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Post by Tatamat on Jan 17, 2018 8:46:11 GMT -5
Guys,
maybe I'm missing something.
Back in the old days, weapons were balanced so that medium weapon was 1.5x stronger than light, and heavy 2x stronger than light.
Looking at the shotgun series damage (and using lvl 12 numbers from Wiki):
Gust: 10 k/s
Storm: 12.4 k/s, "recalculated" to Gust rate (i.e. /1.5) => 8.3 k/s
Thunder: 14.7 k/s, "recalculated" to Gust rate (i.e. /2) => 7.4 k/s
As far as I know, properties of the shotguns (spread, recharge when firing, etc.) should be more or less the same.
If all the above is correct, then Storm is by 17 % weaker than its equivalent in Gusts, and Thunder by 26 %!
Example #1: Thunder Fury (though a theoretical example) @ 44.1 k/s equals to Storm Gust Griffin @ 44.8 k/s and Thunder Gust Leo @ 44.7 k/s even though Griffin and Leo used to be 1 light weapon less powerful than Fury (and have some other advantages).
Example #2: Thunder Carny @ 29.4 k/s is seriously overpowered by Gust Patton @ 40 k/s, having both 4 light-equivalent weapons.
For sure, many other better examples could be found.
Is there any other trick?
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Post by ⓣⓡⓘⓒⓚⓨ48 on Jan 17, 2018 11:33:41 GMT -5
Guys, maybe I'm missing something. Back in the old days, weapons were balanced so that medium weapon was 1.5x stronger than light, and heavy 2x stronger than light. Looking at the shotgun series damage (and using lvl 12 numbers from Wiki): Gust: 10 k/s Storm: 12.4 k/s, "recalculated" to Gust rate (i.e. /1.5) => 8.3 k/s Thunder: 14.7 k/s, "recalculated" to Gust rate (i.e. /2) => 7.4 k/s As far as I know, properties of the shotguns (spread, recharge when firing, etc.) should be more or less the same. If all the above is correct, then Storm is by 17 % weaker than its equivalent in Gusts, and Thunder by 26 %! Example #1: Thunder Fury (though a theoretical example) @ 44.1 k/s equals to Storm Gust Griffin @ 44.8 k/s and Thunder Gust Leo @ 44.7 k/s even though Griffin and Leo used to be 1 light weapon less powerful than Fury (and have some other advantages). Example #2: Thunder Carny @ 29.4 k/s is seriously overpowered by Gust Patton @ 40 k/s, having both 4 light-equivalent weapons. For sure, many other better examples could be found. Is there any other trick? IDK but after reading this I am seriously considering throwing 3 of them on a Gepard and seeing what I can do... or 3 on a Leo with whatever heavy equipment I have available, Ancile or Thunder. Light bot kill tasks may be doable with little effort if this is the case. Or I may finally go Stalker... Possibilities. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2018 13:15:08 GMT -5
There are sooooo many things that are completely out of balance in this game, so I wouldn't even think about balance anymore. It's not part of the game  |
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Post by krebby on Jan 17, 2018 13:17:53 GMT -5
Does anyone know how many pellets the Gust and Storm fire per shot? We know the Thunder fires 16, both because it is provided in the wiki and from screenshots. But the wiki does not provide pellet counts for the Storm or Gust, and I haven't seen any screenshots from which we can count them.
My hunch is that the weapons do not fire the same number of pellets, but I'd like to know for sure.
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Post by seanh on Jan 17, 2018 13:26:22 GMT -5
Gepard will be the new carnage and a Natasha could be the most powerful bot in the game.
that’s nuts.
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Post by βเg קคקค קย๓ק on Jan 17, 2018 13:32:59 GMT -5
I don't like Storm. I feel it is very unbalanced. It does little to no damage unless an enemy bot is kissing your bot. Gust on the other hand, I use on a Hover with Punishers to drop shields and hopefully drop some health for other bots to take energy shield bots out. Gust does well against shields and decent at medium range. Storm is just a knife fighting weapon with little to no range at all. If you are a team player and like dropping shields and some health on energy shield bots...use Gust. Leave the Storms to knife fighters.
