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Post by GreenFace on May 16, 2017 16:16:50 GMT -5
These couple of weeks, I've noticed an unusual thing quite often. The games start like usual, but as the time goes, most of the Reds suddenly positioned themselves further and further from the center action, with almost no efforts to reclaim their lost beacons. In some cases, Blues didn't push at all (just protecting the beacon advantage that we already have), yet the Reds still sit up there. I found it strange, then this thought came:
Is that a new form of tanking? I mean, since LQ had been implemented by Pixonic, the leaving actions that has been used by tankers before is "punished". So, now, to ensure their loss without leaving the game, is to keep putting damage but stay clear from beacons. Naturally, the opponent will be encouraged to charge forward, take every unguarded beacons, and try to do a wipe out. The lost will be more inevitable, and that's exactly what they wanted because there's no leaving's done (no chance of LQ).
Anyone in Silver experienced it also?
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Post by amoebastudios on May 16, 2017 16:21:13 GMT -5
Fading? Sounds like a time consuming thing to do for little gain.
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Post by GreenFace on May 16, 2017 16:38:05 GMT -5
Fading? Sounds like a time consuming thing to do for little gain. Is Fading the term now? I don't know about gain vs effort on it, but it's just feel strange to have opponents who still have adequate resources and time, did nearly nothing to wins back a little loss. |
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wilyone
Destrier
Posts: 22
Karma: 9
Pilot name: Ensign Free Kill
Platform: iOS
Clan: Aurora Audax
League: Gold
Server Region: North America
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Post by wilyone on May 16, 2017 17:16:24 GMT -5
I deleted all my screenshots of folks in Gold doing that. It was taking up too much space. They play for the first 2 minutes, rack up some damage then park their bot in the open. Now that I think about it, I only see this on specific maps, Canyon and Springfield. (I've pushed them around the field a bit to use them as cover.) What's frustrating is you are playing and suddenly find out you are down 2-4 players. Sure, there can be connectivity problems, but I'm starting to wonder if the connection problems are on the server side. Whenever the game claims there is a connection issue, I'll check after the match and find full bars on wifi. I've gone so far as played 3ft/1m away from the wifi router.
Even when red does this, I'll end up killing the bot just to clear up the battlefield. Having that bot sit there screws with targeting even with lock on. You still have to cycle past it to get a real target.
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Post by gr3ygh05t on May 16, 2017 18:09:19 GMT -5
Yup this is fading. It's faster to just not cap beacons. It's tanking while avoiding the LQ.
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Post by [ita]SirKenzoY2J on May 17, 2017 6:43:10 GMT -5
Yup this is fading. It's faster to just not cap beacons. It's tanking while avoiding the LQ. listen to me.... you can decide to win or to lose only when are a very good strategist. if you want to win, rules are shown in upper right screen before every match starts, but how can i decide to lose? you can start with everybot you want, kill everything or kill noone, cap 1, 2, 1000, or noone beacons, it's not important. when your FIRST BOT mechs out, you have to still as a spectator... no other players could replace if you are there. no LQ, no way to find you're tanking, you could be only a 3yo player with dad's account as pixonic want, beacause play with family is the best. is smarter to play to lose, play to win is the easy way to go to Expert League hell |
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Post by [ita]SirKenzoY2J on May 17, 2017 6:49:03 GMT -5
Yup this is fading. It's faster to just not cap beacons. It's tanking while avoiding the LQ. or maybe it's my cat with my smartphone, it cannot read, so how pretend to win? it 's also very undecided when it's first bot dies... it stills in front of screen without selecting anyone until game ends, leaving allies with 1 pilot less... sometimes, it make squad platoon with a monkey, a horse without inch hand, and 3 other kittens who like to have only 1 bot in hangar... so they all play toghether, using one only bot, matches lasts 2-3 minutes, and yes, they are tanking, but they don't go on LQ. Pixonic plis |
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Post by Paps on May 17, 2017 6:58:22 GMT -5
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chimera
Destrier
Posts: 39
Karma: 24
Pilot name: Chimera VII
Platform: Android
Clan: BOOM
League: Diamond
Server Region: North America
Favorite robot: Zeus Carnage
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Post by chimera on May 17, 2017 10:16:40 GMT -5
Yup, this is a thing now, especially at the transition between 2 leagues (e.g. hovering 2300 rating between gold and diamond)
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Post by Vectivus on May 17, 2017 11:21:55 GMT -5
