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Post by Adazahi on Mar 14, 2023 2:49:59 GMT -5
Posted this to Reddit too, but was interested in what you guys had to say about it: So I initially wanted to do a rant post about one of my biggest issues in War Robots (Aether) but then I decided that it’d be good to have some backing to my rant. I surveyed the top 100 iOS players and found a grand total of 8 titans that were not Aether. 5 Luchador, 2 Indra, 1 Minos, and surprisingly didn’t see any Sirius in anyone’s main hangar (yet). Salute to those not using Aether in legend league, btw! Here’s a pie chart if you like: imgur.com/a/pX4OnAnBut it’s even more depressing when you look at it in spreadsheet form: imgur.com/a/GuR2NCm With that being said, here is my incredibly long and detailed Aether rant. I don’t expect anyone to read this part, I’m honestly just blowing off steam here. TLDR: Aether is a must have titan that kills anything else with little to no skill required and it’s virtually impossible to be competitive without one. Aether is probably one of the worst metas to have ever happened in war robots. I have lived through just about every single War Robots meta (playing for 7 years) and never has it been as impossible to kill the max meta players when you are not one yourself. Even in some of the most hated previous metas, you COULD catch the enemies while they were vulnerable, but Aether is NEVER vulnerable. A good example is a really old video on my YouTube channel during a comparable titan meta: the Ming meta. This screenshot: imgur.com/a/45ooywb is taken from a game I won. Ming had weaknesses, you could get around it and pull through, but this is not the case for Aether. Aether offers no strategy, no counterplay, nothing other than “purchase and max out an Aether of your own” to defeat it. I seethe when they start to spawn in, and the most fun games nowadays are the 1 out of 100 games where there’s a diverse cast of titans doing battle instead of just Aether Aether Aether. When compared to Aether, every other titan in the game is a handicap to the team. All games in champions league are decided by who has the most Aethers on their team. Players spawn in one robot, charge up their Aether, and spend nearly the rest of the game in that one titan. Aether requires no activation of any areas of your brain evolved more recently than the amygdala in order to dominate. This thing is an invincible god titan no matter what the person in the cockpit does. You could give this titan to someone who has never played the game before, as long as the enemies don’t have one, they will win. A few days ago I played a game where we were dominating the enemy for the first half, and then were getting spawn raided in the second. I’ll give you one guess as to what may have happened that turned the tides. I have two separate filmed occasions - and two more I can remember but didn’t film - where an Aether blew all of its firepower into my Fafnir’s shield and was not punished for it. Why? Because it tanked all my Fafnir’s damage and one shotted me as soon as the shield went down, so my Beak couldn’t activate stealth. Even when im lucky enough that it does activate stealth, or in the past, mild absorber, the Aether sits there and waits it out (tanking the bajillion damage per second from my charged up gun), and then one-shots me after. When an Aether targets your non-Aether, it’s not a matter of if you will die, it’s a matter of when. This thing has no drawbacks, it’s invincible, it’s fast, it will fly in a straight line towards you and you’ll be down in seconds. Really, the most effective way I have found to kill Aethers is to use my Ao Ming as bait. If i tried to shoot them down myself, it takes like 30 seconds of concentrated fire (that is, if they aren’t shooting back for some reason). It’s much more effective to have an Aether use all its speed boosts to fly to my Ming and shoot it down, and then drop in the middle of the open and get shot down by a blue Aether. This is what chess players call a “positive trade.” Anyway, In game balance, something that excels in one area must perform poorly in another. There is nothing Aether can’t do, and nothing that non-Aethers can do that Aether can’t do better. Well, that’s the end of the rant: Here’s where I do something useful and propose a solution. Obviously, nerf Aether, but don’t murder it! I might hate this bot, but if it were balanced I’d like it. As is, it’s just a 1:1 Murometz clone but better. Make it a glass cannon, it can’t be an all in one tank and ambusher, and for gods sake reduce the damage on those dang instakill cannons! This, alongside some buffs for older titans could be wrapped up as a nice titan rework and make a much more diverse meta with much less annoying OP titans.
