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Post by carnage on Jul 7, 2017 4:24:07 GMT -5
I know from the start I will be shot by the "don't touch anything crowd", and that is a pity because in despite of what those people could say, there are still some decisions which would be good for the game. Here is IMO a good summary of those.
Light robots
CASE 1 : Gepard. It is basically a Destrier with a third light slot. There is no way this Gepard is worth 1'200 gold and this needs to be recognized. SUGGESTION : Unlock the speed. Start at 58, add 1 every level until level 6 for it to go 63 so it can at least follow a Stalker or a Gareth. Add 10% of HP. Drop the price to 1000 gold and give 200 gold for players that bought their Gepard in 2017, 100 gold for those who bought it in 2016.
CASE 2 : Gareth. A source of various opinions, many were saying it was OP and some of course defended the Gareth as it is. I am definitely of the opinion that the Gareth was OP (not OP in the unkillable sense, but OP in the sense it was basically a light with heavy-like abilities), and I strongly suspect that is one of the reason behind the missile buff. I'll address the missiles question later. SUGGESTION : Drop slightly the speed (-5%), and HP of the shield (-10%). I know the Gareth lovers will hate that but that nerf would be minimal and if we look at the end result, Gareth would still stay the best light robot by a very large margin.
Medium robots
I was a big advocate of the "buff the Rog", now that it has been done, things look alright here. Don't fix what is not broken, fine, in this particular case I think that it is indeed true.
Heavy robots
CASE 3 : Rhino. A level 6 Rhino costs over 7M. Right now it is just not worth that price when a Leo or a Griffin is worth only 1.7M. SUGGESTION : Buff the health (+20%), so that it would be on par with the Leo. Current health is not that great for a robot which is supposed to be durable. A buff in health should make the Rhino to be worth its reputation of a strong and durable robot.
CASE 4 : Raijin. Same case as the Rhino, not worth the silver. SUGGESTION : Increase speed (+20%) so this spider bot could move a bit more efficiently. Health is good but speed is horrible currently.
Light weapons
CASE 5 : Pins. The RDB Griffin is arguably the best setup currently, and it is a silver setup. The result ? Griffins RDB are literally everywhere and diversity has been killed from the game. SUGGESTION : Drop the range of Pins from 500m to 450m. It is still a very reasonable nerf that would force RDB setups to play around 400m and be a bit more under the threat of plasma. A good plasma Gareth for instance would have a better chance to attack those Pins setups.
CASE 6 : Ecu. We never see them in the game, and for good reason. It's just not worth it currently. SUGGESTION : Buff the Ecu by 50%. A level 9 Ecu would be 90HP instead of 60HP, and could start to be interesting in some setups.
Medium weapons
CASE 7 : Tulumbas. War Robots has become "War of Tulumbas" right now. Cheap and deadly, Tulumbas are basically a mid-range Orkan. SUGGESTION : Drop the range from 500m to 450m for the exact same reason as the Pins. Make it a gold weapon, 1000 gold per Tulumbas. I know this suggestion will not be liked by some players but if you want to keep a long term vision for the game, that is very coherent with the Orkans at 1200. And yes, it already happened in the past that some silver items became gold. It's not ideal, but sometimes, you have to take this kind of decisions.
CASE 8 : Ecu. A medium-slot Ecu should be stronger than a light. Buff it by 100% when it is attached to a medium slot so the Ecu really has a sense. A level 9 would then be worth 120HP instead of 60HP. It's not like everything is realistic into the game so we could deal with the idea than the Ecu would be a bit stronger when it is on a medium slot than a light one.
CASE 9 : Punishers are arguably the worse medium weapon vs Molots, Tulumbas, Tarans and Orkans. SUGGESTION : Give them a shield-piercing ability (same for the light Punisher). That would make them much more viable and would diversify the game at the same time.
Hard weapons
CASE 10 : Kang Dae. Arguably the worst sniper weapon vs Nashorn and Trebuchet. SUGGESTION : 15s reload time is obscene fur such an average weapon. Make it 12s (Nashorn is 9). Kang Dae would still be slightly inferior to Nashorn in DPS, add it a shield piercing ability.
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Post by carnage on Jul 7, 2017 4:59:58 GMT -5
To further comment on those ideas, I think the main change here would be the nerf of the range of the RDB setups. 450m is still very reasonable, just in between an Orkan (300m) and a Zeus (600m). That reduced range for the RDB would give a better chance for other setups to defend themselves (plasma typically), which would potentially cause a slight drop in the number of missiles in the game.