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Post by frunobulax on Jan 17, 2018 16:55:01 GMT -5
Gepard will be the new carnage and a Natasha could be the most powerful bot in the game. If they are buffed to 200k HP and 60 speed each, yes  Gepard is way too squishy, Natty way too slow. If you can keep 150-200m distance then the Gust is no problem. And Tatamat, all premium (especially component based) weapons/bots are more efficient than their "free" counterparts. Even Orkan does 3 times the damage of a Pinata (burst). And I don't see a Gust Gepard or Patton beating out the Thunder Carnage anytime soon. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2018 18:00:41 GMT -5
Gust is seriously overpowered, a Stalker with two gusts at mk2 has 24k dps. Just have a look at one of the manni videos.
He killed 5 DB Griffin and a DB lancelot using Stalker only! And that too in champion leauge.
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Post by ⓣⓡⓘⓒⓚⓨ48 on Jan 17, 2018 18:13:15 GMT -5
Gepard will be the new carnage and a Natasha could be the most powerful bot in the game. If they are buffed to 200k HP and 60 speed each, yes Gepard is way too squishy, Natty way too slow. If you can keep 150-200m distance then the Gust is no problem. And Tatamat , all premium (especially component based) weapons/bots are more efficient than their "free" counterparts. Even Orkan does 3 times the damage of a Pinata (burst). And I don't see a Gust Gepard or Patton beating out the Thunder Carnage anytime soon. Not too sure about that... if the Gepard can get in close enough to negate the Shield then Gusts have a higher RoF that is high enough to give it more DPS over 10 seconds. And Geps are nimble. IF the Carnage hits "Rush" and manages to keep dancing then it could go either way... but 3 Gust on a fast and agile platform like the Gep is not something to be ignored. I will see if I can get some help in running a comparison. Like the beginning of the thread said, it appears that the Gust not only keeps up with the Thunder but surpasses it. If the Carnage misses... the circling Gep has the advantages: Gusts are easier to aim and fire much quicker. I vote Gep. (I beat higher level Thunder Carnages with my TGS Golem all the time.) |
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Post by r2d2 on Jan 17, 2018 19:00:26 GMT -5
I have a level 10 golem equipped with L12 thunder, L6 storm and L7 gust. Total of 22,936 damage capabilities. It’s my new fave!!!
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Post by Gdu4ever on Jan 17, 2018 21:14:31 GMT -5
Does anyone know how many pellets the Gust and Storm fire per shot? We know the Thunder fires 16, both because it is provided in the wiki and from screenshots. But the wiki does not provide pellet counts for the Storm or Gust, and I haven't seen any screenshots from which we can count them. My hunch is that the weapons do not fire the same number of pellets, but I'd like to know for sure. Gust has 4 pellets per shot, if I do the math correctly. Not bothering Storm. |
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Post by hjn on Jan 18, 2018 8:29:01 GMT -5
I have a level 10 golem equipped with L12 thunder, L6 storm and L7 gust. Total of 22,936 damage capabilities. It’s my new fave!!! My opener too |
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Post by krebby on Jan 18, 2018 10:30:41 GMT -5
