TalkCocSingSongBlurLikeSotong
Destrier
Having a beer and killing reds
Posts: 108
Karma: 99
Pilot name: TalkCockSingSong
Platform: Android
Clan: Nova Rising [NovR]
League: Champion
Server Region: Asia
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Post by TalkCocSingSongBlurLikeSotong on Jun 25, 2017 1:57:02 GMT -5
Hi,
By weapon type I mean mixing energy, missile and/or bullet type weapons. For example, using 2x Taran and 2x Pinata on Griffin, or 2x Tulu and 2x Magnum. The latter case is undesirable as the ranges do not match though.
Or Thunder + Magnum Leo.
The reason I'm asking is because my hangar is low on energy weapons as I only started playing recently. I now have 2x Taran and 2x Magnum on a PDB Griffin. But I'm encountering problem when I'm using other bots such as RDB Griffin, Pinata Leo and Pin Leo with Ancile bots.
So I'm thinking of mixing them up ad such: - griffin with 2x Taran and 2x Pinata - Leo with thunder and 2x Magnum 1x Pinata (working on 3rd Magnum now)
While doing this allow me to tackle both shielded and Ancile bots, but the main problem is likely that, it's doing a bit of everything. In other words, not effective.
Any thoughts? And one question... How to handle a Ancilot? I don't seem to inflict any damage on it using missle weapon due to Ancile, while switching to PDB seems to be same result. Do I have t to attack its flank with PDB to avoid the physical shield?
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Post by nosinov on Jun 25, 2017 2:00:29 GMT -5
I wouldn't mix. Your half sheep, half wolf. You are only a half threat for any class with this build.
For Ancilelot: don't go alone and keep shooting it even with plasma. His shields will break.
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Post by Alanbit on Jun 25, 2017 2:41:35 GMT -5
The robot that grants me more points is a Leo with Thunder, Pinhata, Magnum and Aphid. I created this frankensbot very early in time, when my weaponry was really short and humble, the idea was to buy new weapons (magnums, and so on) as I got the WP, level them up, and then load them to my Leo and achieve an uniform setup.
But I did that and I got less damage dealt per match. The fact is that my frankenstein is able to shoot at everything, it spends 0 seconds dealing no damage and I will keep it this way.
But as everything in this game, it's a personal choice...
Ancilot: you'll need a thunder for the ancile, so team up and one of you keep shooting that thunder.
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Post by DarkVagabond on Jun 25, 2017 2:42:37 GMT -5
I understand the thinking. In theory it would be good to be able to damage Ancile and physical shields with one setup, but unfortunately you actually just dilute your effectiveness against both. This is the stage of skill development where you need to learn to be selective about your targets. If you have rockets you should be looking at the britbots (except Ancilot) and Rhino as if they are a meal. If you are in a plasma setup, you should be prioritising Carnage, Fujin and Ancilot (preferably when he's distracted/turned away). If you are a plasma setup hunting Galahads, you are wasting resources.
The Thunder weapon can be used effectively with both rocket and plasma setups, and the Thunder Magnum Leo or Thunder Pinata Leo are good examples of this. They are excellent setups against Ancilot. Thunders strip down Anciles VERY quickly. If you have the Thunder Pinata setup, make sure you fire the Thunder first before using the Pinatas. Once it's down you can unleash your rockets if you have them, or allow your teammates to take him down. The Thunder Mag Leo is one of my favourite setups. You should stay between 300 - 350m of any target to avoid Orks and Pinatas. Also try to get the Leo to at least lvl 9 as soon as you can. Then you can focus on levelling the Magnums.
Don't forget to cornershoot with the Mag Leo, particularly if you have to engage a Plasmahad (always cornershoot WITHOUT using your Thunder). You can press the two Magnum buttons in quick succession, then hold, then it will only shoot these two weapons consistently rather than wasting your Thunder by using the red alpha strike button. If you start to wear down their shield while they approach you, you want to do it behind cover where you can chip away at the shield without receiving any damage yourself. Always take advantage of getting free damage to a shield. He will either run away or chase you, in which case you have a fresh Thunder waiting for him at point blank range once he comes round the corner. This is the best way to strip their shield as fast as possible. In general you should avoid Gareth and Galahad in a Thunder Mag Leo, but it's not always possible and if you have to engage them this is the way to do it. You should prioritise Ancilot though, preferably paired up with a teammate. His shields are MUCH weaker than the other Britbots, and between your Magnums and Thunder they should break without too much trouble as long as he isn't maxed out.