The drop in missiles would re-install britbots in the game. This is where a (very) slight nerf to the Gareth could kick in (with addition of shield-piercing weapons) in order to avoid the previous situation of having the Gareth ruling the game under the TT.
Basically, instead of buffing missiles like crazy to deal with the abundance of britbots, the proposed changes would be more diversified and would give more diversity to the game IMO.
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Post by Tin-B-Chai gogogo on Jul 7, 2017 5:15:40 GMT -5
I agree the RDB is OP today, a slight nerf will be reasonable.
p.s. I'm bored in running a Tulu Doc right now, as there is so much "Boo-Boo" robotsss there.
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Post by Firebeard on Jul 7, 2017 6:12:04 GMT -5
Or we could rollback the 2.9 Damage Buff and make everything right in the World, again ..
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Post by carnage on Jul 7, 2017 6:19:36 GMT -5
Or we could rollback the 2.9 Damage Buff and make everything right in the World, again .. I don't think so. First, it happened for a reason, and I strongly suspect the domination of britbots was one of them.
Second, in itself, the idea of having the same mechanic for all missile weapons is a good one IMO. It just needs a bit of fine-tuning now, hence the suggestion of dropping the range from 500m to 450m.
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Post by Firebeard on Jul 7, 2017 6:37:39 GMT -5
Or we could rollback the 2.9 Damage Buff and make everything right in the World, again .. I don't think so. First, it happened for a reason, and I strongly suspect the domination of britbots was one of them.
Second, in itself, the idea of having the same mechanic for all missile weapons is a good one IMO. It just needs a bit of fine-tuning now, hence the suggestion of dropping the range from 500m to 450m. Here's a question: What's the purpose of a Shield if it doesn't'Shield you?The Britbots, Rhino and Raijin made sense. I had no issue with them. The problem was that the pilots got good with them. So, people couldn't destroy them easily with their self-perceived god bots. Same with the Ancilot - great tank but people couldn't figure out how to work around them. So, ruin it .. Every time Players make something work, someone screams "NERF! - it's hilarious really ..
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Post by carnage on Jul 7, 2017 6:41:39 GMT -5
I am not screaming nerf, I am screaming rebalance. I am screaming for more diversity. I want to start and see various robots around me, not just 5 Griffin RDB like it happens in half of my games. Besides, seeing less missiles would be an indirect buff to the shields, so your point about the shields certainly doesn't hold here. Let's agree to disagree I suppose. I know you are against any proposition and that's fine, it's your right I mean. I just personally think that this game has serious room for improvement, and that those suggestions would bring much more balance and diversity into the game. To each his own I guess.
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Post by TravLar on Jul 7, 2017 7:11:55 GMT -5
Nice work carnage , I think these are some really good suggestions and that they conform to the principle of balance within the game.
I'd add these: Ecu shields could as separate items, medium and light. I think physical shields should offer some protection against splash.
I couldn't agree more about the Punishers, they should be like this, a real armour muncher:
Its the GAU 8 Avenger, from the A-10 "Warthog" ground attack jet.
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Post by Firebeard on Jul 7, 2017 7:49:11 GMT -5
I am not screaming nerf, I am screaming rebalance. I am screaming for more diversity. I want to start and see various robots around me, not just 5 Griffin RDB like it happens in half of my games. Besides, seeing less missiles would be an indirect buff to the shields, so your point about the shields certainly doesn't hold here. Let's agree to disagree I suppose. I know you are against any proposition and that's fine, it's your right I mean. I just personally think that this game has serious room for improvement, and that those suggestions would bring much more balance and diversity into the game. To each his own I guess. I agree with pretty much all you wrote. I just thought things were good with what was available. This new armour-piercing for the ballistics makes sense. But other than that, it was good - great even, in my opinion.
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Post by ⓣⓡⓘⓒⓚⓨ48 on Jul 7, 2017 8:07:44 GMT -5
Ya know, they had a lot of weapon (maybe bot too... not sure) re-balances on the last Test Server... they did not list what they were, but I would not be surprised if it was enough to completely change the basis for which this post was made from.
On that note, anyone know exactly what those balance changes were?
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Post by Danny Linguini on Jul 7, 2017 8:12:04 GMT -5
I honestly don't think any rebalancing of bots or weps is needed at this point, other than maybe periodic 'adjustments' to keep players on their toes. Sure the RDB Griff is potent (and it's also the only thing keeping me remotely competitive at this point), but it's still relatively ineffective against the increasingly prevalent ancile, and it's also very beatable by a decent plasma bot.
