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Post by mystic spastic on Aug 18, 2019 11:28:08 GMT -5
The biggest grip F2P has with P2W is the ever increasing divide in the power gap. If the divide is low enough that it can be made up for with some REASONABLE grinding, then it's all good. Paying to save SOME time in grinding is cool in my books. The current model is like a bunch of highschoolers (F2P) being forced to play against adults (P2W) in competitive sports. Been said many times before, the overwhelming bulk of players are neither FTP or P2W. Most of us are minnows. Considering this, that FTP vs P2W argument that keeps popping up is non sequitur. Always has been. Actually, by Pixonic's own words, pure F2P makes up the overwhelming majority of players at any one time. 95-96% was shown on their recent slide.
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Post by heavypiece on Aug 18, 2019 11:29:34 GMT -5
As an F2P it seems as though it is just the same as it ever was. Play a few games, press a few buttons... Get some stuff. "Watch" a few adds... Get some stuff. It's just that some of the old buttons have been replaced with new buttons.... Not the first time. One may not get the same amount of stuff. But your still getting things for just playing the game. I am quite sure that everyone gets at the least some Ag for just playing a match. If one does not put real money into the game, one should not expect to get the same pay out as one who does. And complaning about it as though it is some sort of injustist that has been placed upon the F2P population... smh. So basically Pay to Win is a just model? Screw fairness and rewarding skill am I right. That's like saying that the richest team should win over the most skilled team. What's the point of playing to get better if you can just pay your way to victory? Greed motivated corruption at its finest. If the power gap between paying players and non-paying players is just gonna keep getting bigger and bigger, might as well quit. If all it takes to win is flashing some cash, then it takes a lot of fun from this game. IMO, YMMV. Yes. Pay to win is a just model as this "game" is actually a business. Pix is in it for the money. Better skills are rewarded with better pay-outs after each match. The better pay-outs allow one to get more stuff in the game. It just takes more time and effort to get that stuff. Pix makes it's money by selling power to players who donn't have the patiance to wait. The richest team should win as they are paying for the power to win. Once again it is part of the Pix business model. If one is F2P then the fact that you will at times be cannon fodder for those who are P2W should not come as a surprize. If one is F2P then one is actually using the fruits of the labor of other for their entertainment. It's almost as though one is "stealing" thel entertainment. But this is not really the case as Pix is using the F2P player base to feed the P2W player base. As for your "greed" coment, Pix is in it for the money. The game is a viable business model that is working for them at this time. I think the those F2P folks who feel that they deserve the "same" amount as those who are P2W are the greedy ones.
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Post by RightOn on Aug 18, 2019 11:35:30 GMT -5
So basically Pay to Win is a just model? Screw fairness and rewarding skill am I right. That's like saying that the richest team should win over the most skilled team. What's the point of playing to get better if you can just pay your way to victory? Greed motivated corruption at its finest. If the power gap between paying players and non-paying players is just gonna keep getting bigger and bigger, might as well quit. If all it takes to win is flashing some cash, then it takes a lot of fun from this game. IMO, YMMV. Yes. Pay to win is a just model as this "game" is actually a business. Pix is in it for the money. Better skills are rewarded with better pay-outs after each match. The better pay-outs allow one to get more stuff in the game. It just takes more time and effort to get that stuff. Pix makes it's money by selling power to players who donn't have the patiance to wait. The richest team should win as they are paying for the power to win. Once again it is part of the Pix business model. If one is F2P then the fact that you will at times be cannon fodder for those who are P2W should not come as a surprize. If one is F2P then one is actually using the fruits of the labor of other for their entertainment. It's almost as though one is "stealing" thel entertainment. But this is not really the case as Pix is using the F2P player base to feed the P2W player base. As for your "greed" coment, Pix is in it for the money. The game is a viable business model that is working for them at this time. I think the those F2P folks who feel that they deserve the "same" amount as those who are P2W are the greedy ones. I kind of want to doubt they make more revenue from the playerbase than advertising agencies.