Hope this helps,
DV
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Post by ΒΣRΖΣRKΛ²³ on Jun 25, 2017 2:49:37 GMT -5
Hi, By weapon type I mean mixing energy, missile and/or bullet type weapons. For example, using 2x Taran and 2x Pinata on Griffin, or 2x Tulu and 2x Magnum. The latter case is undesirable as the ranges do not match though. Or Thunder + Magnum Leo. The reason I'm asking is because my hangar is low on energy weapons as I only started playing recently. I now have 2x Taran and 2x Magnum on a PDB Griffin. But I'm encountering problem when I'm using other bots such as RDB Griffin, Pinata Leo and Pin Leo with Ancile bots. So I'm thinking of mixing them up ad such: - griffin with 2x Taran and 2x Pinata - Leo with thunder and 2x Magnum 1x Pinata (working on 3rd Magnum now) While doing this allow me to tackle both shielded and Ancile bots, but the main problem is likely that, it's doing a bit of everything. In other words, not effective. Any thoughts? And one question... How to handle a Ancilot? I don't seem to inflict any damage on it using missle weapon due to Ancile, while switching to PDB seems to be same result. Do I have t to attack its flank with PDB to avoid the physical shield? Well if you have not enough for a full set, what can you do ? I ran a taran magnum aphid Orkan griffin for quite some time, because I didn't have a second Orkan and aphid. I also ran that leo too with only 2 mags. Sure it wasn't perfect, but I did kill some.important is the range.. Problem is though that it makes it harder to find a perfect match for your setup. But piñatas come at level 5 and are easy to upgrade, so you might just strap 3 of em on your Leo. That setup works quite well.
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Post by drake1588 on Jun 25, 2017 15:30:30 GMT -5
Hi, By weapon type I mean mixing energy, missile and/or bullet type weapons. For example, using 2x Taran and 2x Pinata on Griffin, or 2x Tulu and 2x Magnum. The latter case is undesirable as the ranges do not match though. Or Thunder + Magnum Leo. The reason I'm asking is because my hangar is low on energy weapons as I only started playing recently. I now have 2x Taran and 2x Magnum on a PDB Griffin. But I'm encountering problem when I'm using other bots such as RDB Griffin, Pinata Leo and Pin Leo with Ancile bots. So I'm thinking of mixing them up ad such: - griffin with 2x Taran and 2x Pinata - Leo with thunder and 2x Magnum 1x Pinata (working on 3rd Magnum now) While doing this allow me to tackle both shielded and Ancile bots, but the main problem is likely that, it's doing a bit of everything. In other words, not effective. Any thoughts? And one question... How to handle a Ancilot? I don't seem to inflict any damage on it using missle weapon due to Ancile, while switching to PDB seems to be same result. Do I have t to attack its flank with PDB to avoid the physical shield? I think we all go through what you're describing at some point. My best advice here is to make a plan of what you want long term, and build your bots towards that goal. Don't upgrade weapons you absolutely won't be using later, but don't be afraid to buy some extra thunders, pins, pinatas,or tulumbas to fill up weapon slots for the time being. I would leave your PDB Griffin as a full set. Leo can easily be used as a thunders/pin or thunder/pinata right out of the box with him at level 6 and the weapons at 5. It won't be top damage, but you don't waste valuable time upgrading weapons or bots you won't use later. RDB Griff out of the box is particularly effective and reasonably cheap. Without knowing your hangar specifics/tier, it is hard to give sound advice as to what order to do things in, or what purchases might be worth making. I attacking an ancilot with a PDB griff, flanking an already engaged one is preferable.