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Post by Adazahi on Mar 14, 2023 2:52:50 GMT -5
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Post by Wolfblood7 on Mar 14, 2023 7:01:19 GMT -5
I think the Aether itself isn't too strong, it's the Glaive and Lance weapons that make it OP. I can kill them eventually with regular robots, with the help of some team mates, but that should be normal when going against all titans. Once they nerf the Glaive and Lance, we will start to see less of them.
I don't run mine anymore, I'm too in love with my Bugatti Indra.
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Post by Method Games[YT] on Mar 14, 2023 18:10:33 GMT -5
I've noticed an abundance of blinding weapons again as that's the only decent way of combatting the aether by blinding it as soon as it flies.
I have to sacrifice my bubble shotgun Minos to take one out and they can still tank the damage if they have all 3 healing charges banked.
Agreed, it's those glaive weapons that take it over the top. Half the time I don't even see where the damage is coming from as they can shoot over most cover then bam, you're deleted.
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Post by munkeeee on Mar 14, 2023 18:33:45 GMT -5
if you can get close, have good cover, and not alot of distractions or anything, (hahahaha, yeah right) EMGs chew up Aether pretty nice
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Post by Somebody’s Mom on Mar 15, 2023 15:03:18 GMT -5
The Aether itself isn’t really a problem, it’s the Glaives…. Full stop.
The Titan is actually quite vulnerable on the ground, and to the blindies, and it’s healing powers are moderate at best. Has the OP actually driven one? The only Titan slower on the battlefield is Nodens.
Was everybody crying when the Luchador dropped? Yes…. Has the Beak always been marginal? In my mind, yes. One shot while trying to get into position and your ability is done… I have to do even more duck and cover than when I was running a Nodens. Oh. And I’ve also only seen the new Titan three or four times in the last 50 matches… and those bubbles are kind of scary… cool graphics tho.
It’s the Glaives. Carry on.
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Post by Adazahi on Mar 15, 2023 22:07:55 GMT -5
The Aether itself isn’t really a problem, it’s the Glaives…. Full stop. The Titan is actually quite vulnerable on the ground, and to the blindies, and it’s healing powers are moderate at best. Has the OP actually driven one? The only Titan slower on the battlefield is Nodens. Was everybody crying when the Luchador dropped? Yes…. Has the Beak always been marginal? In my mind, yes. One shot while trying to get into position and your ability is done… I have to do even more duck and cover than when I was running a Nodens. Oh. And I’ve also only seen the new Titan three or four times in the last 50 matches… and those bubbles are kind of scary… cool graphics tho. It’s the Glaives. Carry on. Several others hold this opinion, and I strongly disagree. Tagged at the bottom of this response, just because I’m interested to discuss! Anyway, yes, glaive lance are a big part of it, but there’s a good reason LL is about half glaive Aethers and half blinder Aethers. Aether is fragile on the ground
Don’t be fooled by its low HP, it’s far from fragile on the ground - what you said about the healing sucking is quite false, it’s literally what makes it so hard to kill. Here’s the result of me dumping ~1.2m calculated damage into a grounded Aether. (Note the hilarity in that I caught it without its ability and yet I’m the one who barely came out alive, lol! But that part is indeed mostly thanks to its glaives.) For comparison, here’s what happens when I do the same thing to a Luchador: Both of these screenshots are from videos, so if you don’t believe I did all/most of the damage in both, I can provide the full clip. Aether isn’t that fast, has OP even driven one?You're absolutely right, I’ve never used an Aether (except maybe once on TS?) but let me tell you, I don’t need to use it to know how fast it is. If you use your speed ability a single time, you’re already a good bit faster than base Minos (ie fastest titan in the game) combine that with 2 more charges and the speed boost from flight, this thing is indeed fast, in addition to being quite invincible. We haven’t even gotten to the crazy flight ability with the EMP laser and actual invincibility with a ludicrously short cooldown and it’s already top titan material. Tags for Wolfblood7 , munkeeee and Method Games[YT]