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Post by mystic spastic on Aug 18, 2019 11:37:24 GMT -5
I wouldnt worry too much about the level cap until I get there. Because it is most likely going to take so many games to reach those higher levels that I wont get there Your're likely right. Even though hitting level 60 would be quite realistic.
Posting on this and the Gust PSA thread presently has me less than enthusiastic about my regular account on War Robots. Heck, even the 2-bot smurf account is getting pummeled by the MM right now, so little joy there.
So I'm thinking of going pure Skirmish for a while. I've banked up some Silver for upgrades. Watch some ads for daily gold and Skirmish hard for a couple days a week. Rinse and repeat for a month or so, until the game draws me back in.
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Post by akulon on Aug 18, 2019 11:43:59 GMT -5
Couple what I have been "given" this weekend with the upgrade overdrive that is also happening and I now have several more items at lvl12. So, what was your argument again? I still do not see why some are mad about free ?dookie? Well, how about some math:
All that free stuff would make up for the fact that 2 Tarans would need to be upgraded from mk1-10 to mk1-12 to be as effective as they were pre-OXP.
So, all good there. However:
All that free stuff in no way makes up for the fact that 4 Gusts would need to go from mk1-10 to mk2-12 to be almost as effective in burst as they were pre-OXP.
All that free stuff in no way makes up for the fact that 4 Orkans would need to be upgraded from mk1-10 to mk2-11 to be as effective in burst as they were pre-OXP.
One step forward with "free stuff". One step backwards to upgrade Tarans. Four steps backwards for Gusts. Four steps backwards for Orkans.
Please explain - why should I not be unhappy with "one step forward, nine steps back"? I am fully undertand that you are unhappy with your situation "1 step forward, 9 steps backward". For those who are happy maybe because: - Gust, Orkan and Taran are not in their main hangar - Usually Pix does not give the "1 step forward". For those
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Post by balrog89 on Aug 18, 2019 12:12:33 GMT -5
Since I am, like the bulk of the player base, a minnow, it has made quite to difference to me. Especially this weekend. I get you bruh, I really do. Let's be honest though, with your hanger and what you run, would anything make a difference? Of course it makes a difference. It's the difference between a player having a hanger 3 times more powerful than me vs having one 4 or 5 times more powerful. My skills, or Skillz as I like to say, can make up for a lot in power disparity. But as the power gap grows, I'm having to play better and better to just keep up. One day, my hanger and me as a player are gonna hit our absolute max ceiling, and that's gonna be the day I'll have to pack up and move on to something else. Or quit being War Robots Amish and get more modern 「dookie」
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Post by balrog89 on Aug 18, 2019 12:13:27 GMT -5
Been said many times before, the overwhelming bulk of players are neither FTP or P2W. Most of us are minnows. Considering this, that FTP vs P2W argument that keeps popping up is non sequitur. Always has been. Actually, by Pixonic's own words, pure F2P makes up the overwhelming majority of players at any one time. 95-96% was shown on their recent slide.
I have met very few. Here or in game.
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Post by balrog89 on Aug 18, 2019 12:21:54 GMT -5
Couple what I have been "given" this weekend with the upgrade overdrive that is also happening and I now have several more items at lvl12. So, what was your argument again? I still do not see why some are mad about free ?dookie? Well, how about some math:
All that free stuff would make up for the fact that 2 Tarans would need to be upgraded from mk1-10 to mk1-12 to be as effective as they were pre-OXP.
So, all good there. However:
All that free stuff in no way makes up for the fact that 4 Gusts would need to go from mk1-10 to mk2-12 to be almost as effective in burst as they were pre-OXP.
All that free stuff in no way makes up for the fact that 4 Orkans would need to be upgraded from mk1-10 to mk2-11 to be as effective in burst as they were pre-OXP.
One step forward with "free stuff". One step backwards to upgrade Tarans. Four steps backwards for Gusts. Four steps backwards for Orkans.
