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Post by Deleted on Sept 4, 2017 19:41:41 GMT -5
If you're not planning on dropping cash into the gamble for the superchest, don't roll your keys. They're spent automatically at the end of the cycle with the key "rewards" removed.
Since the chance of highrolling an equal or greater amount of keys is slim (on average, key prizes refund only 30-70% of what was spent), it's much better to just act as though the keys don't exist, so when the black market cycle ends, you only obtain the tangible prizes (gear/ag/au) for each chest the system rolls for you.
Let's face it, unless you're dropping cash, the super chest is far and away from obtainable without the blessings of RNGesus, and the super chest is the only reason to actually roll chests before the cycle reset.
Hfgl
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Post by BLYTHE on Sept 4, 2017 19:54:13 GMT -5
I hadn't thought of that--thanks. You're right though; often you spend keys to get keys but at a much lower value.
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Post by shagot on Sept 4, 2017 19:58:49 GMT -5
Interesting idea.
So, if i buy, for example, 100 keys couple of minutes before event ends, what will be opened, 1 silver or 10 bronzes?
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Post by moody on Sept 4, 2017 20:09:26 GMT -5
Interesting idea. So, if i buy, for example, 100 keys couple of minutes before event ends, what will be opened, 1 silver or 10 bronzes? Yes, 1 silver. The event doesn't end, there is no event. Just because it looks like an event doesn't mean it is. The blackmarket resets and starts again.
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Post by T34 on Sept 4, 2017 20:16:12 GMT -5
OP, your suggestion is good for minimizing gaming addiction generated by the easy reward and gambling aspects.
From my perspective, I have been playing a lot. Lot for me at least with over 1100 player ranking points. Opened many chests and got lucky a few times by getting lots of keys in return. Reinvested all the keys and I am about 60% of the way to a super chest. Without even more substantial luck or dropping RM towards the end of the cycle the super chest does not seem to be obtainable at my current rate of play.
Personally, I will keep going hard at it for this cycle. Wont do it for the next cycle again. This carrot is very hard to grab. Very hard.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 4, 2017 20:35:14 GMT -5
OP, your suggestion is good for minimizing gaming addiction generated by the easy reward and gambling aspects. From my perspective, I have been playing a lot. Lot for me at least with over 1100 player ranking points. Opened many chests and got lucky a few times by getting lots of keys in return. Reinvested all the keys and I am about 60% of the way to a super chest. Without even more substantial luck or dropping RM towards the end of the cycle the super chest does not seem to be obtainable at my current rate of play. Personally, I will keep going hard at it for this cycle. Wont do it for the next cycle again. This carrot is very hard to grab. Very hard. Judging by the progress bar(and chest opening videos), it's the same as the last event 7500 swagbucks to proc the super chest. With 3 being the average per match for consistent players, that's 2.5k games played for a super chest in a single 15 day period with no cash spent. Mail.Ru tries to account for people using shared accounts, so it's not 100% moneygrab. They just haven't found a way to curb shared accounts. The biggest issue with the old "Player of the day/week/month/etc" was that there were groups of people sharing accounts to rack up activity points with a single account being played almost 24/7, meaning only these accounts ever got anything from them, not the actually skilled players. The f2p model on the BM has the same issue. Mail.Ru and old Pix's policy on these endeavors and current ones, is never to punish the offending parties, but to try to make it impossible for said parties to continue their behaviour by overshooting the curve. This rarely hurts the people abusing the game, instead it usually punishes honest players by making the abusive habits the only way to benefit at all.
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Post by bronzeknee on Sept 4, 2017 23:57:09 GMT -5
They're spent automatically at the end of the cycle with the key "rewards" removed. Awesome advice, but how sure are you about this?
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Post by moody on Sept 5, 2017 0:00:14 GMT -5
They're spent automatically at the end of the cycle with the key "rewards" removed. Awesome advice, but how sure are you about this? There is a document from pix stating that this happens.
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Post by moody on Sept 5, 2017 0:03:00 GMT -5
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sihidaj
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Post by sihidaj on Sept 5, 2017 3:24:23 GMT -5
Don't know if by the end of the "cycle" keys will be removed from the prizes of automatically opened chests. This may actually happened in old events, but now the black market will be still reopened after a cycle, so it will still be possibile to obtain keys from those chests... because you can spend them later in the new "cycle"
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Post by frunobulax on Sept 5, 2017 3:25:51 GMT -5
I wonder if the keys are even worth their equivalent value in gold. In the gold event, players would buy maybe 10k gold and get items in return in much higher gold value, because the gold chests would sometimes contain large amounts of gold, and a lot of items worth more than 1000k gold.