What desperately needs help in balancing this game is doing something about the tankers. When I'm up against fairly matched players, I do fairly well -- win some, lose some, and I'm good with that as long as it's competitive and I have a reasonable chance to either win or learn from my loss. But when my 4-slot 6/7 hangar is up against 5-slot 11/12's in SILVER leagues, I and my teammates have basically zero chance, and that's the kind of thing that's been rampant this week and totally ruins the game experience for me. THAT's what needs to be fixed badly.
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Post by Danny Linguini on Jul 7, 2017 8:33:07 GMT -5
Oh yeah, and just one more thing -- FIX WHATEVER IT IS THAT HAS ME, (once again knocked down to SILVER LEAGUE), MATCHED UP AGAINST GOLD AND DIAMOND LEAGUERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Post by Firebeard on Jul 7, 2017 8:44:18 GMT -5
Ya know, they had a lot of weapon (maybe bot too... not sure) re-balances on the last Test Server... they did not list what they were, but I would not be surprised if it was enough to completely change the basis for which this post was made from. On that note, anyone know exactly what those balance changes were? How did it feel? Was there a noticeable difference or better, closer Matches? ..
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Post by ♧SGT FURY 24/7♧ on Jul 7, 2017 8:45:13 GMT -5
The easiest solution for the vast majority of tankers is to not reward the behavior. No need for the LQ, no complicated algorithm necessary, just take the profit out of it. Players dropping more than one full league rank (E2 dropping below D2, for example) would not receive any gold or silver from battles, win or lose, until they got back to within 1 full league rank of their maximum qualification rating.
The problem we've all seen is the lvl 11/12 hangars showing up on bronze and silver league. Pixonic is on the right track, having made the league advancement reward a one time thing (they did that, right?), but these players still rake in gold for damage and beacons as they stomp through the noob ranks.
I've suggested this to Pixonic numerous times, and would like others to do the same. It's an easy change that would mostly take care of a huge problem.
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Post by Firebeard on Jul 7, 2017 8:47:52 GMT -5
Oh yeah, and just one more thing -- FIX WHATEVER IT IS THAT HAS ME, (once again knocked down to SILVER LEAGUE), MATCHED UP AGAINST GOLD AND DIAMOND LEAGUERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Yeah, I don't know what the deal is with Silver League. We're the Middle Class that has to pay for everything, with our @$$'s ..
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Post by Danny Linguini on Jul 7, 2017 9:09:37 GMT -5
Oh yeah, and just one more thing -- FIX WHATEVER IT IS THAT HAS ME, (once again knocked down to SILVER LEAGUE), MATCHED UP AGAINST GOLD AND DIAMOND LEAGUERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Yeah, I don't know what the deal is with Silver League. We're the Middle Class that has to pay for everything, with our @$$'s .. It's particularly egregious today. The frustration level is absurdly high, especially when I look at the levels of the players who've been shredding me all morning. It's ridiculous. I'm gonna just (TRY to) knock off my daily tasks (one of which is to win 8 games, hahahahahaha!!!), then put the godforsaken thing away before I either delete the game altogether or do something to my iPad that I know I'll regret before I'm done doing it. Oh, and win percentage dropped from 64% early this week to 36% right now. Same player, same bots, same weapons, so how in the known or virtual universe does that make sense?
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Post by ⓣⓡⓘⓒⓚⓨ48 on Jul 7, 2017 9:13:22 GMT -5
A few of the buffs you mentioned, carnage , are already happening. Shield multiplier in particular. Now, and this is just debating, I hope you know, but my opinion on this is: No more NERFS. Gary doesn't need anything taken away. Not a single thing. It is already an endangered species. We will need his shield and speed when Dashes get here for those that will run the Mk 1 and carry plasma... but it is already dead if ANY of the Dashes, except maybe the Mk 3, are carrying Orks. The Dash maneuver will negate Gary's ability to back away from rockets, if that hasn't already been done (some players say yes, some no), by being able to get in close enough to keep it from being an option. Backpedaling requires at least 200m separation, if not more. Also, FFS, no... the Tulus and Pins do not need to have their range shortened. They are THE Ag weapon system that can compete with Au and WSP, up top. Yes, they are overused right now in lower leagues. But I can guarantee that with a little bit of practice and refinement of skillsets, they can be over-come by any pilot. Everything would be seen as OP if that was all that a team was using. (pick any of the scourges of the past 1 1/2 years, the problem is always "their whole team was just 4 or 5 hangars of insert mega-awesome-bot-build here, we just couldn't win... my insert non-competitive setup here had no chance!" Almost all the "meta" setups seem OP when they are the only thing being fielded in a match. When they are part of a healthily diverse match, the stats that they hold don't seem so crazy. I think most of the problem is that more people are using them due to how fresh the change is. Either way, they are a staple to many people's hangar and HAVE BEEN for years now. An RDB has always been a good bot build. They only way it holds its place is by staying usable at 500m.