Please explain - why should I not be unhappy with "one step forward, nine steps back"? Don't care. I have used my time and what little I do spend wisely. All the weapons you mentioned are old school. I have invested time and resources on things I feel will not get nerfed and may get buffed. Sorry you did not. VIP coupled with this new resource "toy" has let me get a pair of shredders, a pair of sparks and even a Glory up to lvl12. I do not need mk2. Don't care about it. Sorry you did not have the foresight. Sorry you seem to like to spend your free time playing something that makes you unhappy. I do not.
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Post by mystic spastic on Aug 18, 2019 12:23:40 GMT -5
Actually, by Pixonic's own words, pure F2P makes up the overwhelming majority of players at any one time. 95-96% was shown on their recent slide.
I have met very few. Here or in game. So Pixonic is lying when they say that only 4-5% of players use IAP?
See slide 5 at about 4:21
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Post by balrog89 on Aug 18, 2019 13:14:41 GMT -5
I have met very few. Here or in game. So Pixonic is lying when they say that only 4-5% of players use IAP?
See slide 5 at about 4:21
Dunno. They have been 100% honest so far haven't they? I can only go by what I see. Most people here, most on FB, and most in my clan spend on cheap deals, VIP and even this new thing.
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Post by balrog89 on Aug 18, 2019 14:40:20 GMT -5
No matter what anyone says. I just hit lvl50 on the operations. Got 1500 keys. This put me over 2000. First gold chest was 1000 Au. That put me over the SC. That spin was an Ares. My next gold chest was this So yeah, some people can never be made happy (looking at OP who continuously 「female dog」es), but some of us will take the swag we never would have won otherwise, and be happy. Playing this game is about being happy is it not? OP, I hope you can someday find something in life that makes you happy. Judging by your posts here, not much does.
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Post by TheDecepticonIdeal on Aug 18, 2019 21:04:20 GMT -5
So basically Pay to Win is a just model? Screw fairness and rewarding skill am I right. That's like saying that the richest team should win over the most skilled team. What's the point of playing to get better if you can just pay your way to victory? Greed motivated corruption at its finest. If the power gap between paying players and non-paying players is just gonna keep getting bigger and bigger, might as well quit. If all it takes to win is flashing some cash, then it takes a lot of fun from this game. IMO, YMMV. Yes. Pay to win is a just model as this "game" is actually a business. Pix is in it for the money. Better skills are rewarded with better pay-outs after each match. The better pay-outs allow one to get more stuff in the game. It just takes more time and effort to get that stuff. Pix makes it's money by selling power to players who donn't have the patiance to wait. The richest team should win as they are paying for the power to win. Once again it is part of the Pix business model. If one is F2P then the fact that you will at times be cannon fodder for those who are P2W should not come as a surprize. If one is F2P then one is actually using the fruits of the labor of other for their entertainment. It's almost as though one is "stealing" thel entertainment. But this is not really the case as Pix is using the F2P player base to feed the P2W player base. As for your "greed" coment, Pix is in it for the money. The game is a viable business model that is working for them at this time. I think the those F2P folks who feel that they deserve the "same" amount as those who are P2W are the greedy ones. Mate, this "business" is a game. They sell entertainment and get money as a profit. But less and less people are gonna pay since players are wisening up to their shady practices. And no, better skills don't necessarily get you better payout. Better equipment gets you a better payout 9/10 times in this game. As selling power is a dumb thing as it hinders the spirit of competition. And are you daft? There is no way "the richest team" should automatically win. The better team should win, not the team that put more money in. That's like saying LeBron James should win every game cause he brings in more money to the NBA than any other player. Justifying it as "part of their business model" is stupidity. And wow, saying F2P players are the greedy ones cause they don't pay is dumb on so many levels that I'm not even gonna bother responding to. And I'm not saying F2P players should get the exact same as P2W players. I'm saying that the power gap between the two should be smaller than it is now. Otherwise you're gonna disenfranchise the former group and end up with a much smaller playerbase.
