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Post by derps on Jul 31, 2020 10:51:26 GMT -5
Pause a moment - at the time when the vote was active, Leeches were running rampant, dominating most other bots; it was not uncommon (at least in upper Champions League) to see hangars with 3 or more maxed Leeches. Many of us here on this forum had a discussion about which way to vote (thanks to a thread started by Deadeye ) - and knowing that some players (particularly those that don't care about game balance or hangar variety) were likely to vote for what they considered to be the most OP skill - we decided to do some damage control and concluded that voting together for a weaker pilot would be a better option than voting for something that would make an already very OP bot even more OP. It wasn't a dumb community decision (although I can completely see why it may look that way); it was a strategic one done for the sake of game balance. After all Thomas Mindread was bad enough; but you know the saying - better the devil you know. Of course in hindsight we needn't have bothered as Pix's newer introductions made sure the Leech numbers were forced down; but we didn't know that then (Ao Jun had a ridiculously long run, Leech May have had the same). That was exactly the thinking at the time. One additional note that we couldn't really anticipate was that she would be released soooooo much later in the game. It's been months since that poll happened. A number of factors have nullified the need to pick a crappy skill, not the least of which is the new pilot system that discourages trying new things out (especially alternative pilots). If you're looking for a new pilot to revitalize an old bot, I agree she's not the one to do that, but based on the circumstances at the time, I don't regret getting everyone together to pick the lesser of 2 (5?) evils. Don't get me wrong, i 100% do not ever want a more OP Legendary Pilot for the silly leech... I was just shocked at how silly this Legendary Pilot skill seems. I would be greatly surprised if this forum carried enough of the game population to sway a vote in any direction... and if somehow this WAS the case, then that may be the most influential forum on any gaming community I have ever seen in my life! That is kinda cool too. Strangely, if we had the power to persuade a skill choice vote, would we not have also had the same level of influence on a different bot pilot all together?!? another useless Legendary Pilot is a bummer, but i understand if the general thinking was (perhaps the pilot choice was already selected by the community, before this community organized) to steer the skill vote away from being OP... fair enough, cheers. |
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Post by dobby on Jul 31, 2020 11:23:29 GMT -5
Strangely, if we had the power to persuade a skill choice vote, would we not have also had the same level of influence on a different bot pilot all together?!? another useless Legendary Pilot is a bummer, but i understand if the general thinking was (perhaps the pilot choice was already selected by the community, before this community organized) to steer the skill vote away from being OP... fair enough, cheers. Some here have access to War Robots groups on other platforms and large clans with busy clan channels, if the forum community decides to work together towards something they have shown they do have quite a bit of influence in regards to influencing votes. Unfortunately none of that access matters if none of us (and particularly the influencers) don't know a vote is ongoing; and back then I and others had missed the memo about voting on which bot the pilot should be for; and no one here (that I am aware) made a thread to discuss and unite on a common vote. Had these other things happened I'd be willing to bet we wouldn’t have a Leech community Pilot on the free-track right now. I can't say for sure which bot it would have been for but I remember when I checked (after voting was unfortunately over) that Strider was a strong contender, so it may have been that. I hope they have another community pilot vote and that we forumites get notified early on so we can discuss and decide on which way we would like it to go. Unfortunately I don't think many of us want to bother with new LPs now, given how ridiculously expensive they are to max. So not sure there is much point. |
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Post by heavypiece on Jul 31, 2020 12:31:33 GMT -5
I have a Leech that I built in the WS. I had a Gale Paint scheme that I got somewhere along the way. It sits in my storage area as I was not that impressed with it (mostly because I haven’t really figured out how to use it effectively) and I am focusing my upgrades on the Bots that I Keep in my hanger most of the time. If I get all the way through the Operation and receive her as a pilot, I will put her in my Leech.  I mean she looks like she belongs in my Leech,  |
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Post by foxypotato on Jul 31, 2020 15:29:53 GMT -5
You all act like the Leech was nerfed or something. It is every bit as OP as it was when it was released.