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Post by munkeeee on Mar 15, 2023 22:24:00 GMT -5
The Aether itself isn’t really a problem, it’s the Glaives…. Full stop. The Titan is actually quite vulnerable on the ground, and to the blindies, and it’s healing powers are moderate at best. Has the OP actually driven one? The only Titan slower on the battlefield is Nodens. Was everybody crying when the Luchador dropped? Yes…. Has the Beak always been marginal? In my mind, yes. One shot while trying to get into position and your ability is done… I have to do even more duck and cover than when I was running a Nodens. Oh. And I’ve also only seen the new Titan three or four times in the last 50 matches… and those bubbles are kind of scary… cool graphics tho. It’s the Glaives. Carry on. Several others hold this opinion, and I strongly disagree. Tagged at the bottom of this response, just because I’m interested to discuss. Anyway, yes, glaive lance are a big part of it, but there’s a good reason LL is about half glaive Aethers and half blinder Aethers. Aether is fragile on the ground
Don’t be fooled by its low HP, it’s far from fragile on the ground - what you said about the healing sucking is quite false, it’s literally what makes it so hard to kill. Here’s the result of me dumping ~1.2m calculated damage into a grounded Aether. (Note the hilarity in that I caught it without its ability and yet I’m the one who barely came out alive, lol! But that’s mostly thanks to its glaives.) For comparison, here’s what happens when I do the same thing to a Luchador: Both of these screenshots are from videos, so if you don’t believe I did all/most of the damage in both, I can provide the full clip. Aether isn’t that fast, has OP even driven one?You're absolutely right, I’ve never used an Aether (except maybe once on TS?) but let me tell you, I don’t need to use it to know how fast it is. If you use your speed ability a single time, you’re already a good bit faster than base Minos (ie fastest titan in the game) combine that with 2 more charges and the speed boost from flight, this thing is indeed fast, in addition to being quite invincible. We haven’t even gotten to the crazy flight ability with the EMP laser and actual invincibility with a ludicrously short cooldown and it’s already top titan material. I see that Wolfblood7 munkeeee and Method Games[YT] also hold similar opinions, and I’d be happy to further discuss this topic, as I feel quite strongly that Aether itself is, indeed, insanely strong. I guess it just depends on setups. Some are tough, some arent. Some bots will catch that titan, some get eaten.
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Post by 079 on Mar 16, 2023 0:22:23 GMT -5
It’s a bit of both in my opinion. Aether is nigh indestructible during its ability and it gets really good firing angles, making engaging it an absolute pain. It also is just the right height that it can peak its weapons over buildings without exposing itself, and I find Aether to be surprisingly hard to catch (maneuverable and has good overall speed). On the other hand, Lance and Glaive kill everything in sight in seconds. Both are pretty annoying on their own, but together they are just insufferable.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 16, 2023 0:54:28 GMT -5
Getting the occasional Aether kill with my Nodens is sooo satisfying when it happens, though
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Post by Wolfblood7 on Mar 16, 2023 4:40:04 GMT -5
The Aether itself isn’t really a problem, it’s the Glaives…. Full stop. The Titan is actually quite vulnerable on the ground, and to the blindies, and it’s healing powers are moderate at best. Has the OP actually driven one? The only Titan slower on the battlefield is Nodens. Was everybody crying when the Luchador dropped? Yes…. Has the Beak always been marginal? In my mind, yes. One shot while trying to get into position and your ability is done… I have to do even more duck and cover than when I was running a Nodens. Oh. And I’ve also only seen the new Titan three or four times in the last 50 matches… and those bubbles are kind of scary… cool graphics tho. It’s the Glaives. Carry on. Several others hold this opinion, and I strongly disagree. Tagged at the bottom of this response, just because I’m interested to discuss! Anyway, yes, glaive lance are a big part of it, but there’s a good reason LL is about half glaive Aethers and half blinder Aethers. Aether is fragile on the ground