Yup this is fading. It's faster to just not cap beacons. It's tanking while avoiding the LQ. or maybe it's my cat with my smartphone, it cannot read, so how pretend to win? it 's also very undecided when it's first bot dies... it stills in front of screen without selecting anyone until game ends, leaving allies with 1 pilot less... sometimes, it make squad platoon with a monkey, a horse without inch hand, and 3 other kittens who like to have only 1 bot in hangar... so they all play toghether, using one only bot, matches lasts 2-3 minutes, and yes, they are tanking, but they don't go on LQ. Pixonic plis ...this sounds like something Google Translate would say. Just out of sheer curiosity, I took this post, put it through Translate into Traditional Chinese and then back to English, and this is what I came up with: "Or maybe my cat with my smartphone, it can not read, so pretend to win? When the first robot dies, it is still very undecided ... it is still in front of the screen, no choice of anyone until the end of the game, leaving a pilots of allies ... sometimes it makes a team of monkeys, A no-inch horseman and another 3 like a kitten in the hangar with only 1 robots ... so they all play, just use a robot, the game lasts 2-3 minutes, yes they are in the tank but they do not Will be LQ. Pixar Plas" As to the topic at hand: Yes, I've noticed this too. Maybe it's time to either institute a minimum damage threshold to avoid the LQ, or institute a more robust reporting system. |
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Post by Ⅎ₹ѺC₭₩ELDEℲ₹ on May 17, 2017 11:33:17 GMT -5
After the rewards are taken away from the LQ...There will be a mass migration out of the LQ and into the Normal Q...What you will see is mass squad fading by the old delinquents - basically throwing games. As with these types, they will meet the minimum technical requirements then stop any play after that. It's about all they have left at this point... It will be useless to try and deal with Fading, as it is undetectable from really bad players.
At any rate, Fading will be the "thing" soon.
I came up with the "Fading" term, and really don't like it...Its more match fixing than anything...Here is a game related example..
Counter-Strike: Global Offensive
In January 2015, Sam "DaZeD" Marine, Braxton "swag" Pierce, Keven "AZK" Larivière, and Joshua "steel" Nissan, Counter-Strike: Global Offensive professional players from the American team iBUYPOWER, were banned for life for match fixing a game.[33][34]
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page8988
Destrier
Posts: 59
Karma: 32
Platform: Android
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Post by page8988 on May 17, 2017 12:43:39 GMT -5
I've nd server issues where it will allow me to play usually the first four or five minutes of a match, then claim that there's a connection problem with my WiFi... when I can clearly see four bars on my device. It's frustrating, but not intentional.
Players are emulating this as a tactic though? What's the point?
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Post by blastronaut on May 17, 2017 13:07:18 GMT -5
I've nd server issues where it will allow me to play usually the first four or five minutes of a match, then claim that there's a connection problem with my WiFi... when I can clearly see four bars on my device. It's frustrating, but not intentional. Players are emulating this as a tactic though? What's the point? obviously the point is to lose |
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Post by amoebastudios on May 17, 2017 13:09:07 GMT -5
After the rewards are taken away from the LQ...There will be a mass migration out of the LQ and into the Normal Q...What you will see is mass squad fading by the old delinquents - basically throwing games. As with these types, they will meet the minimum technical requirements then stop any play after that. It's about all they have left at this point... It will be useless to try and deal with Fading, as it is undetectable from really bad players. Totally this. Situation could be significantly improved by giving higher leagues better rewards. However, this cripples the lower league bot advancements. |
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chimera
Destrier
Posts: 39
Karma: 24
Pilot name: Chimera VII
Platform: Android
Clan: BOOM
League: Diamond
Server Region: North America
Favorite robot: Zeus Carnage
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Post by chimera on May 17, 2017 13:39:55 GMT -5
After the rewards are taken away from the LQ...There will be a mass migration out of the LQ and into the Normal Q...What you will see is mass squad fading by the old delinquents - basically throwing games. As with these types, they will meet the minimum technical requirements then stop any play after that. It's about all they have left at this point... It will be useless to try and deal with Fading, as it is undetectable from really bad players. Totally this. Situation could be significantly improved by giving higher leagues better rewards. However, this cripples the lower league bot advancements. Situation could also be improved by accounting the hanger level in the match-making process. MM should take into account BOTH skill and hanger level (which I believe it already does, but only to some small extent). The following should not be allowed:   |
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Post by nocluevok on May 17, 2017 14:01:12 GMT -5
Yup this is fading. It's faster to just not cap beacons. It's tanking while avoiding the LQ. And I end up on a team with them every single time I'm in my 5 match series to move into diamond league. Ahats. |
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Post by Ⅎ₹ѺC₭₩ELDEℲ₹ on May 17, 2017 14:17:29 GMT -5
Personally, I think you will see the rewards disappear in the LQ and be directed to the top 3 or 4 leagues. The structure might just be what the last event showcased.