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Post by ʂωєєтცяєα∂ on Jul 31, 2020 15:35:01 GMT -5
Hard pass
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Post by ʂωєєтცяєα∂ on Jul 31, 2020 15:37:47 GMT -5
You all act like the Leech was nerfed or something. It is every bit as OP as it was when it was released. I still run an occasional Leech but it is not as dominant as it once was since top clans started spamming 3-4 Ravana's each in their hangars. |
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Post by rags on Jul 31, 2020 15:46:11 GMT -5
You all act like the Leech was nerfed or something. It is every bit as OP as it was when it was released. no it’s not. Not even close. to avoid refund debacles pix doesn’t directly nerf big sellers now, they do it indirectly by adding counters. Leech single handedly dominated the game in their prime.. a max leech is still a good brawler but there are so many bots that can wreck them now, especially ravanas. plus titans absolutely melt them, which means is basically only used as an early drop. the reason ppl still use them is cuz they have them completely maxed to the tee already. As for this pilot, it only works if noobs are blasting at u, which happens but it’s completely random and situational. it’s garbage compared to mindreads skill. |
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Post by rags on Jul 31, 2020 15:51:55 GMT -5
I will say this tho, I faced a player that had T4’d everything on his max leech and it was crazy strong, it won a 3v1 against 3 ravanas. But that’s more of a situation due to the new pilot system than the leech itself.
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Post by foxypotato on Jul 31, 2020 16:59:51 GMT -5
You all act like the Leech was nerfed or something. It is every bit as OP as it was when it was released. no it’s not. Not even close. to avoid refund debacles pix doesn’t directly nerf big sellers now, they do it indirectly by adding counters. Leech single handedly dominated the game in their prime.. a max leech is still a good brawler but there are so many bots that can wreck them now, especially ravanas. plus titans absolutely melt them, which means is basically only used as an early drop. the reason ppl still use them is cuz they have them completely maxed to the tee already. As for this pilot, it only works if noobs are blasting at u, which happens but it’s completely random and situational. it’s garbage compared to mindreads skill. I get that but that is still not a nerf. The bot is still not balanced with most of the other bots of the game. I'm not going to forget that a bot is OP and need of a rebalance just because some slightly newer bot is slightly more OP or a counter. In the case of the Ravana, less OP but a hard counter to Leech. Counters are are a separate discussion from OPness. A bot can have a counter but be beyond broken to just about every other bot in the game and need of a nerf. To go back to the golden days when the game was mostly balanced a DB Rhino could counter a Tarancilot but the Tarancilot just steamrolled everything else with attrition so you won just by having multiple Ancilots in your hangar. Direct nerfs to the Ancile shield with shotguns and to the physical shields with 1.5 times damage received from kinetic weapons were direct nerfs to the things that made the Ancilot OP but came way too late. The Dash bots came shorly after but those were an indirect nerf to the Ancilot. It likely saying X is bad but Y is worse so X is fine now. X is still bad. |
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Post by foxypotato on Jul 31, 2020 17:05:27 GMT -5
That was exactly the thinking at the time. One additional note that we couldn't really anticipate was that she would be released soooooo much later in the game. It's been months since that poll happened. A number of factors have nullified the need to pick a crappy skill, not the least of which is the new pilot system that discourages trying new things out (especially alternative pilots). If you're looking for a new pilot to revitalize an old bot, I agree she's not the one to do that, but based on the circumstances at the time, I don't regret getting everyone together to pick the lesser of 2 (5?) evils. Don't get me wrong, i 100% do not ever want a more OP Legendary Pilot for the silly leech... I was just shocked at how silly this Legendary Pilot skill seems. I would be greatly surprised if this forum carried enough of the game population to sway a vote in any direction... and if somehow this WAS the case, then that may be the most influential forum on any gaming community I have ever seen in my life! That is kinda cool too. Strangely, if we had the power to persuade a skill choice vote, would we not have also had the same level of influence on a different bot pilot all together?!? another useless Legendary Pilot is a bummer, but i understand if the general thinking was (perhaps the pilot choice was already selected by the community, before this community organized) to steer the skill vote away from being OP... fair enough, cheers. That was the case. Best thing the forum ever did. |
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Post by rags on Jul 31, 2020 18:25:13 GMT -5