Does anyone know how many pellets the Gust and Storm fire per shot? We know the Thunder fires 16, both because it is provided in the wiki and from screenshots. But the wiki does not provide pellet counts for the Storm or Gust, and I haven't seen any screenshots from which we can count them. My hunch is that the weapons do not fire the same number of pellets, but I'd like to know for sure. Gust has 4 pellets per shot, if I do the math correctly. Not bothering Storm. What do you mean by "do the math correctly"? Is there a mathematical way to calculate the number of shots based on the information we know? Or did you run an experiment like looking at screen shots of the blast, or look at damage from a controlled shot or something? EDIT: Did you look at the weapon's art? I never thought to count the number of barrels before, but the Gust appears to have 4. I then counted the Thunder and it does have 16 (in three rows: the top row of 5; middle row of 6; bottom row of 5)—and we know from the wiki and screen shots that it does, indeed, fire 16 pellets. The Storm has 8 barrels. This helps. Thus, at Mk1 level 12: - Gust fires 4 pellets; each pellet deals 1,250; potentially dealing 5,000 per shot
- Storm fires 8 pellets; each pellet deals ; potentially dealing 8,832 per shot
- Gust fires 16 pellets; each pellet deals 920; potentially dealing 14,720 per shot
In terms of burst DPS: - Gust deals 10,000
- Storm deals 12,365
- Thunder deals 14,720
So yes, I had not realized the Gust was so terrifying. Assuming the Gust has a pellet spread similar to a Thunder, you really do want to get closer than 100m and start firing away. I can see why the Stalker would be a great bot with which to pair Gusts. |
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Post by bronzeknee on Jan 18, 2018 13:36:17 GMT -5
Gust has 4 pellets per shot, if I do the math correctly. Not bothering Storm. What do you mean by "do the math correctly"? Is there a mathematical way to calculate the number of shots based on the information we know? Or did you run an experiment like looking at screen shots of the blast, or look at damage from a controlled shot or something? EDIT: Did you look at the weapon's art? I never thought to count the number of barrels before, but the Gust appears to have 4. I then counted the Thunder and it does have 16 (in three rows: the top row of 5; middle row of 6; bottom row of 5)—and we know from the wiki and screen shots that it does, indeed, fire 16 pellets. The Storm has 8 barrels. This helps. Thus, at Mk1 level 12: - Gust fires 4 pellets; each pellet deals 1,250; potentially dealing 5,000 per shot
- Storm fires 8 pellets; each pellet deals ; potentially dealing 8,832 per shot
- Gust fires 16 pellets; each pellet deals 920; potentially dealing 14,720 per shot
In terms of burst DPS: - Gust deals 10,000
- Storm deals 12,365
- Thunder deals 14,720
So yes, I had not realized the Gust was so terrifying. Assuming the Gust has a pellet spread similar to a Thunder, you really do want to get closer than 100m and start firing away. I can see why the Stalker would be a great bot with which to pair Gusts. I took my Thunders out of my lineup and sold the one I was saving that I hadn't upgraded yet. The Storm and Gust are so much stronger. |
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Post by maverick on Jan 18, 2018 14:09:04 GMT -5
Gust is seriously overpowered, a Stalker with two gusts at mk2 has 24k dps. Just have a look at one of the manni videos. He killed 5 DB Griffin and a DB lancelot using Stalker only! And that too in champion leauge. Don't forget those Gust's are mk 2 lvl 12 |
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Post by stokr on Jan 18, 2018 16:19:54 GMT -5
I dunno...I've got 3 L12 Storms and have toyed with them on a few different bots. While they are very, very dangerous they are also a challenge to be consistently successful with, because you really need to be sub 100m to get that awesome damage. I don't think they're unbalanced because of that. My current active Storm build is a 12/12 Kumiho.