Now, I rolled 4 silver chests, and 3 times just got keys back, ranging from 60-80 per chest, and 70 gold.
13k keys cost roughly as much as 13k gold. So my question is: Do we even get equal value if we do 13 gold chest spins, or do we actually get _less_ than we would if we would buy 13k gold and spend it directly?
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Post by WilsonK on Sept 5, 2017 3:37:00 GMT -5
If you're not planning on dropping cash into the gamble for the superchest, don't roll your keys. They're spent automatically at the end of the cycle with the key "rewards" removed. Since the chance of highrolling an equal or greater amount of keys is slim (on average, key prizes refund only 30-70% of what was spent), it's much better to just act as though the keys don't exist, so when the black market cycle ends, you only obtain the tangible prizes (gear/ag/au) for each chest the system rolls for you. Let's face it, unless you're dropping cash, the super chest is far and away from obtainable without the blessings of RNGesus, and the super chest is the only reason to actually roll chests before the cycle reset. Hfgl Yeap, even with intense 12-hour gameplays everyday, a superchest will be crazy hard to achieve within the Black Market timeline. Let's just treat the Black Market as: After two weeks of gameplay, let us reward you with random crates, for free!Why not? BUT BUT I got to admit though... I MISS 3RD ANNIVERSARY EVENT, WHERE YOU ROLL CHESTS WITH AU! WHO SECONDS THIS?!
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Post by Deleted on Sept 5, 2017 3:38:14 GMT -5
Don't know if by the end of the "cycle" keys will be removed from the prizes of automatically opened chests. This may actually happened in old events, but now the black market will be still reopened after a cycle, so it will still be possibile to obtain keys from those chests... because you can spend them later in the new "cycle"
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Post by WilsonK on Sept 5, 2017 3:39:40 GMT -5
Awesome advice, but how sure are you about this? There is a document from pix stating that this happens. And it wouldn't make sense that at the end of the event, for you to still roll "keys". Just think about it.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 5, 2017 3:42:22 GMT -5
I wonder if the keys are even worth their equivalent value in gold. In the gold event, players would buy maybe 10k gold and get items in return in much higher gold value, because the gold chests would sometimes contain large amounts of gold, and a lot of items worth more than 1000k gold. Now, I rolled 4 silver chests, and 3 times just got keys back, ranging from 60-80 per chest, and 70 gold. 13k keys cost roughly as much as 13k gold. So my question is: Do we even get equal value if we do 13 gold chest spins, or do we actually get _less_ than we would if we would buy 13k gold and spend it directly? It depends entirely on what you already own, and what you end up rolling. If you spend 13k au and get a dash bot or WW bot, you're above the curve. If you already have most of the au items you need to level for a competetive hangar, chances are you're not going to get much unless you high roll. With 13 1k chests a single re-roll will prettt much guarantee 2 super chests. So its one of those things that has so much RNG, YMMV
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Post by infraviolet on Sept 5, 2017 3:51:16 GMT -5
OP, your suggestion is good for minimizing gaming addiction generated by the easy reward and gambling aspects. From my perspective, I have been playing a lot. Lot for me at least with over 1100 player ranking points. Opened many chests and got lucky a few times by getting lots of keys in return. Reinvested all the keys and I am about 60% of the way to a super chest. Without even more substantial luck or dropping RM towards the end of the cycle the super chest does not seem to be obtainable at my current rate of play. Personally, I will keep going hard at it for this cycle. Wont do it for the next cycle again. This carrot is very hard to grab. Very hard. I'm about halfway to a Superchest as well. But I'm on the fence whether to see it through. No way am I gonna spend hours and hours grinding for free BM keys though...