no itâs not. Not even close. to avoid refund debacles pix doesnât directly nerf big sellers now, they do it indirectly by adding counters. Leech single handedly dominated the game in their prime.. a max leech is still a good brawler but there are so many bots that can wreck them now, especially ravanas. plus titans absolutely melt them, which means is basically only used as an early drop. the reason ppl still use them is cuz they have them completely maxed to the tee already. As for this pilot, it only works if noobs are blasting at u, which happens but itâs completely random and situational. itâs garbage compared to mindreads skill. I get that but that is still not a nerf. The bot is still not balanced with most of the other bots of the game. I'm not going to forget that a bot is OP and need of a rebalance just because some slightly newer bot is slightly more OP or a counter. In the case of the Ravana, less OP but a hard counter to Leech. Counters are are a separate discussion from OPness. A bot can have a counter but be beyond broken to just about every other bot in the game and need of a nerf. To go back to the golden days when the game was mostly balanced a DB Rhino could counter a Tarancilot but the Tarancilot just steamrolled everything else with attrition so you won just by having multiple Ancilots in your hangar. Direct nerfs to the Ancile shield with shotguns and to the physical shields with 1.5 times damage received from kinetic weapons were direct nerfs to the things that made the Ancilot OP but came way too late. The Dash bots came shorly after but those were an indirect nerf to the Ancilot.  It likely saying X is bad but Y is worse so X is fine now. X is still bad.  does it matter tho? the meta has changed a lot, leech is relegated to a specific role now. At this point if they nerf it directly it would be practically unusable. Itâs a 「dookie」ty bot anyway so I wouldnât care but look back at previous bots that got direct nerfs like the dash bots theyâre rarely used anymore. |
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Post by foxypotato on Jul 31, 2020 18:48:47 GMT -5
I get that but that is still not a nerf.à The bot is still not balanced with most of the other bots of the game.à I'm not going to forget that a bot is OP and need of a rebalance just because some slightly newer bot is slightly more OP or a counter.à In the case of the Ravana, less OP but a hard counter to Leech.à Counters are are a separate discussion from OPness.à A bot can have a counter but be beyond broken to just about every other bot in the game and need of a nerf.à To go back to the golden days when the game was mostly balanced a DB Rhino could counter a Tarancilot but the Tarancilot just steamrolled everything else with attrition so you won just by having multiple Ancilots in your hangar.à Direct nerfs to the Ancile shield with shotguns and to the physical shields with 1.5 times damage received from kinetic weapons were direct nerfs to the things that made the Ancilot OP but came way too late.à The Dash bots came shorly after but those were an indirect nerf to the Ancilot.à à It likely saying X is bad but Y is worse so X is fine now.à X is still bad.à à does it matter tho? the meta has changed a lot, leech is relegated to a specific role now. At this point if they nerf it directly it would be practically unusable. Itâ??s a ?dookie?ty bot anyway so I wouldnâ??t care but look back at previous bots that got direct nerfs like the dash bots theyâ??re rarely used anymore. Dosen't matter. All the meta bots should be nerfed to balance then out with other bots. If just the Leech gets nerf then I'm fine with that. I'll take whatever I can get. If no one plays it in Champions League then tough luck. If they want to chase the meta that bad then let them chance their tail. The dash bots and Specter are perfectly useable in low Champions League and below and are for the most part nicely balanced with other older bots. The game is actually quite enjoyable in those leagues thanks precisely to a balanced and diverse field of bots and relatively few meta bots at high levels. All we need to do is give all the meta bots Haechi and Specter type nerfs and then we would have a video game again. They can still be the meta just with less of a power gap. As it is currently there is such a large power gap between the meta and not meta that is it nearly impossible to play non meta in the presence of the meta and this is bull「dookie」 for what is supposed to be a video game. This forces meta chasing and player running bots they "have to" rather than the bots they enjoy because "they can't" because Ao Jun or insert meta makes them unplayable. It's sad really. |
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Post by rags on Jul 31, 2020 20:44:27 GMT -5
does it matter tho? the meta has changed a lot, leech is relegated to a specific role now. At this point if they nerf it directly it would be practically unusable. ItâÂ?Â?s a ã??dookieã?ty bot anyway so I wouldnâÂ?Â?t care but look back at previous bots that got direct nerfs like the dash bots theyâÂ?