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Post by TheDecepticonIdeal on Aug 18, 2019 21:07:25 GMT -5
Of course it makes a difference. It's the difference between a player having a hanger 3 times more powerful than me vs having one 4 or 5 times more powerful. My skills, or Skillz as I like to say, can make up for a lot in power disparity. But as the power gap grows, I'm having to play better and better to just keep up. One day, my hanger and me as a player are gonna hit our absolute max ceiling, and that's gonna be the day I'll have to pack up and move on to something else. Or quit being War Robots Amish and get more modern ?dookie? Nah, I can't walk out on my bots
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Post by mystic spastic on Aug 18, 2019 21:08:36 GMT -5
No matter what anyone says. I just hit lvl50 on the operations. Got 1500 keys. This put me over 2000. First gold chest was 1000 Au. That put me over the SC. That spin was an Ares. My next gold chest was this So yeah, some people can never be made happy (looking at OP who continuously ?female dog?es), but some of us will take the swag we never would have won otherwise, and be happy. Playing this game is about being happy is it not? OP, I hope you can someday find something in life that makes you happy. Judging by your posts here, not much does. Oh dude, you've been reading my diary haven't you?
I'm so hopelessly depressed, I feel like just hopping in a Rog, disconnecting the eject system, and jumping into the gorge on Castle. Goodby cruel world...
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Post by TerminatorWR on Aug 18, 2019 21:13:36 GMT -5
Yes. Pay to win is a just model as this "game" is actually a business. Pix is in it for the money. Better skills are rewarded with better pay-outs after each match. The better pay-outs allow one to get more stuff in the game. It just takes more time and effort to get that stuff. Pix makes it's money by selling power to players who donn't have the patiance to wait. The richest team should win as they are paying for the power to win. Once again it is part of the Pix business model. If one is F2P then the fact that you will at times be cannon fodder for those who are P2W should not come as a surprize. If one is F2P then one is actually using the fruits of the labor of other for their entertainment. It's almost as though one is "stealing" thel entertainment. But this is not really the case as Pix is using the F2P player base to feed the P2W player base. As for your "greed" coment, Pix is in it for the money. The game is a viable business model that is working for them at this time. I think the those F2P folks who feel that they deserve the "same" amount as those who are P2W are the greedy ones. I agree with you even though I'm a F2P player.
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Post by TerminatorWR on Aug 18, 2019 21:16:34 GMT -5
And I'm not saying F2P players should get the exact same as P2W players. I'm saying that the power gap between the two should be smaller than it is now. Otherwise you're gonna disenfranchise the former group and end up with a much smaller playerbase. Right, and this is what Pixonic should listen to.
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Post by TheDecepticonIdeal on Aug 18, 2019 21:22:34 GMT -5
And I'm not saying F2P players should get the exact same as P2W players. I'm saying that the power gap between the two should be smaller than it is now. Otherwise you're gonna disenfranchise the former group and end up with a much smaller playerbase. Right, and this is what Pixonic should listen to. This is what they were doing until 2017, just before the release of the dash bots. The payers got their hands on the latest gear weeks/months before a F2P player can grind for it, so the payers were able to enjoy the edge in power for a short period of time for a REASONABLE price. It was also during this period War Robots became very popular and amassed a large following. The top end bots/weapon were stronger than those below them, but they weren't overwhelmingly powerful like they are now. Then pix decided to sell power and the power gap became wider and wider until we're in this mess now where no one is truly happy with their decisions or trust them.
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Post by balrog89 on Aug 18, 2019 21:27:39 GMT -5
Or quit being War Robots Amish and get more modern ?dookie? Nah, I can't walk out on my bots As cheap as they are to upgrade, you should have tons of resources saved. Wanna sell me some
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Post by balrog89 on Aug 18, 2019 21:28:57 GMT -5
No matter what anyone says. I just hit lvl50 on the operations. Got 1500 keys. This put me over 2000. First gold chest was 1000 Au. That put me over the SC. That spin was an Ares. My next gold chest was this So yeah, some people can never be made happy (looking at OP who continuously ?female dog?es), but some of us will take the swag we never would have won otherwise, and be happy. Playing this game is about being happy is it not? OP, I hope you can someday find something in life that makes you happy. Judging by your posts here, not much does. Oh dude, you've been reading my diary haven't you?