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Post by Gdu4ever on Jan 18, 2018 19:50:43 GMT -5
Gust has 4 pellets per shot, if I do the math correctly. Not bothering Storm. What do you mean by "do the math correctly"? Is there a mathematical way to calculate the number of shots based on the information we know? Or did you run an experiment like looking at screen shots of the blast, or look at damage from a controlled shot or something? EDIT: Did you look at the weapon's art? I never thought to count the number of barrels before, but the Gust appears to have 4. I then counted the Thunder and it does have 16 (in three rows: the top row of 5; middle row of 6; bottom row of 5)—and we know from the wiki and screen shots that it does, indeed, fire 16 pellets. The Storm has 8 barrels. This helps. Thus, at Mk1 level 12: - Gust fires 4 pellets; each pellet deals 1,250; potentially dealing 5,000 per shot
- Storm fires 8 pellets; each pellet deals ; potentially dealing 8,832 per shot
- Gust fires 16 pellets; each pellet deals 920; potentially dealing 14,720 per shot
In terms of burst DPS: - Gust deals 10,000
- Storm deals 12,365
- Thunder deals 14,720
So yes, I had not realized the Gust was so terrifying. Assuming the Gust has a pellet spread similar to a Thunder, you really do want to get closer than 100m and start firing away. I can see why the Stalker would be a great bot with which to pair Gusts. Good question. According to warrobots.wikia.com/wiki/Gust, L12 is at 5000 dmg per shot. According to warrobots.net/en/equipments/33, L12 is at 1250 dmg per particle. 5000/1250 = 4 pellets. |
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Post by Pulse Hadron on Jan 18, 2018 20:09:38 GMT -5
Yes, the weapon barrel is not cosmetic, it shows the actual number of pellets that fly out. And for the Thunder it’s where the pellets actually fly out, you can see the pattern on a wall, with some jiggle. Haven’t tested Storm or Gust yet but I assume they emanate in their pattern. It’s this kind of detail why I dig this game.
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Post by AVC on Jan 18, 2018 22:00:21 GMT -5
The shotgun's damage (and the Punisher/Molot) is dependant on many things.
In my other thread about weapon damage I mentioned I was going to do the projectile weapons.
I have done some tests on the Thunder, and the damage is:
Range dependant (in a big way). Going from 200m down to 100m you will do double the damage.
Target size dependant (you will do 50-80% MORE damage to a Leo than a Patton for example).
Wind direction? During my testing no two shots did the same damage even though both bots were stationary. The variances were minor, but still there.
I might get the results of the Thunder up tonight.
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Post by WilsonK on Jan 18, 2018 22:12:58 GMT -5
Guys, maybe I'm missing something. Back in the old days, weapons were balanced so that medium weapon was 1.5x stronger than light, and heavy 2x stronger than light. Looking at the shotgun series damage (and using lvl 12 numbers from Wiki): Gust: 10 k/s Storm: 12.4 k/s, "recalculated" to Gust rate (i.e. /1.5) => 8.3 k/s Thunder: 14.7 k/s, "recalculated" to Gust rate (i.e. /2) => 7.4 k/s As far as I know, properties of the shotguns (spread, recharge when firing, etc.) should be more or less the same. If all the above is correct, then Storm is by 17 % weaker than its equivalent in Gusts, and Thunder by 26 %! Example #1: Thunder Fury (though a theoretical example) @ 44.1 k/s equals to Storm Gust Griffin @ 44.8 k/s and Thunder Gust Leo @ 44.7 k/s even though Griffin and Leo used to be 1 light weapon less powerful than Fury (and have some other advantages). Example #2: Thunder Carny @ 29.4 k/s is seriously overpowered by Gust Patton @ 40 k/s, having both 4 light-equivalent weapons. For sure, many other better examples could be found. Is there any other trick? IDK but after reading this I am seriously considering throwing 3 of them on a Gepard and seeing what I can do... or 3 on a Leo with whatever heavy equipment I have available, Ancile or Thunder. Light bot kill tasks may be doable with little effort if this is the case. Or I may finally go Stalker... Possibilities. Trust me on this, I recently came across a Stalker with Gusts, little bugger was ejaculating his projectiles so fast on me while on stealth, took out half of my Fury's HP. |
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Post by fizbanrapper on Jan 23, 2018 8:37:50 GMT -5
Stalker gust is awesome. I love that it adds some variety to the game. Death button and ember setups actually have a legit counter under 300 meters.