Â?re rarely used anymore. Dosen't matter. All the meta bots should be nerfed to balance then out with other bots. If just the Leech gets nerf then I'm fine with that. I'll take whatever I can get. If no one plays it in Champions League then tough luck. If they want to chase the meta that bad then let them chance their tail. The dash bots and Specter are perfectly useable in low Champions League and below and are for the most part nicely balanced with other older bots. The game is actually quite enjoyable in those leagues thanks precisely to a balanced and diverse field of bots and relatively few meta bots at high levels. All we need to do is give all the meta bots Haechi and Specter type nerfs and then we would have a video game again. They can still be the meta just with less of a power gap. As it is currently there is such a large power gap between the meta and not meta that is it nearly impossible to play non meta in the presence of the meta and this is bull?dookie? for what is supposed to be a video game. This forces meta chasing and player running bots they "have to" rather than the bots they enjoy because "they can't" because Ao Jun or insert meta makes them unplayable. It's sad really. asking for balance is not realistic request with this game. besides, normal bot game is decently balanced now compared to meta past, the OP things are mings and Nodens. and no those old bots are not balanced. For example, u wanna run a haechi in Champions League? it better be MK2 with the Legendary Pilot and max weapons to survive. On the other hand u can run a level 9 Ao Jun with a normal pilot and wreck face. |
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Post by foxypotato on Jul 31, 2020 20:59:21 GMT -5
Dosen't matter. All the meta bots should be nerfed to balance then out with other bots. If just the Leech gets nerf then I'm fine with that. I'll take whatever I can get. If no one plays it in Champions League then tough luck. If they want to chase the meta that bad then let them chance their tail. The dash bots and Specter are perfectly useable in low Champions League and below and are for the most part nicely balanced with other older bots. The game is actually quite enjoyable in those leagues thanks precisely to a balanced and diverse field of bots and relatively few meta bots at high levels. All we need to do is give all the meta bots Haechi and Specter type nerfs and then we would have a video game again. They can still be the meta just with less of a power gap. As it is currently there is such a large power gap between the meta and not meta that is it nearly impossible to play non meta in the presence of the meta and this is bull?dookie? for what is supposed to be a video game. This forces meta chasing and player running bots they "have to" rather than the bots they enjoy because "they can't" because Ao Jun or insert meta makes them unplayable. It's sad really. asking for balance is not realistic request with this game. besides, normal bot game is decently balanced now compared to meta past, the OP things are mings and Nodens. and no those old bots are not balanced. For example, u wanna run a haechi in Champions League? it better be MK2 with the Legendary Pilot and max weapons to survive. On the other hand u can run a level 9 Ao Jun with a normal pilot and wreck face. I run Griffin and Leos and stuff in Champions League. Silver bots with silver weapons. I know what is just barely viable and what is not. Trust me the Haechi is plenty viable but a top build it is not. That's fine. Not everything needs to be meta. If the power gap between a Haechi and Leech was narrowed with a Leech nerf then wouldn't that be great? How about all current meta bots? Wouldn't that be even better? The Specter and Haechi nerf was great and long overdue. It's not that it was a bad thing it is that pix has also released even more bonker OP stuff that is now the meta that is so OP that anything older is not even playable. It is not that the old stuff is too weak or nerfed into oblivion it that the new stuff it too powerful and needs to be nerfed. You say that asking for game balance is unreasonable. It it never unreasonable. You say that the OP should not be nerfed to be balanced. It sounds to me like you don't want game balance or even a slight move in that direction with a single nerf to just one meta bot. Let me take a wild stab in the dark and say that you run a Leech? |
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Post by Spicy Jones on Aug 1, 2020 1:31:32 GMT -5
asking for balance is not realistic request with this game. besides, normal bot game is decently balanced now compared to meta past, the OP things are mings and Nodens. and no those old bots are not balanced. For example, u wanna run a haechi in Champions League? it better be MK2 with the Legendary Pilot and max weapons to survive. On the other hand u can run a level 9 Ao Jun with a normal pilot and wreck face. I run Griffin and Leos and stuff in Champions League. Silver bots with silver weapons. I know what is just barely viable and what is not. Trust me the Haechi is plenty viable but a top build it is not. That's fine. Not everything needs to be meta. If the power gap between a Haechi and Leech was narrowed with a Leech nerf then wouldn't that be great? How about all current meta bots? Wouldn't that be even better? The Specter and Haechi nerf was great and long overdue. It's not that it was a bad thing it is that pix has also released even more bonker OP stuff that is now the meta that is so OP that anything older is not even playable. It is not that the old stuff is too weak or nerfed into oblivion it that the new stuff it too powerful and needs to be nerfed. You say that asking for game balance is unreasonable. It it never unreasonable. You say that the OP should not be nerfed to be balanced. It sounds to me like you don't want game balance or even a slight move in that direction with a single nerf to just one meta bot. Let me take a wild stab in the dark and say that you run a Leech? I run two Leeches and I'll be the first one to say it's an OP bot. However I don't think it's going to get a nerf anytime soon. rags has a point, there are several bots now that aren't quite counters to Leech but have abilities that behave similarly enough, as well as Titans ability to squash Leeches. The meta is a lot broader now with stealth, DR, Phaseshifting. The only bot that I see as a direct counter to everything(i.e. the best bot currently) is Ravana especially with the Poe pilot. Leech doesn't really outshine Phantom/Fen/Blitz/Scorpion either. To put it simply, Pix would have to nerf+buff a lot of things to make this game perfectly balanced. |