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Post by frunobulax on Sept 5, 2017 3:51:57 GMT -5
I have thought about spinning the wheel in my fb account, that has a grand total of zero gold items. So every gold item except maybe a Gekko would be welcome. Still, if the return is say the equivalent of 15k gold, it's not worth it. Especially with that discount offer out there that gives 2k gold and a Lance for 30 bucks (though I have yet to see it on my FB account). But 3.1 hasn't arrived there yet, so I have time to make up my mind. After all, I haven't been exactly happy with Pixo recently. On my main account I'm not at all tempted, as only a Doc, another Zeus and maybe a Rog are on my shopping list. OK, another pair of Orkans for the Doc maybe. But this is all changeup hangar stuff, my main hangar is set (1 Tarancilot, 1 Thorkalot, 2 DB Griff, 1 Zeus Molot Natty). Edit: I remember the Anniversary event. I'm pretty sure that the win chances were changed after a couple of days, because people that immediately rolled gold chests seemed to win a lot of stuff, while all the people hanging back and waiting for the reports didn't get much. I knew that I had pretty much everything I needed for an endgame hangar (even though I didn't have the second Lance back then), so I decided to spend 3k of my accumulated gold to roll chests. Most gold chests gave back just 700-800 gold, and in the end I traded my 3k gold for - a Jesse from the superchest, and my third Gary. But OK, it was accumulated gold, so no harm done, it only slowed my progress towards my second Lance a bit.
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Post by frunobulax on Sept 5, 2017 4:12:53 GMT -5
I'm about halfway to a Superchest as well. But I'm on the fence whether to see it through. No way am I gonna spend hours and hours grinding for free BM keys though... Ugh. Grinding? Mind you, if the superchest bar is half full, it means you're probably 25% there. The bar is not linear. To get 1000 keys you'd need 300 games. Even in beacon rush mode that's maybe 20-30 hours of play... Assuming you win 500 keys on average, that's north of 100h gameplay to get to the superchest. Also it seems to me that you don't get keys if you mech out. (Or maybe that bug is already fixed.) Everybody can decide if he wants to throw money at Pixo, but I don't think grinding is worth the effort.
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Post by WilsonK on Sept 5, 2017 4:18:12 GMT -5
I'm about halfway to a Superchest as well. But I'm on the fence whether to see it through. No way am I gonna spend hours and hours grinding for free BM keys though... Ugh. Grinding? Mind you, if the superchest bar is half full, it means you're probably 25% there. The bar is not linear. To get 1000 keys you'd need 300 games. Even in beacon rush mode that's maybe 20-30 hours of play... Assuming you win 500 keys on average, that's north of 100h gameplay to get to the superchest. Also it seems to me that you don't get keys if you mech out. (Or maybe that bug is already fixed.) Everybody can decide if he wants to throw money at Pixo, but I don't think grinding is worth the effort. I'd rather take the grind for Au and Ag, you'll feel better "paid".
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sihidaj
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Post by sihidaj on Sept 5, 2017 4:37:23 GMT -5
Don't know if by the end of the "cycle" keys will be removed from the prizes of automatically opened chests. This may actually happened in old events, but now the black market will be still reopened after a cycle, so it will still be possibile to obtain keys from those chests... because you can spend them later in the new "cycle" I will try to wait and not to roll anything then! Let's see what happens
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Post by Deleted on Sept 5, 2017 5:16:37 GMT -5
While the suggestion to wait has merit in terms of minimizing time spent and potential black market adfiction, assuming that the rewards will be better is speculation at best. Most logical way to implement this would be to simply reroll untill there are no keys left. No reason to generate key-free seperate loot tables for it.
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Post by shagot on Sept 5, 2017 5:22:14 GMT -5
I wonder if the keys are even worth their equivalent value in gold. In the gold event, players would buy maybe 10k gold and get items in return in much higher gold value, because the gold chests would sometimes contain large amounts of gold, and a lot of items worth more than 1000k gold. Now, I rolled 4 silver chests, and 3 times just got keys back, ranging from 60-80 per chest, and 70 gold. 13k keys cost roughly as much as 13k gold. So my question is: Do we even get equal value if we do 13 gold chest spins, or do we actually get _less_ than we would if we would buy 13k gold and spend it directly? Depends on luck and your current gear. If u already own all the bots, chance is you wont be happy with spin results, especially if you dont roll korean. On the other hand , I got some gold, wp and ww bots I didnt have before, plus one korean and more then 10000 gold (and some orkans and scourge). It worked very well for me. But it was very lucky roll obviously .
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Post by frunobulax on Sept 5, 2017 5:22:48 GMT -5
The rewards from the bronze chests are obviously crap, so I roll a silver whenever I got 100. Again, my verdict on silver is "crap, too".