I'm so hopelessly depressed, I feel like just hopping in a Rog, disconnecting the eject system, and jumping into the gorge on Castle. Goodby cruel world...
At least you still have your humor.....
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Post by TerminatorWR on Aug 18, 2019 21:30:32 GMT -5
Right, and this is what Pixonic should listen to. This is what they were doing until 2017, just before the release of the dash bots. The payers got their hands on the latest gear weeks/months before a F2P player can grind for it, so the payers were able to enjoy the edge in power for a short period of time for a REASONABLE price. It was also during this period War Robots became very popular and amassed a large following. The top end bots/weapon were stronger than those below them, but they weren't overwhelmingly powerful like they are now. Then pix decided to sell power and the power gap became wider and wider until we're in this mess now where no one is truly happy with their decisions or trust them. Yeah I remember those good old days when I was grinding hard for a powerful fat Lancelot but still could compete well with my 2 cheap Griffins LOL.
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Post by TheDecepticonIdeal on Aug 18, 2019 21:34:23 GMT -5
Nah, I can't walk out on my bots As cheap as they are to upgrade, you should have tons of resources saved. Wanna sell me some Too late lol, already sold whatever I don't need ages ago. Yet I'm still poor. I don't play nearly as much as I used to these days, being lucky to play an hour a day nowadays. Real life's getting busier, and sacrifices must be made. Pity I love my family more than my bots
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Post by Deleted on Aug 19, 2019 2:41:18 GMT -5
Actually, by Pixonic's own words, pure F2P makes up the overwhelming majority of players at any one time. 95-96% was shown on their recent slide.
I have met very few. Here or in game. I agree that you might as well howl at the moon than complain about Pix being Pix, but I'm sure that there are lots and lots of players that don't pay; there are three that live in my house! I won't pay an unregulated pseudo-gambling business - not a judgement on anybody else, just my opinion - but there are literally millions of players who can just about afford a phone, but not the in game content in the rest of the world. Remember that this group is both English speaking and keen enough on the game to join a forum to talk about it.
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Post by milty72 on Aug 19, 2019 4:19:14 GMT -5
Been said many times before, the overwhelming bulk of players are neither FTP or P2W. Most of us are minnows. Considering this, that FTP vs P2W argument that keeps popping up is non sequitur. Always has been. Fair enough, I might have gone to the extremes there a bit. However, it cannot be denied that the spending disparity plays a huge role in determining who wins and who doesn't. Keep the game balanced. It would work Oki if MM was betterer and the leagues trophies didn't keep pushing you up.
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Post by TheDecepticonIdeal on Aug 19, 2019 4:58:07 GMT -5
I have met very few. Here or in game. I agree that you might as well howl at the moon than complain about Pix being Pix, but I'm sure that there are lots and lots of players that don't pay; there are three that live in my house! I won't pay an unregulated pseudo-gambling business - not a judgement on anybody else, just my opinion - but there are literally millions of players who can just about afford a phone, but not the in game content in the rest of the world. Remember that this group is both English speaking and keen enough on the game to join a forum to talk about it. Yep, this forum represents a tiny minority of the total War Robots playbase, so taking this sample size and making any big judgement is not gonna be accurate.
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Post by Poopface on Aug 19, 2019 5:22:30 GMT -5
Actually, by Pixonic's own words, pure F2P makes up the overwhelming majority of players at any one time. 95-96% was shown on their recent slide.
I have met very few. Here or in game. Hi! I’m PF. Greetings and salutations, fellow forum-goer! The pleasure is all mine.
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Post by Poopface on Aug 19, 2019 5:28:15 GMT -5
I have met very few. Here or in game. I'm sure that there are lots and lots of players that don't pay; there are three that live in my house! Do they know you know? How’d you sort it out: Food going missing from the fridge? Energy bills higher than they should be? Strange noises for no particular reason?