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Post by someoldman on Aug 1, 2020 4:53:19 GMT -5
Garbage. A sidegrade as unique skill is a waste. “Sidegrade”. I like it! I’ve never heard that term before. |
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Post by foxypotato on Aug 1, 2020 9:36:21 GMT -5
I run Griffin and Leos and stuff in Champions League. Silver bots with silver weapons. I know what is just barely viable and what is not. Trust me the Haechi is plenty viable but a top build it is not. That's fine. Not everything needs to be meta. If the power gap between a Haechi and Leech was narrowed with a Leech nerf then wouldn't that be great? How about all current meta bots? Wouldn't that be even better? The Specter and Haechi nerf was great and long overdue. It's not that it was a bad thing it is that pix has also released even more bonker OP stuff that is now the meta that is so OP that anything older is not even playable. It is not that the old stuff is too weak or nerfed into oblivion it that the new stuff it too powerful and needs to be nerfed. You say that asking for game balance is unreasonable. It it never unreasonable. You say that the OP should not be nerfed to be balanced. It sounds to me like you don't want game balance or even a slight move in that direction with a single nerf to just one meta bot. Let me take a wild stab in the dark and say that you run a Leech? I run two Leeches and I'll be the first one to say it's an OP bot. However I don't think it's going to get a nerf anytime soon. rags has a point, there are several bots now that aren't quite counters to Leech but have abilities that behave similarly enough, as well as Titans ability to squash Leeches. The meta is a lot broader now with stealth, DR, Phaseshifting. The only bot that I see as a direct counter to everything(i.e. the best bot currently) is Ravana especially with the Poe pilot. Leech doesn't really outshine Phantom/Fen/Blitz/Scorpion either. To put it simply, Pix would have to nerf+buff a lot of things to make this game perfectly balanced. Yes many thing need nerfs and buff. Do it all at ones or piecemeal. I don't care. If it upsets the meta then so be it. Meta chasers will chase the new meta. That's what they do and they shouldn't be catered to above game balance. |
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Post by linearblade on Aug 1, 2020 10:45:23 GMT -5
asking for balance is not realistic request with this game. besides, normal bot game is decently balanced now compared to meta past, the OP things are mings and Nodens. and no those old bots are not balanced. For example, u wanna run a haechi in Champions League? it better be MK2 with the Legendary Pilot and max weapons to survive. On the other hand u can run a level 9 Ao Jun with a normal pilot and wreck face. I run Griffin and Leos and stuff in Champions League. Silver bots with silver weapons. I know what is just barely viable and what is not. Trust me the Haechi is plenty viable but a top build it is not. That's fine. Not everything needs to be meta. If the power gap between a Haechi and Leech was narrowed with a Leech nerf then wouldn't that be great? How about all current meta bots? Wouldn't that be even better? The Specter and Haechi nerf was great and long overdue. It's not that it was a bad thing it is that pix has also released even more bonker OP stuff that is now the meta that is so OP that anything older is not even playable. It is not that the old stuff is too weak or nerfed into oblivion it that the new stuff it too powerful and needs to be nerfed. You say that asking for game balance is unreasonable. It it never unreasonable. You say that the OP should not be nerfed to be balanced. It sounds to me like you don't want game balance or even a slight move in that direction with a single nerf to just one meta bot. Let me take a wild stab in the dark and say that you run a Leech?  FYI haechi rips ravana ?multiple bum-bums? anew. Itâ??s practically a hard counter to the current meta. No joke. I use a haechi, without last stand, in high champion in S-clan games against [chn] etc and put strong numbers up. It doesnâ??t do leeches / titans in the same way. But ravana / Ao jun? Spit roasts them in bad ways. |
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Post by Spicy Jones on Aug 1, 2020 15:03:10 GMT -5
I run two Leeches and I'll be the first one to say it's an OP bot. However I don't think it's going to get a nerf anytime soon. rags has a point, there are several bots now that aren't quite counters to Leech but have abilities that behave similarly enough, as well as Titans ability to squash Leeches. The meta is a lot broader now with stealth, DR, Phaseshifting. The only bot that I see as a direct counter to everything(i.e. the best bot currently) is Ravana especially with the Poe pilot. Leech doesn't really outshine Phantom/Fen/Blitz/Scorpion either. To put it simply, Pix would have to nerf+buff a lot of things to make this game perfectly balanced. Yes many thing need nerfs and buff. Do it all at ones or piecemeal. I don't care. If it upsets the meta then so be it. Meta chasers will chase the new meta. That's what they do and they shouldn't be catered to above game balance. I don't disagree with you, but I don't think it's going to happen. No doubt, Pixonic will go on with releasing drones and the newest titan later this year and nothing will be changed. |
