Thoughts on the Raijin Buff?

i'm kinda costipated with bonuses.

The Nazi inside me would put just a +10~15% buff to damage, but just to counter
negative effects of staying at range (for thunders, for example).

+50% is totally nuts and unbalanced, so unbalanced that would make other bots obsolete (fury).

a +20~25% would still be too strong to make the fury obsolete (2.4~2.5x fire power with tons of shield/hp, or 3x fire power with a weak body?)

a +10~15% would instead be good, but not too strong.
but really,anything over 15% would be gamebreaking for me.

It's suppose to be a little faster, but it doesn't avoid damage nearly as much as a Fury can. It's the bulk and the fact that it has to stand still in the open to use its special -- it can't use cover as well.

50% bonus is too much but I think they are heading in the right direction with this.

It needed something since it's barely used, but the 50% is a lot, it's be better if it was half of that.

I'm for the Raijin buff ... but, I'd also like to see the Fury get some kind of buff as well. Ever since the Natasha buff - the Fury doesn't seem much like a gold bot.

I won 4 fury's a while back and one will come out to play only once and a while. 

I voted 'no'. And I love the Raijin, use him, advocate for him. The bot doesn't need it, tbh. I't's just so many pilots don't know how to use it. This endless stream of 'hey, weapons plus 10%' and a month later 'hey bot health plus 10%.' Is much ado about running in a circle. But it sure creates the appearance of dynamic change. Also the stream of speed increases? We'll be in that original combat racing game concept in no time.

I am also of the opinion that Pix gonna do what Pix gonna do. So I'm prepping myself to keep on rolling with the punches.

I advocate for him too, but Pix nerfs him afterwards. So it's only fair they buff him and give him something back in return. I like the idea of another light or even medium hardpoint to make him competitive, but giving him a magical damage boost is even better since you don't need to upgrade and maintain additional weapons, plus not every heavy hardpoint has a comparable light hardpoint. Plus with their practice of overbuffin, I mean did the Gekkos need another buff? (answer is no), then it'll take a 50% buff for anyone to take another look at him. Even though we all know that something less is more balanced.

But don't worry, after the 50% buff, then in a few months they can nerf everything by buffing everything 30% or whatever and we can continue the cycle.

I doubt Pix will obsolete their cash bot Fury in favour of a WSP bot .  What about ancile ? Will that go up 50 percent too ?

I am all for buffs on my fave bot , not that i feel it needs a buff . This would be for lack of popularity not game balance .
You guys are jumping the gun . This was on a test server . If Raijin does indeed get a buff it wont be that .

They would probably pump his Armour because that aligns with  its purpose .

Was playing with them on the test server over the weekend. I had never used one before so I had one in the hanger in every game in the TS.

Would I buy one now and use it in the current configuration?, to be honest no. Would I get one if they buffed damage by 50%? Yes I would, but only due to the existence of tempests.

I tried just about everything on them on the TS. 90% of the games were on the new map to trying long range build was fairly pointless. I am no sniper anyway so probably couldn’t say much of use on it regardless. The only observation on some of the comments is on the speed v’s a Fury. I might have faster speed once it gets moving, but it doesn’t move, it has to be redeployed. Which is slow and leaves you vulnerable. You certainly aren’t moving in and out of cover, reposting slight for better shots etc, so can’t see how it would better a fury or butch as a pure sniper. But as I said, I am not one, so don’t know.

On short range builds, if any red was dumb enough to just Stroll into range, then yeah, thunders or the new flame throwers made short work of them, but of course the vast majority of red’s were smarter and it was just a real easy stationary target for anything that had range on you.

Mid range was where it was really useful, Zeus where good, tridents were good too, but tempests… Tempests were just savage. The problem with tempests is that you need a few of them and need to keep sustained fire for a while. While they range up to 800, they are much better at 600 and awesome at 400. Most of the bots that can carry them don’t have the durability to use them effectively inside 600m. A raijin in Bastian mode with a 50% damage duff is effectively 3 tempests that can happily sit in that 400 to 600 range and mow down anything that comes along.

I managed to get one set up set up on one of the side gantries on the new map about 400m off the red centre beacon, cleared it completely, anything that spawned in got obliterated to the point reds stopped spawning on it. Set one up on the home beacon in Shenzhen, it completely owner the square. Nothing could come anywhere near, reds had to come around the sides to take me out.

On the other side of the coin, there were Raijin all over the TS, so had plenty of experience taking them down. Two things of particular note. The decend bots made easy work of any short range builds or the few I seen with anciles. The armour piercing buff for machine guns is a bit nuts, the other bot I ran in just about every game was a punisher griffin, it was tearing raijins to bits all over the place. If that buff goes through they will be extinct real fast, probably followed by the rest of the shield bearing bots soon there after. On a side note, not sure how the dynamics of the new flame thrower work, but it appears to either just burn though shields or splashes around it, either way a carnage with two of them melts raijins (and lances) in short order.

So in short if it does go through in isolation then it will become my new mid ranger with tempests. If the ballistic / armour buff happens at the level being tested, then I will be running hangers full of griffins with as many machine guns as I can pack on to them.

But again, that tells a different tale than what it actually is. 

The Fujin's Raijin's greater speed applies when shield is down.  Firepower buff applies only when shield up, which also means that they are stationary.  It's not eclipsing the Fury... which is already being better challenged by the Butch.  I see this as a way to make Raijin more attractive/effective... but no matter how you slice it the Fury has its firepower at all times and can move at all times, while the Fujin must make a trade off for its better better-than-the-Fury attributes.  

In effect, it becomes a bunker that is almost perfectly paired with the Tempest.  It has to have sustained fire to do well and this promotes that without making it OP.  Especially if they do go through with that horrid bullet to shield multiplier as that will render the Raijin, and any shield bot for that matter, pointless.  (I still say it makes more sense to just do normal damage to shields but let a small percentage of the damage through to the HP... Armor Piercing rounds; as opposed to specially formulated ammo that is made to destroy 2x as much shield but do normal damage to unarmored stuff...? *scratches head*)

Don't know how I personally feel about the Raijin 50% Bastion damage buff idea, tbh, but I do know that the comparison between the two bots has to include the above caveats or it can be misleading.


IMO, YMMV

As a matter of fact, Raijin is a half-hearted firepower, it seemed like Camper, so buff like this should agree. Until now, Carnage was faster
leg.
So far, Thunder (and Anceil) Rijin has been tried to defend the beacon,
Becon dash will increase the utilization rate.

That's very interesting. This would make sense and it would be a unique mechanic.

The raijin should be interesting and powerful but not always better than a fury. Going into and out of bastion mode could take 5 seconds and be disabled during transformation. It would be like a Starcraft siege tank. Powerful while deployed but vulnerable while transforming. 

Yup... my mistake... will edit.  

And I agree about the Tulu Fuji, I like it a lot... but I like the RDB and DOC too... all 3 are useable and have their own strengths and weaknesses.  Which one is best for Tulu is debatable in my mind... I like being able to choose and still contribute meaningfully... not being stuck to a 1 size fits all bot.

I thought about that but one weapon even with a 50% buff is awfully weak. Also, it is unclear whether a 50% damage increase would have any effect on the ancile.

That could be pretty crazy with team coordination. Even 7.1 seconds would be hell if there are other teammates inside the sphere shooting back.

Despite the balance issues, I really like the idea of having the Raijin be extra potent in bastion mode. My secret robot fanboy just screams for it to happen.