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Post by balrog89 on Aug 19, 2019 8:53:18 GMT -5
I agree that you might as well howl at the moon than complain about Pix being Pix, but I'm sure that there are lots and lots of players that don't pay; there are three that live in my house! I won't pay an unregulated pseudo-gambling business - not a judgement on anybody else, just my opinion - but there are literally millions of players who can just about afford a phone, but not the in game content in the rest of the world. Remember that this group is both English speaking and keen enough on the game to join a forum to talk about it. Yep, this forum represents a tiny minority of the total War Robots playbase, so taking this sample size and making any big judgement is not gonna be accurate. I was also including my clan as well as FB. Also going by what I see from other clans from South America and Asia. Asian clans are loaded with whales. Almost as much as American clans are. South American clans have minnows. I know this because I belong to a few Discord channels that are not clan specific and we all BS on them. I am sure many people do strictly play for free, but the overwhelming majority, that I have met, get the $.99 deals or premium. Once in a blue moon they may spend $10. These players are not PTW, but are technically not F2P either. As far as what relates to this thread, which has been derailed a bit. It seems this new thing is the best deal Pix has released in some time. Most old players I have talked to say it is actually the very best. It gives more free stuff than they have ever seen even if you take the free route. Yet, some still 「female dog」......
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Post by TheDecepticonIdeal on Aug 19, 2019 9:20:04 GMT -5
Yep, this forum represents a tiny minority of the total War Robots playbase, so taking this sample size and making any big judgement is not gonna be accurate. I was also including my clan as well as FB. Also going by what I see from other clans from South America and Asia. Asian clans are loaded with whales. Almost as much as American clans are. South American clans have minnows. I know this because I belong to a few Discord channels that are not clan specific and we all BS on them. I am sure many people do strictly play for free, but the overwhelming majority, that I have met, get the $.99 deals or premium. Once in a blue moon they may spend $10. These players are not PTW, but are technically not F2P either. As far as what relates to this thread, which has been derailed a bit. It seems this new thing is the best deal Pix has released in some time. Most old players I have talked to say it is actually the very best. It gives more free stuff than they have ever seen even if you take the free route. Yet, some still ?female dog?...... Completely agree with you that the Operations is a great thing. In my previous posts I think I came off as rather apprehensive about the Operations. I just want to make clear that I'm happy with all the extra stuff I'm getting. Gonna enjoy it while it lasts lol. Regards the F2P vs PTW vs minnow discussion, there's no way we can find the real answer since all our opinions are limited to what we see and who we talk to. So not much point going on about that anymore. But I'm sure all three groups will agree with me when I say that the ever increasing power gap is only hurting the game.
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Post by Loganspawn on Aug 19, 2019 9:29:18 GMT -5
Since I am, like the bulk of the player base, a minnow, it has made quite to difference to me. Especially this weekend. I get you bruh, I really do. Let's be honest though, with your hanger and what you run, would anything make a difference? Of course it makes a difference. It's the difference between a player having a hanger 3 times more powerful than me vs having one 4 or 5 times more powerful. My skills, or Skillz as I like to say, can make up for a lot in power disparity. But as the power gap grows, I'm having to play better and better to just keep up. One day, my hanger and me as a player are gonna hit our absolute max ceiling, and that's gonna be the day I'll have to pack up and move on to something else. But the problem here is Matchmaker and Pix not the players. We all know everything it is exactly how Pix wants it. MOST high level players don't have all that gear to smash lower level people we have it to try to compete against other top tier players.
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Post by Loganspawn on Aug 19, 2019 9:31:57 GMT -5
Actually, by Pixonic's own words, pure F2P makes up the overwhelming majority of players at any one time. 95-96% was shown on their recent slide.
I have met very few. Here or in game. They are not in our league (Champ) and most players are not on the forum anyways especially those that spend nothing.. I would say the vast majority of players spend no money but we never see them in game or here.
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