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Post by rags on Aug 1, 2020 15:35:29 GMT -5
asking for balance is not realistic request with this game. besides, normal bot game is decently balanced now compared to meta past, the OP things are mings and Nodens. and no those old bots are not balanced. For example, u wanna run a haechi in Champions League? it better be MK2 with the Legendary Pilot and max weapons to survive. On the other hand u can run a level 9 Ao Jun with a normal pilot and wreck face. I run Griffin and Leos and stuff in Champions League. Silver bots with silver weapons. I know what is just barely viable and what is not. Trust me the Haechi is plenty viable but a top build it is not. That's fine. Not everything needs to be meta. If the power gap between a Haechi and Leech was narrowed with a Leech nerf then wouldn't that be great? How about all current meta bots? Wouldn't that be even better? The Specter and Haechi nerf was great and long overdue. It's not that it was a bad thing it is that pix has also released even more bonker OP stuff that is now the meta that is so OP that anything older is not even playable. It is not that the old stuff is too weak or nerfed into oblivion it that the new stuff it too powerful and needs to be nerfed. You say that asking for game balance is unreasonable. It it never unreasonable. You say that the OP should not be nerfed to be balanced. It sounds to me like you don't want game balance or even a slight move in that direction with a single nerf to just one meta bot. Let me take a wild stab in the dark and say that you run a Leech? I have a level 9 leech and a MK2 haechi. Right now I’m not using either but u can guess which one I’ve played more. I didn’t say asking for balance is unreasonable, I said it’s unrealistic. This game will never be balanced, that’s not a goal for pixo. And we know they are gonna keep introducing new stronger content, so continuing to ask for nerfs to current content actually creates more imbalance long term. Pix loves it cuz then they get to step in and act like they’re listening to the players when in reality it’s their way to force players to replace their nerfed bots with newer ones. |
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Post by frunobulax on Aug 2, 2020 2:55:35 GMT -5
asking for balance is not realistic request with this game. besides, normal bot game is decently balanced now compared to meta past, the OP things are mings and Nodens. and no those old bots are not balanced. For example, u wanna run a haechi in Champions League? it better be MK2 with the Legendary Pilot and max weapons to survive. On the other hand u can run a level 9 Ao Jun with a normal pilot and wreck face. Normal game is balanced all right. You suck unless you shell out a lot of money to get premium modules and legendary pilots. Unless you play day and night for a year.
It all depends on your league cups. I was over 8.000 last season, and always got several fully maxed opponents, usually with horrible blue teammates. It's really motivating if you're up Ravana vs. Ravana or Blitz vs. Blitz, and you can hardly scratch the paint on the other bot. I guess this is much better if you're fringe champ.
Yes, my 12.1 Ao Jun does nice damage, but usually I have the choice to hang back and see the beacon bar deplete as we're down 2-3 or 1-4, or I can push for a beacon and lose my bot in 6 seconds after landing (3s of that is my last stand). With maxed titans on the other side, the only way to win now is to push hard for beacons early in the game. Botting them is rare, very rare. You need a 4-cap early to have a realistic chance. Once the enemy titans roll out, you'd better have a lead to survive the game with 2 beacons.
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Post by frunobulax on Aug 2, 2020 2:59:14 GMT -5
I don't think I would use her on a Leech, unless Pixo introduces more weapons that (partially) bypass damage reduction (like titans or Vipers).
Very good points. I think she could be useful, but it's a complete play style change. Instead of using the ability just for the DR (like I essentially do), you would need to focus more on who you're redirecting the damage too. As you say, you wouldn't want to redirect it to a hard target (Ravana, T-falc, Fenrir) that could tank the damage. Rather, you want it to go to a soft target without DR or other abilities (PS and Last Stand). This is far more micro managing than I'm willing to commit to, especially with targeting as crappy as it is and that I'm using Scourges which require more target management than other weapons. She's not my cup of tea, but maybe someone could make use of here. I use mine more of a unexpected beacon runner style with all the speed boosts I can, so this would be a huge change of styles for me. #nope Agreed. And the thing is: Redirected damage is traded pretty much 1:1 for received damage. Which would be great on a tank, but Leech is a glass cannon. Would you prefer to have 100k damage to your Leech, while doing 100k damage to an Invader or 50k to a Fenrir? No.
So I guess the main impact of the new pilot is that she dilutes the pilot pool even more.
