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Post by Firebeard on May 30, 2017 6:14:08 GMT -5
Their current role is Support because the Quick Draw mechanic has relegated them to such. They cannot effectively play as an aggressor unless, the "mechanic" is changed. As I stated, only having two viable weapons is not just limiting, it is handicapping .. You do understand that ALL bots are handicapped on purpose to provide balanced gameplay, right? Are they, are you sure? Toe-to-Toe, an Ancilot will outlast any other Mecha with equivalent firepower. It's Weapons that are the deciding factor. Having only two weapons viable versus a plethora, compared to other Mecha, is very ineffective. I don't understand why you or anyone would be resistant to making the WW Mecha more capable and bring them up to snuff with their equivalent counterparts. Eliminate the reload exploit and use an On Demand system .. |
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Post by nosinov on May 30, 2017 6:20:02 GMT -5
Their current role is Support because the Quick Draw mechanic has relegated them to such. They cannot effectively play as an aggressor unless, the "mechanic" is changed. As I stated, only having two viable weapons is not just limiting, it is handicapping .. You do understand that ALL bots are handicapped on purpose to provide balanced gameplay, right? Nothing more to say here. You don't wanna see a Butch firing two Zeus at you every 3 seconds, including discharge time. Or 2 Nashorn every 4,5 seconds. And I don't wanna see 2 Tarans firing nonstop from a Doc. |
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Post by Russel on May 30, 2017 6:21:16 GMT -5
You do understand that ALL bots are handicapped on purpose to provide balanced gameplay, right? Are they, are you sure? Toe-to-Toe, an Ancilot will outlast any other Mecha with equivalent firepower. It's Weapons that are the deciding factor. Having only two weapons viable versus a plethora, compared to other Mecha, is very ineffective. I don't understand why you or anyone would be resistant to making the WW Mecha more capable and bring them up to snuff with their equivalent counterparts. Eliminate the reload exploit and use an On Demand system .. Oh my. Let me put it this way, 1-on-1 I will win a game against Lancelot, 10 times out of 10, in my Cossack. This game is NOT about firepower alone. Every bot has it's pros and cons. Why not give Natasha physical shield? And Ancile, too? And jump ability plus 80 km\h speed? This would definitely make Natasha a greater bot, right? Also - why Patton is SOOO slow? It could use some speed buff, and a jump. And physical shield. And Ancile, too. Hell, let's make every bot 250K hp, jump ability and 60 km\h speed? Why not? And 2 heavy slots, plus 2 medium slots and 2 light slots. That would make every bot the same, and only weapons choice would decide who is a better shooter. |
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Post by Firebeard on May 30, 2017 6:39:12 GMT -5
Are they, are you sure? Toe-to-Toe, an Ancilot will outlast any other Mecha with equivalent firepower. It's Weapons that are the deciding factor. Having only two weapons viable versus a plethora, compared to other Mecha, is very ineffective. I don't understand why you or anyone would be resistant to making the WW Mecha more capable and bring them up to snuff with their equivalent counterparts. Eliminate the reload exploit and use an On Demand system .. Oh my. Let me put it this way, 1-on-1 I will win a game against Lancelot, 10 times out of 10, in my Cossack. This game is NOT about firepower alone. Every bot has it's pros and cons. Why not give Natasha physical shield? And Ancile, too? And jump ability plus 80 km\h speed? This would definitely make Natasha a greater bot, right? Also - why Patton is SOOO slow? It could use some speed buff, and a jump. And physical shield. And Ancile, too. Hell, let's make every bot 250K hp, jump ability and 60 km\h speed? Why not? And 2 heavy slots, plus 2 medium slots and 2 light slots. That would make every bot the same, and only weapons choice would decide who is a better shooter. Your sarcasm is unwelcome. The Cooldown exceeds the reload times. This makes Doc and Butch less effective on the battlefield and the reason they are not widely used. No other Mecha has to wait for such times to use All of their available weapons. All Mecha except, Destrier, Cossack, Rogatka, Carnage and Raijin can All bring more firepower to bear. Nor do they need to wait an extraordinarily long time to use their weapons. If you destroyed an Ancilot using a Cossack, one of two things happed: 1): The Ancilot was of inferior level in both Weaponry and Armour .. 2): You used a penetration weapon .. The terms, "Toe-to-Toe" and "equivalent" imply a balance. Both Mecha of the same level and using the same weapons. Your Cossack would not last. It is a given. |
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Post by Russel on May 30, 2017 7:54:14 GMT -5