Don’t be fooled by its low HP, it’s far from fragile on the ground - what you said about the healing sucking is quite false, it’s literally what makes it so hard to kill. Here’s the result of me dumping ~1.2m calculated damage into a grounded Aether. (Note the hilarity in that I caught it without its ability and yet I’m the one who barely came out alive, lol! But that part is indeed mostly thanks to its glaives.) For comparison, here’s what happens when I do the same thing to a Luchador: Both of these screenshots are from videos, so if you don’t believe I did all/most of the damage in both, I can provide the full clip. Aether isn’t that fast, has OP even driven one?You're absolutely right, I’ve never used an Aether (except maybe once on TS?) but let me tell you, I don’t need to use it to know how fast it is. If you use your speed ability a single time, you’re already a good bit faster than base Minos (ie fastest titan in the game) combine that with 2 more charges and the speed boost from flight, this thing is indeed fast, in addition to being quite invincible. We haven’t even gotten to the crazy flight ability with the EMP laser and actual invincibility with a ludicrously short cooldown and it’s already top titan material. Tags for Wolfblood7 , munkeeee and Method Games[YT] It is to do with whch ones are more leveled, or modules I guess. I used to run more of an offensive buld on mine modules wise, I think it was 2x Onslaught and 2x Titan Anticontrol for a bit more health, but I think you can run Grand Balanced reactors as well for more of both, which I never tried. This could have made it more strong. Another possibility to not rule out is that particular Aether could have been a subtle hacker. There are some I just cannot kill even if three team mates with maxed Glaives are also shooting at it. The reason you killed the Luchador with those weapons is because his reflector wasn't up. To be honest, I don't know why he would risk coming out into the open like that with a Murometz about, unless he didn't see you. He should have had his reflector ready. I've tried that Muro build before against Luchys, and yes, it hurts. The Aether has a forcefield system like Seraph on the ground, a bit lie a reflector but it is harder to break. It would maybe take a couple of clips. As for the speed, I only use all three charges at once to push a beacon, and I rarely see others do the same. I don't consider the Aether's speed to be a problem, or its healing. Just my 2 cents
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Post by Method Games[YT] on Mar 16, 2023 4:52:59 GMT -5
The Aether is the best overall titan for the moment. Those speed dashes and health boosts really help to reward players even if they make a mistake. The Glaives just take it to the next level but I'm sure those weapons would do well on an Arthur and possibly even a Kid.
I wonder if they lifted the "ceiling" on maps because as mentioned earlier, it seems the Aether flies higher and gets those angles of attack other bots don't seem to get. Also convenient that you can't target them when they are above but they can target you just like the Ao Ming used to do on first release.
I think flying bots have a big advantage currently since they can catch you without cover and without purple shields for protection. Seraph is inline for another nerf for that reason when the next new release comes out from Pix.
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Post by Wolfblood7 on Mar 16, 2023 5:18:37 GMT -5
The Aether is the best overall titan for the moment. Those speed dashes and health boosts really help to reward players even if they make a mistake. The Glaives just take it to the next level but I'm sure those weapons would do well on an Arthur and possibly even a Kid. I wonder if they lifted the "ceiling" on maps because as mentioned earlier, it seems the Aether flies higher and gets those angles of attack other bots don't seem to get. Also convenient that you can't target them when they are above but they can target you just like the Ao Ming used to do on first release. I think flying bots have a big advantage currently since they can catch you without cover and without purple shields for protection. Seraph is inline for another nerf for that reason when the next new release comes out from Pix. Is there a confirmed Seraph nerf? The Imugi seems to be the complete opposite - in flight you have to be at least 120 metres away to be able to hit the targets, which is a pain if you are running sonics like me. Aether can get higher angles on titans, especially Arthurs, they can actually shoot right over their shield.