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Post by Deleted on Sept 5, 2017 7:14:02 GMT -5
While the suggestion to wait has merit in terms of minimizing time spent and potential black market adfiction, assuming that the rewards will be better is speculation at best. Most logical way to implement this would be to simply reroll untill there are no keys left. No reason to generate key-free seperate loot tables for it. The only way to truly find out is to wait until the end and denote the swagbucks vs the amount of rewards given. If, say, one has 660 swagbucks, and gets 12 non swag rewards, the system is drawing non swag rolls only when it is reseting swag. If its less or more, then the system is rando-ing the tables as they are. Considering the many iterations of swagbucks in the last year, as well as the changes in the drop tables, it wouldn't be that difficult to have a separate template to remove all swag from everything but Mother Russia's profit margin. If its the same system as before, it shouldnt give any more or less than the amount of machoboxes that were predetermined for the amount of swagbucks a sucker has. IIRC I never recieved more or less than the total increment of 100's and 10's before the purge.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 5, 2017 8:10:31 GMT -5
While the suggestion to wait has merit in terms of minimizing time spent and potential black market adfiction, assuming that the rewards will be better is speculation at best. Most logical way to implement this would be to simply reroll untill there are no keys left. No reason to generate key-free seperate loot tables for it. The only way to truly find out is to wait until the end and denote the swagbucks vs the amount of rewards given. If, say, one has 660 swagbucks, and gets 12 non swag rewards, the system is drawing non swag rolls only when it is reseting swag. If its less or more, then the system is rando-ing the tables as they are. Considering the many iterations of swagbucks in the last year, as well as the changes in the drop tables, it wouldn't be that difficult to have a separate template to remove all swag from everything but Mother Russia's profit margin. If its the same system as before, it shouldnt give any more or less than the amount of machoboxes that were predetermined for the amount of swagbucks a sucker has. IIRC I never recieved more or less than the total increment of 100's and 10's before the purge. That's a good point and well thought. It's not 100% guaranteed (as number of swag-keys won could result in an identical number of other-than-key winnings) but pretty close.
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Post by shagot on Sept 5, 2017 9:04:25 GMT -5
The rewards from the bronze chests are obviously crap, so I roll a silver whenever I got 100. Again, my verdict on silver is "crap, too". I got furry and scourche (or tempest, not sure atm) from bronze. Rng..
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Post by Domino on Sept 5, 2017 9:12:11 GMT -5
There is a document from pix stating that this happens. And it wouldn't make sense that at the end of the event, for you to still roll "keys". Just think about it. That's an assumption and your post is heavily based on it. You roll keys then it will check your balance, if you can roll a larger chest, it will. It's easily programmable.
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Post by Ⅎ₹ѺC₭₩ELDEℲ₹ on Sept 5, 2017 10:02:04 GMT -5
The key chests can be replaced with silver/ gold chests with no effort.
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Post by infraviolet on Sept 5, 2017 10:05:29 GMT -5
Ugh. Grinding? Mind you, if the superchest bar is half full, it means you're probably 25% there. The bar is not linear. To get 1000 keys you'd need 300 games. Even in beacon rush mode that's maybe 20-30 hours of play... Assuming you win 500 keys on average, that's north of 100h gameplay to get to the superchest. Also it seems to me that you don't get keys if you mech out. (Or maybe that bug is already fixed.) Everybody can decide if he wants to throw money at Pixo, but I don't think grinding is worth the effort. I'd rather take the grind for Au and Ag, you'll feel better "paid". Yeah that's what I'm saying. With Au and Ag you can grind indefinitely (and even passively) for. But to force oneself to grind for several thousand BM keys that you accrue at a much lower rate to meet a deadline just days away? In that case I'd rather pay...provided I'm committed to a Superchest.
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Post by frunobulax on Sept 5, 2017 10:26:08 GMT -5
Yeah, exactly. It's not worth grinding for keys. I played a bit more during the last month, because I got 1 month premium. Not too much though, but at least I went back from 225 million to 260 million silver now. Almost enough to get my hangar to 10/11 But even there I refuse to grind, I just play when I feel like it. If I run out of silver I'll just upgrade my Fujin and my Raijin - until level 9 they are at less than 500k silver a day, and upgrading takes forever.
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