Oh my. Let me put it this way, 1-on-1 I will win a game against Lancelot, 10 times out of 10, in my Cossack. This game is NOT about firepower alone. Every bot has it's pros and cons. Why not give Natasha physical shield? And Ancile, too? And jump ability plus 80 km\h speed? This would definitely make Natasha a greater bot, right? Also - why Patton is SOOO slow? It could use some speed buff, and a jump. And physical shield. And Ancile, too. Hell, let's make every bot 250K hp, jump ability and 60 km\h speed? Why not? And 2 heavy slots, plus 2 medium slots and 2 light slots. That would make every bot the same, and only weapons choice would decide who is a better shooter. The Cooldown exceeds the reload times. This makes Doc and Butch less effective on the battlefield and the reason they are not widely used. No other Mecha has to wait for such times to use All of their available weapons. All Mecha except, Destrier, Cossack, Rogatka, Carnage and Raijin can All bring more firepower to bear. Nor do they need to wait an extraordinarily long time to use their weapons. If you destroyed an Ancilot using a Cossack, one of two things happed: 1): The Ancilot was of inferior level in both Weaponry and Armour .. 2): You used a penetration weapon .. The terms, "Toe-to-Toe" and "equivalent" imply a balance. Both Mecha of the same level and using the same weapons. Your Cossack would not last. It is a given. That was a small test, and it's proven that you are not getting the idea of the game, at all. I said "win a game", and "winning a game" does NOT imply destroying other bot. I would easily keep capping beacons in my ECU Cossack, until it would be a win, while Lancelot would be dragging it's feet half a map behind me. For you every bot seems to be only as good as it's ability to deal a lot of damage per second while sustaining enemy fire. I don't know why are you perceiving game this way, but thank you anyways. Such fighters as you only makes this game more fun for me to play, I hope your gamestyle provides enough fun for you to keep playing. Please don't read the following text, because you wouldn't agree and it's pointless to argue; I will just leave it for guys who yet to make up their mind about WW bots (all taken from my own experience, Golden\Diamond iOS league): - Every WW bot is NOT the same. Butch and Doc are awful on their own, while Jesse can be decent sole fighter
- You can use 4 sets of the same weapon, making the bot actually 1-long-hit-cannon, or you can combine different weapons\range. Think Tulu\Orkan Doc who can start pressuring enemy from 500m and keep the pressure until distance closes. Or think Missile\Plasma Doc, who can deal damage to either Ancile or Shield enemy.
- WW bots are AWESOME with a cool teammate. They are very good at building strategic teamplay. There is no other bots who reward teamplay more, even combo like Fujin\Raijin or Carnage\Griffin is not as rewarding. I was able to stack up 600K+ of damage using my lvl2~3 bots and lvl6~8 weapons, with 2 Docs and 3 Jesses hangar on the Moon map with a proper SquadMate
- If you are looking into WW bots as "handicapped low HP 4-slot fighter" then look another way. You will be better off with BritBots
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Post by Firebeard on May 30, 2017 8:11:58 GMT -5
The Cooldown exceeds the reload times. This makes Doc and Butch less effective on the battlefield and the reason they are not widely used. No other Mecha has to wait for such times to use All of their available weapons. All Mecha except, Destrier, Cossack, Rogatka, Carnage and Raijin can All bring more firepower to bear. Nor do they need to wait an extraordinarily long time to use their weapons. If you destroyed an Ancilot using a Cossack, one of two things happed: 1): The Ancilot was of inferior level in both Weaponry and Armour .. 2): You used a penetration weapon .. The terms, "Toe-to-Toe" and "equivalent" imply a balance. Both Mecha of the same level and using the same weapons. Your Cossack would not last. It is a given. That was a small test, and it's proven that you are not getting the idea of the game, at all. I said "win a game", and "winning a game" does NOT imply destroying other bot. I would easily keep capping beacons in my ECU Cossack, until it would be a win, while Lancelot would be dragging it's feet half a map behind me. For you every bot seems to be only as good as it's ability to deal a lot of damage per second while sustaining enemy fire. I don't know why are you perceiving game this way, but thank you anyways. Such fighters as you only makes this game more fun for me to play, I hope your gamestyle provides enough fun for you to keep playing. Please don't read the following text, because you wouldn't agree and it's pointless to argue; I will just leave it for guys who yet to make up their mind about WW bots (all taken from my own experience, Golden\Diamond iOS league): - Every WW bot is NOT the same. Butch and Doc are awful on their own, while Jesse can be decent sole fighter
- You can use 4 sets of the same weapon, making the bot actually 1-long-hit-cannon, or you can combine different weapons\range. Think Tulu\Orkan Doc who can start pressuring enemy from 500m and keep the pressure until distance closes. Or think Missile\Plasma Doc, who can deal damage to either Ancile or Shield enemy.