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Post by Russel on Jun 25, 2017 15:37:06 GMT -5
Hi, By weapon type I mean mixing energy, missile and/or bullet type weapons. For example, using 2x Taran and 2x Pinata on Griffin, or 2x Tulu and 2x Magnum. The latter case is undesirable as the ranges do not match though. Or Thunder + Magnum Leo. The reason I'm asking is because my hangar is low on energy weapons as I only started playing recently. I now have 2x Taran and 2x Magnum on a PDB Griffin. But I'm encountering problem when I'm using other bots such as RDB Griffin, Pinata Leo and Pin Leo with Ancile bots. So I'm thinking of mixing them up ad such: - griffin with 2x Taran and 2x Pinata - Leo with thunder and 2x Magnum 1x Pinata (working on 3rd Magnum now) While doing this allow me to tackle both shielded and Ancile bots, but the main problem is likely that, it's doing a bit of everything. In other words, not effective. Any thoughts? And one question... How to handle a Ancilot? I don't seem to inflict any damage on it using missle weapon due to Ancile, while switching to PDB seems to be same result. Do I have t to attack its flank with PDB to avoid the physical shield? My pretty successful build was Thunder+2Pinata+Magum Leo. I tried running 3xMagnum setup, but don't like it at all. Got this bot (actually, two of them) all the way up to the Diamond2 without any problem. Pinata, Magnum and Thunder all got ~same range, and Thunder\Pinata are good for an ambush. The reason for Magnum was simple - I started seeing TONS of _almost_ killed Fujins, with full shield; and the same with Carnages. More than that, there is a good setup for a Rhino (controversial bot by itself) - Hellfire Rhino; 2xOrkans +2Magnums. The reason is that you can deal nice damage with your shield up, while you are protecting yourself from enemy fire. Another good example is Stuka Griffin: Aphids+Orkans. It's basically mix in several ways: Homing+Dumbfire; Normal+Splash, 350+300 range. And once again, it has it's merits. You are almost DB in terms of burst damage, but got +50m range, and can shoot enemy undercover.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 25, 2017 18:18:53 GMT -5
Mixing ranges is OK as long as the range disparities isn't more than 50m.
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Post by Firebeard on Jun 25, 2017 19:25:32 GMT -5
Mixing ranges is OK as long as the range disparities isn't more than 50m. For me, I chose Damage for close range. For example, 'Doc uses Hydra/Orkans. I launch the Hydras' at damn near every Opponent, unless a Teammate is in need. As the Enemy approaches, I switch to Orkans - scares the begeezus outta them and they usually back off. So, my opinion is, if you mix ranges make sure that you have defensive capabilities as well. Otherwise, you're at tactical disadvantage and the Enemy can and will capitalize on it ..
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Post by noobcake on Jun 25, 2017 19:26:49 GMT -5
Some folks think using a mixed setup is a "counter" to everything when in reality it halves weapon effectiveness. Direct targeting with plasma is not possible while leading rocket fire. Inevitably you are either firing only one weapon at a time or worse, you fire both and miss with one set. The same principle is in effect with large range disparity. Half your weapons are out of range or you are closer than you want to be with your weapon type (example Taran hydra Griffin from 350m). The only exceptions here for mixed weapon types are ones with compatible lock-on features and similar range (aphid pairs well with both rockets and plasma). It is for these reasons that I would steer clear of mixed weapon types and follow DarkVagabond recommendations. Use weapons with compatible range and targeting requirements and compensate for enemy counters with better target selection.
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Post by cakeordeath on Jun 25, 2017 20:10:54 GMT -5
Mixing ranges is OK as long as the range disparities isn't more than 50m. Thunders and punishers mix just fine with the 300-350m stuff since their damage drops off with range, making their 500m top range really viable only against energy shields.
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Post by Thunderkiss on Jun 25, 2017 20:57:06 GMT -5
The only real successful build I can think of off the top of my head is the stuka, aka aphids and orkans on a Griffin. The rest, people defend but don't hold much merit.
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Post by drake1588 on Jun 25, 2017 21:17:36 GMT -5
The only real successful build I can think of off the top of my head is the stuka, aka aphids and orkans on a Griffin. The rest, people defend but don't hold much merit. Pretty sure that is the only one as well., unless you count Thorkan lance. I don't count it as mixed range myself given the next paragraph. Can make an argument for thunder +pinata or aphid Leo, but he's substandard, and really, the thunder is mostly just ancile stripping beyond the range of the other weapons. Plus, it doesn't suffer the problems of other setups where you can't afford to fire all weapons at once, a single time, since the first thunder reload is very quick and does so while firing.
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Post by mijapi300 on Jun 25, 2017 22:46:28 GMT -5
As far as mixing plasma with splash, it's a catch-22. It also depends on your league. Once you get to Diamond (iOS) or upper Silver (Android), most reds you see will either have Ancile or physical shields. This means that against most of the bots you're going to face, you're only half as effective as you could be.
Some will say, "it's better to be 50% against everyone rather than all or nothing". That's not an accurate statement though. When you're 100% effective against some, and 0% effective against others, you can make your gameplan to attack those 100% targets and avoid the 0% targets. When you're 50% against everyone, you can't gameplan for that. You're simply 50% as effective as you could be, no matter what you do - only luck can help you, as in getting lucky enough to run into a lot of bots with no shield at all.