It's a lot of fun to play, but isn't that hard to kill. Main reason people get killed by it is that that don't respect it enough.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 23, 2018 8:49:21 GMT -5
Stalker gust is awesome. I love that it adds some variety to the game. Death button and ember setups actually have a legit counter under 300 meters. It's a lot of fun to play, but isn't that hard to kill. Main reason people get killed by it is that that don't respect it enough. I agree with everything you said. I would love a Gust Stalker too, but I can't "waste" my WSP on them...although I think it's much more useful than the Storm. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 23, 2018 8:51:06 GMT -5
Guys, maybe I'm missing something. Back in the old days, weapons were balanced so that medium weapon was 1.5x stronger than light, and heavy 2x stronger than light. Looking at the shotgun series damage (and using lvl 12 numbers from Wiki): Gust: 10 k/s Storm: 12.4 k/s, "recalculated" to Gust rate (i.e. /1.5) => 8.3 k/s Thunder: 14.7 k/s, "recalculated" to Gust rate (i.e. /2) => 7.4 k/s As far as I know, properties of the shotguns (spread, recharge when firing, etc.) should be more or less the same. If all the above is correct, then Storm is by 17 % weaker than its equivalent in Gusts, and Thunder by 26 %! Example #1: Thunder Fury (though a theoretical example) @ 44.1 k/s equals to Storm Gust Griffin @ 44.8 k/s and Thunder Gust Leo @ 44.7 k/s even though Griffin and Leo used to be 1 light weapon less powerful than Fury (and have some other advantages). Example #2: Thunder Carny @ 29.4 k/s is seriously overpowered by Gust Patton @ 40 k/s, having both 4 light-equivalent weapons. For sure, many other better examples could be found. Is there any other trick? IDK but after reading this I am seriously considering throwing 3 of them on a Gepard and seeing what I can do... or 3 on a Leo with whatever heavy equipment I have available, Ancile or Thunder. Light bot kill tasks may be doable with little effort if this is the case. Or I may finally go Stalker... Possibilities. Everybody knows, you never go full Stalker. |
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theolodger
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Pilot name: Theolodger
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Clan: [2G4U] 2Good4U
League: Silver
Server Region: Asia
Favorite robot: Haechi
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Post by theolodger on Jul 23, 2018 5:34:31 GMT -5
I have a level 10 golem equipped with L12 thunder, L6 storm and L7 gust. Total of 22,936 damage capabilities. It’s my new fave!!! I call it A very Gusty ThunderStorm |
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Post by go red on Jul 23, 2018 14:36:03 GMT -5
One thing you have missed: Storm and Gust are components weapon but Thunder is silver. So how can a silver weapon be more powerful than components weapon? It is against sane business decision and hurting economy of a gaming company! Seriously, out of the 3 Storm has the highest cycle damage and DPS, but only a little behind in burst when compare to Thunder. Storm is roughly 1.5x of Gust in cycle dmg: Mk1 lvl12 Cycle dmg: 77.7k vs 49.5k, but yes out of balance if we only look at DPS Guys, maybe I'm missing something. Back in the old days, weapons were balanced so that medium weapon was 1.5x stronger than light, and heavy 2x stronger than light. Looking at the shotgun series damage (and using lvl 12 numbers from Wiki): Gust: 10 k/s Storm: 12.4 k/s, "recalculated" to Gust rate (i.e. /1.5) => 8.3 k/s Thunder: 14.7 k/s, "recalculated" to Gust rate (i.e. /2) => 7.4 k/s As far as I know, properties of the shotguns (spread, recharge when firing, etc.) should be more or less the same. If all the above is correct, then Storm is by 17 % weaker than its equivalent in Gusts, and Thunder by 26 %! Example #1: Thunder Fury (though a theoretical example) @ 44.1 k/s equals to Storm Gust Griffin @ 44.8 k/s and Thunder Gust Leo @ 44.7 k/s even though Griffin and Leo used to be 1 light weapon less powerful than Fury (and have some other advantages). Example #2: Thunder Carny @ 29.4 k/s is seriously overpowered by Gust Patton @ 40 k/s, having both 4 light-equivalent weapons. For sure, many other better examples could be found. Is there any other trick? |
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