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Post by linearblade on Aug 2, 2020 8:17:14 GMT -5
That was exactly the thinking at the time. One additional note that we couldn't really anticipate was that she would be released soooooo much later in the game. It's been months since that poll happened. A number of factors have nullified the need to pick a crappy skill, not the least of which is the new pilot system that discourages trying new things out (especially alternative pilots). If you're looking for a new pilot to revitalize an old bot, I agree she's not the one to do that, but based on the circumstances at the time, I don't regret getting everyone together to pick the lesser of 2 (5?) evils. Don't get me wrong, i 100% do not ever want a more OP Legendary Pilot for the silly leech... I was just shocked at how silly this Legendary Pilot skill seems. I would be greatly surprised if this forum carried enough of the game population to sway a vote in any direction... and if somehow this WAS the case, then that may be the most influential forum on any gaming community I have ever seen in my life! That is kinda cool too. Strangely, if we had the power to persuade a skill choice vote, would we not have also had the same level of influence on a different bot pilot all together?!? another useless Legendary Pilot is a bummer, but i understand if the general thinking was (perhaps the pilot choice was already selected by the community, before this community organized) to steer the skill vote away from being OP... fair enough, cheers. I’d say something funny here, only I would get banned |
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Post by foxypotato on Aug 2, 2020 11:14:38 GMT -5
I run Griffin and Leos and stuff in Champions League. Silver bots with silver weapons. I know what is just barely viable and what is not. Trust me the Haechi is plenty viable but a top build it is not. That's fine. Not everything needs to be meta. If the power gap between a Haechi and Leech was narrowed with a Leech nerf then wouldn't that be great? How about all current meta bots? Wouldn't that be even better? The Specter and Haechi nerf was great and long overdue. It's not that it was a bad thing it is that pix has also released even more bonker OP stuff that is now the meta that is so OP that anything older is not even playable. It is not that the old stuff is too weak or nerfed into oblivion it that the new stuff it too powerful and needs to be nerfed. You say that asking for game balance is unreasonable. It it never unreasonable. You say that the OP should not be nerfed to be balanced. It sounds to me like you don't want game balance or even a slight move in that direction with a single nerf to just one meta bot. Let me take a wild stab in the dark and say that you run a Leech? I have a level 9 leech and a MK2 haechi. Right now I’m not using either but u can guess which one I’ve played more. I didn’t say asking for balance is unreasonable, I said it’s unrealistic. This game will never be balanced, that’s not a goal for pixo. And we know they are gonna keep introducing new stronger content, so continuing to ask for nerfs to current content actually creates more imbalance long term. Pix loves it cuz then they get to step in and act like they’re listening to the players when in reality it’s their way to force players to replace their nerfed bots with newer ones. The game =/= the meta. If you play only meta bots then perhaps there is some semblance of balance as the same 4 bots maxed out just go at each other game in and game out. If you don't play just those handful of utterly broken bots play idunno the other 97% of the bots in the game then you will find that there is a massive power gap between all those bots and those few meta bots. The gameplay then becomes horrifically unbalanced and about as bad as it has ever been. |
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Post by NexusBlade on Aug 2, 2020 13:44:15 GMT -5
I have a level 9 leech and a MK2 haechi. Right now I’m not using either but u can guess which one I’ve played more. I didn’t say asking for balance is unreasonable, I said it’s unrealistic. This game will never be balanced, that’s not a goal for pixo. And we know they are gonna keep introducing new stronger content, so continuing to ask for nerfs to current content actually creates more imbalance long term. Pix loves it cuz then they get to step in and act like they’re listening to the players when in reality it’s their way to force players to replace their nerfed bots with newer ones. The game =/= the meta. If you play only meta bots then perhaps there is some semblance of balance as the same 4 bots maxed out just go at each other game in and game out. If you don't play just those handful of utterly broken bots play idunno the other 97% of the bots in the game then you will find that there is a massive power gap between all those bots and those few meta bots. The gameplay then becomes horrifically unbalanced and about as bad as it has ever been. Quite frankly you're playing the wrong game, nerfs in this game have never led to a better playing experience for players, it's interesting you say theres only 4 good bots, well thats because of nerfs both direct and indirect, if anything the best course of action would be buff everything else back to their former glory and then 5 steps further, but even then that won't happen, If you want a gameplay experience where things are about as balanced as you can reasonably get while remaining fun, theres a ton of games on pc just waiting for you, Wanting balance in War Robots is like dating an abusive partner and sticking around because "Well maybe I can change them", Basically gonna shamelessly plug this old thread: war-robots-forum.freeforums.net/thread/36528/futility-balance |
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Post by frunobulax on Aug 2, 2020 13:47:21 GMT -5
I have a level 9 leech and a MK2 haechi. Right now I’m not using either but u can guess which one I’ve played more. I didn’t say asking for balance is unreasonable, I said it’s unrealistic. This game will never be balanced, that’s not a goal for pixo. And we know they are gonna keep introducing new stronger content, so continuing to ask for nerfs to current content actually creates more imbalance long term. Pix loves it cuz then they get to step in and act like they’re listening to the players when in reality it’s their way to force players to replace their nerfed bots with newer ones. The game =/= the meta. If you play only meta bots then perhaps there is some semblance of balance as the same 4 bots maxed out just go at each other game in and game out. If you don't play just those handful of utterly broken bots play idunno the other 97% of the bots in the game then you will find that there is a massive power gap between all those bots and those few meta bots. The gameplay then becomes horrifically unbalanced and about as bad as it has ever been. I agree that nobody has to chase the meta. And not all bots fall into one or other category. I see players doing extremely well in Invaders, Mercurys and the like, but not in Griffins or Leos.