- WW bots are AWESOME with a cool teammate. They are very good at building strategic teamplay. There is no other bots who reward teamplay more, even combo like Fujin\Raijin or Carnage\Griffin is not as rewarding. I was able to stack up 600K+ of damage using my lvl2~3 bots and lvl6~8 weapons, with 2 Docs and 3 Jesses hangar on the Moon map with a proper SquadMate
- If you are looking into WW bots as "handicapped low HP 4-slot fighter" then look another way. You will be better off with BritBots
Firstly, understand that my goal is strategic victory(s). Yes, Any Mecha is only good as the damage it can inflict, sustain and receive. Having access to only two of four available weapons, which are fully loaded but inaccessible, is extremely inefficient and a liability to both Pilot and Teammates. Secondly, the purpose of the WW Mecha, according to in-game description, is to "...bring continuous fire..." to the Enemy. The WW Mecha were Not intended to be used in a Support role. Asking for a modification to the Quick Draw mechanic to keep it inline with stated goals is not unreasonable. As it stands, the WW Mecha are inferior to their counterparts' and the new "Dash-bots" will make them irrelevant. 'Jesse is the Only WW Mecha that can benifit, slightly. Doc and Butch - Liability. If Pixonic can recognize this, why can't you..? |
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Post by shivaswrath on May 30, 2017 9:20:52 GMT -5
WW need a built in ancille, a HP buff, or both, because they are more squishy than a Griffin!
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Post by Russel on May 30, 2017 10:36:15 GMT -5
WW need a built in ancille, a HP buff, or both, because they are more squishy than a Griffin! Yeah, and also jump and a shield! |
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Post by Paps on May 30, 2017 10:48:55 GMT -5
Alright! We get it, Firebeard! The Gunslinger bots suck. Don't use them, then. I think the point Russel (and myself. and others) is trying to make is that they'd be ridiculous with no quickdraw cooldown. Butch works great for me. Seems Russel is pleased with them as they are, as well. They're not the greatest. You're right. But they can and do work ok. Ok enough. Best bet is to use them with weapons that pair well with the ability cooldown. Otherwise you're just spinnin' your wheels. |
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Post by Firebeard on May 30, 2017 14:14:50 GMT -5
Alright! We get it, Firebeard! The Gunslinger bots suck. Don't use them, then. I think the point Russel (and myself. and others) is trying to make is that they'd be ridiculous with no quickdraw cooldown. Butch works great for me. Seems Russel is pleased with them as they are, as well. They're not the greatest. You're right. But they can and do work ok. Ok enough. Best bet is to use them with weapons that pair well with the ability cooldown. Otherwise you're just spinnin' your wheels. What I'm suggesting is that the reload exploit be removed and just have normal reload times but allow switching so you can use the weapons when they are ready. It's no different than any other Mecha. Why is this considered a bad idea, to bring them up to par with their counterparts? .. |
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Post by Paps on May 30, 2017 17:03:09 GMT -5
Cause four tridents every whatever the cycle time sounds like a bad time. Ditto with KwK's. Or tarans. Or nearly any weapon the Gunslingers can mount. I with I could go for this, Firebeard. I really do. I like the bots. But something like you're proposing would make em pretty imbalanced, in my opinion. |
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Post by Firebeard on May 31, 2017 7:05:38 GMT -5
Cause four tridents every whatever the cycle time sounds like a bad time. Ditto with KwK's. Or tarans. Or nearly any weapon the Gunslingers can mount. I with I could go for this, Firebeard. I really do. I like the bots. But something like you're proposing would make em pretty imbalanced, in my opinion. I understand how it could appear that way. People think, constant barrage of Taran fire. Not so .. The Fujin and "Dash-bot" Mk2 carry a greater number medium-hardpoints and can bring more firepower to bear. The WW Mecha are still limited in terms of usable hardpoints. So, even though a Doc would have access to four Tarans, it could only use two at a time. A Fujin or a Mk2 is still superior with regard to damage output. The benefit comes from the versatility that the WW Mecha could employ. The "On Demand" system that is proposed simply makes the WW Mecha slower versions of their counterparts; Jesse - Destrier, Doc - Rogatka, Butch - Carnage. To offset the loss in mobility, we've added versatility without compromising gameplay or balance. Perhaps, if this was tested during a Test Server phase we could get better data but the numbers are good. Boots on the ground and battlefield dynamics would be the true test. Would you endorse a Test Server run? |
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Post by Paps on May 31, 2017 7:19:56 GMT -5
I support a climate's right to choose and gun warming. Also Background checks on equal rights. Wait... I'm gettin' turned around. Sure, they can test em all they want, Firebeard. Don't matter much whether I endorse it or no. I think it'd be pretty rad to swap weapons whenever. I own lots of Gunslinger mechs. Still think it would be overpowered, though. If Pixonic changes the quickdraw cooldown, I'm on board. One hundred percent. Just doubt they will. |
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Post by Diablo86 on Jun 1, 2017 3:57:23 GMT -5
I love this 'Tempest' weapon. Looks really cool.
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Post by fιяєfℓαмє on Jun 6, 2017 7:45:00 GMT -5
Can't wait for new gamemodes.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 7, 2017 10:07:21 GMT -5
Shield-piercing bullets! Missile bots are already doing a good enough job at weakening Britbots.
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