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Post by Adazahi on Mar 16, 2023 11:22:09 GMT -5
Several others hold this opinion, and I strongly disagree. Tagged at the bottom of this response, just because I’m interested to discuss! Anyway, yes, glaive lance are a big part of it, but there’s a good reason LL is about half glaive Aethers and half blinder Aethers. Aether is fragile on the ground
Don’t be fooled by its low HP, it’s far from fragile on the ground - what you said about the healing sucking is quite false, it’s literally what makes it so hard to kill. Here’s the result of me dumping ~1.2m calculated damage into a grounded Aether. (Note the hilarity in that I caught it without its ability and yet I’m the one who barely came out alive, lol! But that part is indeed mostly thanks to its glaives.) For comparison, here’s what happens when I do the same thing to a Luchador: Both of these screenshots are from videos, so if you don’t believe I did all/most of the damage in both, I can provide the full clip. Aether isn’t that fast, has OP even driven one?You're absolutely right, I’ve never used an Aether (except maybe once on TS?) but let me tell you, I don’t need to use it to know how fast it is. If you use your speed ability a single time, you’re already a good bit faster than base Minos (ie fastest titan in the game) combine that with 2 more charges and the speed boost from flight, this thing is indeed fast, in addition to being quite invincible. We haven’t even gotten to the crazy flight ability with the EMP laser and actual invincibility with a ludicrously short cooldown and it’s already top titan material. Tags for Wolfblood7 , munkeeee and Method Games[YT] It is to do with whch ones are more leveled, or modules I guess. I used to run more of an offensive buld on mine modules wise, I think it was 2x Onslaught and 2x Titan Anticontrol for a bit more health, but I think you can run Grand Balanced reactors as well for more of both, which I never tried. This could have made it more strong. Another possibility to not rule out is that particular Aether could have been a subtle hacker. There are some I just cannot kill even if three team mates with maxed Glaives are also shooting at it. The reason you killed the Luchador with those weapons is because his reflector wasn't up. To be honest, I don't know why he would risk coming out into the open like that with a Murometz about, unless he didn't see you. He should have had his reflector ready. I've tried that Muro build before against Luchys, and yes, it hurts. The Aether has a forcefield system like Seraph on the ground, a bit lie a reflector but it is harder to break. It would maybe take a couple of clips. As for the speed, I only use all three charges at once to push a beacon, and I rarely see others do the same. I don't consider the Aether's speed to be a problem, or its healing. Just my 2 cents As for leveling, we should’ve been on even ground. Both of us were maxxed. I suppose it could’ve been a subtle hacker, but I really doubt it. Subtle hackers using Aether and Seraph that I’ve seen are pretty obvious because they would just activate flight again, their whole deal is usually just having infinite abilities. Neither Aether nor seraph have a forcefield on the ground. Just as Luchador is vulnerable without its reflector, Aether *should be* vulnerable when its flight (which is what activates the forcefield) is down. I waited for the Luchador to use his reflector, and I did the same for the Aether’s forcefield, but Aether survived and Luchador didn’t because Aether is an unreasonably OP all in one tank and ambusher.
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Post by Garbage game on Mar 16, 2023 23:36:56 GMT -5
TLDR: _____New thing_____ is a must have _________ that kills anything else with little to no skill required and it’s virtually impossible to be competitive without one. How long can this cycle continue? Honestly. Life is unfair enough as is. Why keep suffering?
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Post by Poopface on Mar 17, 2023 9:53:37 GMT -5
TLDR: _____New thing_____ is a must have _________ that kills anything else with little to no skill required and it’s virtually impossible to be competitive without one. How long can this cycle continue? We all know the answer to that.
That's why I just follow in similar footprints as others: I just do my own thing. There will always be some new whizbang ultramurderpewpewpewzaaaaapthing added to the pile. As long as I can find different ways to be obnoxious, it is what it is.
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Post by Garbage game on Mar 17, 2023 14:24:11 GMT -5
How long can this cycle continue? We all know the answer to that.
That's why I just follow in similar footprints as others: I just do my own thing. There will always be some new whizbang ultramurderpewpewpewzaaaaapthing added to the pile. As long as I can find different ways to be obnoxious, it is what it is.
It would be pretty funny if 95% of the playerbase went to tryharding skirmishes and hanger X custom games (where “balance” is) and left the Whales to jerk each other off.
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Post by Eradicator1 on Mar 17, 2023 19:41:01 GMT -5
We all know the answer to that.
That's why I just follow in similar footprints as others: I just do my own thing. There will always be some new whizbang ultramurderpewpewpewzaaaaapthing added to the pile. As long as I can find different ways to be obnoxious, it is what it is.
It would be pretty funny if 95% of the playerbase went to tryharding skirmishes and hanger X custom games (where “balance” is) and left the Whales to jerk each other off. I think that is why there is not a skirmish every week. Too many players play that mode instead of the MM. You can usually get a game in a few seconds when it is available. I bet it adds to the MM wait times. Some are super fun. Some.....not so much. Ah well. There is always sixpak to give me balance.
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