I believe the above addresses your question, but I'll touch on ranges a little as well. Mixing ranges generally isn't a good idea, sometimes even 50m differences. The Taran/Piñata setup is a good example. There's no reason to not start firing Tarans at 350m, but to do so and not waste your Pinatas, you have to click both side buttons quickly without accidentally hitting the red button or either of the pinatas. It's possible, but adds a level of difficulty you shouldn't have to deal with, and doesn't have any tangible benefit to compensate for that. Thunder is a benchmark weapon that you can mix with any short ranged weapon, because it really serves its own purpose, and becomes more effective as you get closer.
Basically, any time you're mixing ranges, you're going to have to be good at firing individual sets of weapons and then hitting the red button at the right time. So ask yourself - does this setup provide an advantage that makes it worth the difficulty using it?
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Post by BastionOW on Jun 26, 2017 12:12:33 GMT -5
Hi, By weapon type I mean mixing energy, missile and/or bullet type weapons. For example, using 2x Taran and 2x Pinata on Griffin, or 2x Tulu and 2x Magnum. The latter case is undesirable as the ranges do not match though. Or Thunder + Magnum Leo. The reason I'm asking is because my hangar is low on energy weapons as I only started playing recently. I now have 2x Taran and 2x Magnum on a PDB Griffin. But I'm encountering problem when I'm using other bots such as RDB Griffin, Pinata Leo and Pin Leo with Ancile bots. So I'm thinking of mixing them up ad such: - griffin with 2x Taran and 2x Pinata - Leo with thunder and 2x Magnum 1x Pinata (working on 3rd Magnum now) While doing this allow me to tackle both shielded and Ancile bots, but the main problem is likely that, it's doing a bit of everything. In other words, not effective. Any thoughts? And one question... How to handle a Ancilot? I don't seem to inflict any damage on it using missle weapon due to Ancile, while switching to PDB seems to be same result. Do I have t to attack its flank with PDB to avoid the physical shield? There's nothing wrong with mixing weapon types. There are lots of builds which successfully mix weapon types/ranges such as the Orkan/Aphid Griff, the Thunder Orkan Lance, and the Orkan/Magnum Rhino. The mixing of that actually help make the build stronger. The Thunder Orkan Lance could use the Thunder to blast an Ancilot shield down then use the Orkans to unleash hell. Also, you asked about ways to take out the Ancilot, and apparently you don't have any Orkans, so a Thunder Pinata Leo can be a great substitute.
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Post by noobcake on Jun 26, 2017 21:52:02 GMT -5
Hi, By weapon type I mean mixing energy, missile and/or bullet type weapons. For example, using 2x Taran and 2x Pinata on Griffin, or 2x Tulu and 2x Magnum. The latter case is undesirable as the ranges do not match though. Or Thunder + Magnum Leo. The reason I'm asking is because my hangar is low on energy weapons as I only started playing recently. I now have 2x Taran and 2x Magnum on a PDB Griffin. But I'm encountering problem when I'm using other bots such as RDB Griffin, Pinata Leo and Pin Leo with Ancile bots. So I'm thinking of mixing them up ad such: - griffin with 2x Taran and 2x Pinata - Leo with thunder and 2x Magnum 1x Pinata (working on 3rd Magnum now) While doing this allow me to tackle both shielded and Ancile bots, but the main problem is likely that, it's doing a bit of everything. In other words, not effective. Any thoughts? And one question... How to handle a Ancilot? I don't seem to inflict any damage on it using missle weapon due to Ancile, while switching to PDB seems to be same result. Do I have t to attack its flank with PDB to avoid the physical shield? There's nothing wrong with mixing weapon types. There are lots of builds which successfully mix weapon types/ranges such as the Orkan/Aphid Griff, the Thunder Orkan Lance, and the Orkan/Magnum Rhino. The mixing of that actually help make the build stronger. The Thunder Orkan Lance could use the Thunder to blast an Ancilot shield down then use the Orkans to unleash hell. Also, you asked about ways to take out the Ancilot, and apparently you don't have any Orkans, so a Thunder Pinata Leo can be a great substitute. The thunder or aphid aren't mixed range weapon setups when paired with orkans or plasma. We all know the optimum range for a thunder isn't actually 500m and the aphid range is close enough.
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