The lower leagues would not be "crippled"...They would still have the means to get to 9 fairly easily, especially if the swamp is drained.
The top 4 leagues need to have the Birthday event level rewards for starters...The bottom of the tank starts at Diamond, which is much better prepared to deal with corrupted Champ and Legend players dropping to get some..
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Post by amidf on May 17, 2017 14:34:55 GMT -5
After the rewards are taken away from the LQ...There will be a mass migration out of the LQ and into the Normal Q...What you will see is mass squad fading by the old delinquents - basically throwing games. As with these types, they will meet the minimum technical requirements then stop any play after that. It's about all they have left at this point... It will be useless to try and deal with Fading, as it is undetectable from really bad players. Totally this. Situation could be significantly improved by giving higher leagues better rewards. However, this cripples the lower league bot advancements. Not if the higher reward is silver. Lack of silver cripples advancement for advanced players. -Amid |
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Post by Ⅎ₹ѺC₭₩ELDEℲ₹ on May 17, 2017 14:36:02 GMT -5
Yup this is fading. It's faster to just not cap beacons. It's tanking while avoiding the LQ. And I end up on a team with them every single time I'm in my 5 match series to move into diamond league. Ahats. Gotta get some insurance on these qualifiers...Join up with the Deplorable...we have helped many over these hurdles. We keep the Tanker Turds at Bay! |
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Post by nocluevok on May 17, 2017 15:30:26 GMT -5
Thanks for the invitation. I'm honored, but the demands of a clan can get a little tedious. The "must have", "must do", caveats get old after awhile. Earning a boatload of cups for the clan because I want to is more fun than feeling obligated to. I am too impatient to play more than one or two squad matches. I'm happier being able to move to the next match if I mech out vs waiting for a squad match to finish. I've been asked how I earn so many cups. Answer... I can play twice as many games because I don't squad. As Lightning McQueen says, "Speed. I am speed."
An odd thing for an Army vet who spent 20 yrs playing hurry up and wait, right? Guess it's because now I don't have to.
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Post by Ⅎ₹ѺC₭₩ELDEℲ₹ on May 17, 2017 16:00:51 GMT -5
Thanks for the invitation. I'm honored, but the demands of a clan can get a little tedious. The "must have", "must do", caveats get old after awhile. Earning a boatload of cups for the clan because I want to is more fun than feeling obligated to. I am too impatient to play more than one or two squad matches. I'm happier being able to move to the next match if I mech out vs waiting for a squad match to finish. I've been asked how I earn so many cups. Answer... I can play twice as many games because I don't squad. As Lightning McQueen says, "Speed. I am speed." An odd thing for an Army vet who spent 20 yrs playing hurry up and wait, right? Guess it's because now I don't have to. We don't have any entrance requirements, minimums or rules at all actually...And believe me, I would enforce the standards to the letter if we had any. We are just a group of some Vets, man tramps and forum characters who are entertaining...We are the Anti-Clan. We don't expect anything from anyone...and still manage to face wreck. Always welcome. |
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Post by Paps on May 17, 2017 18:28:50 GMT -5
I feel it's worth pointing out that it's not actually an actual clan. Just a loose affiliation of mostly good folks who are expanding their squaddin' horizons without the pressure (lol) of being in an official type game clan. Mixed bag of random clannies and non-clannies just hangin out, shootin the breeze. ?
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Post by imnobody on May 18, 2017 5:11:06 GMT -5
These couple of weeks, I've noticed an unusual thing quite often. The games start like usual, but as the time goes, most of the Reds suddenly positioned themselves further and further from the center action, with almost no efforts to reclaim their lost beacons. In some cases, Blues didn't push at all (just protecting the beacon advantage that we already have), yet the Reds still sit up there. I found it strange, then this thought came: Is that a new form of tanking? I mean, since LQ had been implemented by Pixonic, the leaving actions that has been used by tankers before is "punished". So, now, to ensure their loss without leaving the game, is to keep putting damage but stay clear from beacons. Naturally, the opponent will be encouraged to charge forward, take every unguarded beacons, and try to do a wipe out. The lost will be more inevitable, and that's exactly what they wanted because there's no leaving's done (no chance of LQ). Anyone in Silver experienced it also? ! Same I've noticed that too. The match seem to be disconnected and the team don't help coordinate. I been losing left and right. |
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Post by K A Z on May 18, 2017 5:51:58 GMT -5
Tanking, Leaver queue, clubbing, leagues, smurfing, fading...
