expectation of being entertained. This gentleman obviously is no longer feeling like that expectation is being fulfilled and I can't say as I blame him. If the developer had any sense of responsibility to it's customer base, we wouldn't see this sort of thread. Regrettably, that is just not the case.
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Post by WilsonK on Jul 11, 2017 23:25:27 GMT -5
Hahaha!! All in all, it's just a game afterall! Real-life responsibilities are still priority Ah, but of course! However, we DO really need to hold the people from whom we purchase services responsible for their products. Anyone who spends any money on this game has a reasonable expectation of being entertained. This gentleman obviously is no longer feeling like that expectation is being fulfilled and I can't say as I blame him. If the developer had any sense of responsibility to it's customer base, we wouldn't see this sort of thread. Regrettably, that is just not the case. And sadly, a lot of games these days are IAP, and they don't really respond very well towards customer base..
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Post by Danny Linguini on Jul 12, 2017 12:38:02 GMT -5
ENOUGH!!!!! I've finally had it with this 「fluffernutter」ing game. Been getting teamed against Diamond and Expert leagues all day, of course when I need to win games. Setting new records every game for the time it takes to mech out all 5 bots. I am NOT in the LQ, at least I'd better not be, because I have not left a game in weeks. This is not fun, this is not relaxing or enjoyable. Squadding is no better -- if anything it's worse. Game deleted. I'm not sure what I'm more pissed off about, the 「fluffernutter」ed up game play, or the hours I've wasted thinking I'd actually get somewhere in it. 「fluffernutter」 this game, 「fluffernutter」 Pixonic.
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Post by mandapan on Jul 12, 2017 18:03:02 GMT -5
ENOUGH!!!!! I've finally had it with this ?firetruck?ing game. Been getting teamed against Diamond and Expert leagues all day, of course when I need to win games. Setting new records every game for the time it takes to mech out all 5 bots. I am NOT in the LQ, at least I'd better not be, because I have not left a game in weeks. This is not fun, this is not relaxing or enjoyable. Squadding is no better -- if anything it's worse. Game deleted. I'm not sure what I'm more pissed off about, the ?firetruck?ed up game play, or the hours I've wasted thinking I'd actually get somewhere in it. ?firetruck? this game, ?firetruck? Pixonic. It's such a simple game though! All you have to do is pay them and then you can buy those special robots that totally dominate all the robots you can buy with accessible game commodities. Otherwise, you can employ the 'strategy' of running and hiding the entire game, taking pot-shots from a distance that have no appreciable effect, until they eventually hunt you down. Simple! This game is like a self-esteem crutch for anyone willing to pay Pixonic. Yeah you guys are great gamers alright. This BS is a ridiculous waste of time. There should be no way to purchase any sort of tactical edge in the game, but since there is, it's not a game at all, it's a scam.
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Post by Danny Linguini on Jul 12, 2017 21:23:41 GMT -5
ENOUGH!!!!! I've finally had it with this ?firetruck?ing game. Been getting teamed against Diamond and Expert leagues all day, of course when I need to win games. Setting new records every game for the time it takes to mech out all 5 bots. I am NOT in the LQ, at least I'd better not be, because I have not left a game in weeks. This is not fun, this is not relaxing or enjoyable. Squadding is no better -- if anything it's worse. Game deleted. I'm not sure what I'm more pissed off about, the ?firetruck?ed up game play, or the hours I've wasted thinking I'd actually get somewhere in it. ?firetruck? this game, ?firetruck? Pixonic. It's such a simple game though! All you have to do is pay them and then you can buy those special robots that totally dominate all the robots you can buy with accessible game commodities. Otherwise, you can employ the 'strategy' of running and hiding the entire game, taking pot-shots from a distance that have no appreciable effect, until they eventually hunt you down. Simple! This game is like a self-esteem crutch for anyone willing to pay Pixonic. Yeah you guys are great gamers alright. This BS is a ridiculous waste of time. There should be no way to purchase any sort of tactical edge in the game, but since there is, it's not a game at all, it's a scam. It's not even the paying players -- it's the bull「dookie」 matchups. I've said it before, I have no problem taking the losses with the wins. I do have a problem being set up with zero chance of even being competitive, because everyone around me is leagues and levels above me and my hangar. I'm at Gold I, and almost every game this morning had maybe one or two other Gold league players, the rest were Diamond and Expert. I can tell, because no matter which bot I used, I was getting shredded in one or two salvos, while I was registering very little damage, even with clean shots on away-facing targets. One game all 5 bots were meched out in under 4 minutes. Even playing cautiously, as soon as I'd take a shot, they were all over me from out of nowhere, like my bots had a big sign on their 「bum-bum」 saying 'Gold level - kick here'.
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maxboxer
GI. Patton
Posts: 148
Karma: 27
Pilot name: maxboxer
Platform: Android
Clan: Black Ops3
League: Gold
Server Region: Europe
Favorite robot: carnage
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Post by maxboxer on Jul 13, 2017 3:21:43 GMT -5
1) in my opinion you're highly underestimate the work that stay behind a game like this... Have only to think about there is a developer team(mostly composed by ex pixonic...) that are working from months and they're not still able to let run out for player... I'm talkin'about battle titan of course. 2)this is not a here and now game... This is a game of patience. Play enough time will give you the gold you 're looking for. I:m running an hangar with gold bots... I' ve built it playing and not putting here loads of real money.. I've put some on it, I work and thanks God (whatever is your God) I can put a little in it... But we're talking about 50 $in 9 months.... 3)the matchmaker is?poo-poo?, and that's a fact... But it's ?poo-poo? for everyone, I think we all have passed through this...
4)if you get a look at the hangar of top players, you will notice that they use a lot of griffin, 1,5m of silver... In a few hours of playing you can buy one.
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maxboxer
GI. Patton
Posts: 148
Karma: 27
Pilot name: maxboxer
Platform: Android
Clan: Black Ops3
League: Gold
Server Region: Europe
Favorite robot: carnage
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Post by maxboxer on Jul 13, 2017 3:42:11 GMT -5
Last but not least, join a good clan can help you a lot... Squad with other people that have a clear idea of what they have to do in battle is much better than random Squadding whit ones that don't know what they 're playing...
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Post by Danny Linguini on Jul 14, 2017 14:15:37 GMT -5
Alright, I must acquiesce. Yes I'm still miffed at the stupid MM and rampant tanking that take a lot of the fun out of the game, but I spent quit a few hours over the last month and a half that I decided I didn't want to completely throw away. So re-installed yesterday and I've been trying to overlook those negatives and grind through the event challenges and see what I can wring out of it. Been adjusting my hangar for the current tasks (how about 5 cossacks for beacon capping?!), and just trying to roll with it from there. So you guys are just gonna have to deal with my 「female dog」ing for a little while longer, at least for the next few days before I go back to work.
Oh yeah, and I just got the Carnage from the challenge ... getting free stuff has a way of taking a little bit of the edge off.
But MM is still 「dookie」. And so are tankers.
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Post by mandapan on Jul 21, 2017 19:08:57 GMT -5
Uninstalling this crap now. The events are such a scam, just like this game in general.
BTW, to whoever told me using Unity would be a downgrade or reduce audience or whatever, newsflash: War Robots is already a Unity game.
I'll keep working on my game project between other paying projects, as is I'm leaning more towards 'giant robots versus giant monsters' than just giant robots, that gets dull after a while.
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