In champ, especially if you're up against a good squad, a lot of old bots just become cannon fodder. You can put up good numbers if you don't push for beacons, play very defensively, but how do you want to get 2 maxed Ravanas off a beacon in a Haechi? You will be relevant only if you can push for beacons.
I like to feel relevant in the games I play. So while I won't chase the meta, I will replace builds I inefficient.
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Post by Adazahi on Aug 2, 2020 14:13:40 GMT -5
We all banded together and voted for the worst ability so... its not that good. THE PLAYERS HAVE ONE TRIUMPH OVER THE DEADLY GRASP OF POWERCREEP!
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Post by foxypotato on Aug 2, 2020 21:16:46 GMT -5
The game =/= the meta.ÃÂ If you play only meta bots then perhaps there is some semblance of balance as the same 4 bots maxed out just go at each other game in and game out.ÃÂ If you don't play just those handful of utterly broken bots play idunno the other 97% of the bots in the game then you will find that there is a massive power gap between all those bots and those few meta bots.ÃÂ The gameplay then becomes horrifically unbalanced and about as bad as it has ever been.ÃÂ Quite frankly you're playing the wrong game, nerfs in this game have never led to a better playing experience for players, it's interesting you say theres only 4 good bots, well thats because of nerfs both direct and indirect, if anything the best course of action would be buff everything else back to their former glory and then 5 steps further, but even then that won't happen, If you want a gameplay experience where things are about as balanced as you can reasonably get while remaining fun, theres a ton of games on pc just waiting for you, Wanting balance in War Robots is like dating an abusive partner and sticking around because "Well maybe I can change them", Basically gonna shamelessly plug this old thread: war-robots-forum.freeforums.net/thread/36528/futility-balanceThe Specter and Haechi nerfs were great. It really made the game more enjoyable to play and the two bots were still quite powerful after the nerf. That was the best time I had playing War Robots in a long time. Unfortunately the Ao Jun and Ares came along and ruined that. The pre dash proliferation days when I started playing and the 1st rebalance were the two best periods in War Robots for diverse as balanced game play. Things were really looking up after the Haechi and Specter nerf. It looked they actually gave a ?dookie? about game balance and were fixing to major problems in the game. We just need one of those types of nerfs to happen again to balance out all the new broken 「dookie」 they have released since. |
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Post by Spicy Jones on Aug 3, 2020 9:14:02 GMT -5
foxypotatoThat would be nice, but it isn't going to happen. Yeah, Spectre and Haechi got nerfs and other bots got buffed in the same update that was overall beneficial for the game. It took over a year for Ao Jun to get a nerf and Pixonic nerfed Avenger along with it. Shotguns took the hit instead of Leech as well. However nowadays you're going to have to consider just how many bots need to be tweaked. To get whatever arbitrary level of balance that would make you happy with this game, Pixonic would need to change so much. Both Ravana and its pilot would need to be reworked, Leech and its pilot would need to be reworked, Plasma Ming would need to be reworked, Phantom and its pilot would need to be reworked , Nodens would need to be reworked, cryo weapons would need to be reworked. It's unrealistic to expect anything closely resembling 'balance' in a P2W free mobile game, especially with the amount of content being released. It's already August and we're still getting another Titan and a completely new drone system. The game you loved is dead, boy.
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Post by derps on Aug 3, 2020 10:28:05 GMT -5
funny enough, i just saw AD Gaming YT video testing the new pilot... its bugged... doesnt work. At least on Android.
It does almost ZERO leech dmg in return, switching to a regular pilot, it did its normal amount. haha, ironic for a pilot that is supposed to do significantly more return dmg...
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