Pix should see that it's time to realize the fact, that the reality is different than any mathematical "let's hope so" ideas. Once mm allowed vast range of hangars to be in 1 game, the speculation game started and there is no way the dev can outsmart the large player population just by stick & carrot (yeah, where is that one lol) play.
There will be more "funny terms" showing up from both camps (players & devs) to counter new mm mechanics manipulations pix attempts to implement. We've been through several iterations of this bull「dookie」 and it's obviously the old armor vs projectile race / spiral.
There is only 1 way out of it and it was yelled out all the time since new mm exploded into players face...hangar levels must be the major/final/deciding factor in mm. Until then the incentive to tank will be good enough to trigger all the funny named behaviors that are killing the game as we speak.
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Post by GreenFace on May 19, 2017 12:26:43 GMT -5
Yeah... I think that it should be some restrictions applied on every league. Yes, you can go up or down, simply do everything you wanted, but do it within the restrictions. If you like to play in Bronze, then play all the time you want there with A to C level. If you like to play with G to I level of gears, then play in the league that requires it. That simple...
I believe there will be no tanking or clubbing, because people can play wherever they wanted with the same gear level, and let the skill or luck be the judge.
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Post by Insane Demon on May 19, 2017 12:32:36 GMT -5
Yeah... I think that it should be some restrictions applied on every league. Yes, you can go up or down, simply do everything you wanted, but do it within the restrictions. If you like to play in Bronze, then play all the time you want there with A to C level. If you like to play with G to I level of gears, then play in the league that requires it. That simple... I believe there will be no tanking or clubbing, because people can play wherever they wanted with the same gear level, and let the skill or luck be the judge.  |
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sethile
GI. Patton
Posts: 126
Karma: 54
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Post by sethile on May 19, 2017 17:24:04 GMT -5
Yeah... I think that it should be some restrictions applied on every league. Yes, you can go up or down, simply do everything you wanted, but do it within the restrictions. If you like to play in Bronze, then play all the time you want there with A to C level. If you like to play with G to I level of gears, then play in the league that requires it. That simple... I believe there will be no tanking or clubbing, because people can play wherever they wanted with the same gear level, and let the skill or luck be the judge. You want to make it easier to seal club? I can see those new bronze players loving that they can now meet more 12/12 lances on the battlefield... Gear restrictions won't work either. Players will find the ultimate combo that allows them to compete at a low level with better than average other hanger layouts. Player optimisation has to be expected. You cannot ignore it. Also, Pix has to reward gold bots and weapons. Otherwise why buy them? Without gold purchases you can say bye bye to the game. |
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Post by blackhawk2002 on May 21, 2017 14:40:24 GMT -5
Totally this. Situation could be significantly improved by giving higher leagues better rewards. However, this cripples the lower league bot advancements. Situation could also be improved by accounting the hanger level in the match-making process. MM should take into account BOTH skill and hanger level (which I believe it already does, but only to some small extent). The following should not be allowed: Bwahahahaha!!!!!! Chromagnon strikes again, at least this time he was screwing ppl in gold. Imagine this knothole, only in silver league. What a putz. |
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Post by GreenFace on May 21, 2017 14:43:14 GMT -5
You want to make it easier to seal club? I can see those new bronze players loving that they can now meet more 12/12 lances on the battlefield... Gear restrictions won't work either. Players will find the ultimate combo that allows them to compete at a low level with better than average other hanger layouts. Player optimisation has to be expected. You cannot ignore it. Also, Pix has to reward gold bots and weapons. Otherwise why buy them? Without gold purchases you can say bye bye to the game. Optimized low level hangar is still low level hangar, the combination every newbies can easily learn and then mimicked for themselves. An advantage for gold weaponry is also understandable, that's the income source for the developer. But low level Orkan is still a low level weapon, something that a newbie easily acquired without too much problem. Low level Lancelot? The same. With gear level restrictions, newbies or veterans will start at almost equal ground of gears. Experience and skill will be a determining factor of the outcome, and the newbies will learn fast that gear level is only an appetizer to the real menu: The skill set. |
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sethile
GI. Patton
Posts: 126
Karma: 54
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Post by sethile on May 23, 2017 4:11:10 GMT -5
You are displaying an ignorance that shows an inability to understand the counter argument. Just repeating yourself does not invalidate the fact that what you have stated misses the mark.
Old MM didn't work.
New MM isint working as intended... going back to old MM is not really valid now is it...
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