Lastly, I agree with the sentiment that Danny Linguini brought up that hangar disparity, especially in Android Silver, but in Android Gold too, to an extent, has a larger impact. There should be a weapon level cap somewhere in Silver, at least. Right now, Silver is a mix of so many levels it is insane. There are many MM reasons for this, and that is best said in another thread. The point is, that 500m splash from a 12/12 RDB when you are in a 6/7 is surely going to feel OP. Even Zenits would be OP with that sort of level disparity. If you are in Expert or Diamond league, and are still in 8/9 bots, you have to be able to adjust, and should be able to by this point, so that you can still play with the tankers and slow risers with HIGH weapon levels. Case in point: "rocket buff" made me change my 8.5/9 hangar. I switched out my RDB for a Tulu Doc, and sometimes it is, in turn, switched with my Fuji. I also put my Ancilot back in and took my Gary out (no nerf needed there, it was already kneecapped with 2.9.) Also, at least 1 Carny is always in my hangar again. 1 Ancile shield, at least, is deffo a good counter to the RDB menace... but so are MR weapons and LR weapons. Hell, the all Ag Molot Griff, (something else I have ran recently and had great success with at both level 8 weapons and even better at 9) once leveled up to 8, at least, is a fantastic 10/11 - ish RDB deterrent. IMHO, a weapon/bot is balanced if you can counter it multiple ways, especially with not all those ways being "premium" in cost. Anyway, as always - IMO, YMMV
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Post by Firebeard on Jul 7, 2017 9:40:24 GMT -5
Yeah, I don't know what the deal is with Silver League. We're the Middle Class that has to pay for everything, with our @$$'s .. It's particularly egregious today. The frustration level is absurdly high, especially when I look at the levels of the players who've been shredding me all morning. It's ridiculous. I'm gonna just (TRY to) knock off my daily tasks (one of which is to win 8 games, hahahahahaha!!!), then put the godforsaken thing away before I either delete the game altogether or do something to my iPad that I know I'll regret before I'm done doing it. Oh, and win percentage dropped from 64% early this week to 36% right now. Same player, same bots, same weapons, so how in the known or virtual universe does that make sense? Yeah, take break, Bro .. I'm only on the Natasha Task but I don't care what anyone says; the Dailies make things harder .. when Winning 8 battles is an achievement worthy of Gold, you know something is wrong lol
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Post by ⓣⓡⓘⓒⓚⓨ48 on Jul 7, 2017 9:59:33 GMT -5
Ya know, they had a lot of weapon (maybe bot too... not sure) re-balances on the last Test Server... they did not list what they were, but I would not be surprised if it was enough to completely change the basis for which this post was made from. On that note, anyone know exactly what those balance changes were? How did it feel? Was there a noticeable difference or better, closer Matches? .. Well, Test Server is always going to be hard to get a feel for things when it compares to Live Server. Very few people take it seriously as they are "testing". Also, I didn't get to play on the one that had those changes... this past weekend. BTW, the new one for this weekend will have the shield multiplier... Punishers, Molots, and Tempests will be all over the place, and I expect a little more Nash and KD Fury/Butch/Natty/Leo action, as well.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 7, 2017 10:41:54 GMT -5
How about:
Nerf Leo, Griffin, Natasha and Lance max speeds by 5 kmph. This brings Relevance to the Fury's advantages over the Natasha, The Rhino's advantages over Griffin, and Raijin's stats vs Firepower while accounting for Lance and Griffin having mobility skills,and Butch's price point over every other bot currently in game.
Increase Fujin and Patton speed to 42kmph, Increase Boa, Golem, and Vityaz to 45 kmph. This eccentuates the maneuverability of bots that do not have an ability(and addresses Fujin's need to be stationary for it's shield), and that stated mobility does not clash with the unique ability/firepower mechanics of the other premium Mediums
Destrier/Shutze max speed to 65kmph, Geppard/Cossack to 66kmph, Stalker to 70kmph, no change to Gareth.
Light bots have very low firepower, they should have the ability to pull away from confrontation and position themselves on the battlefield as well as the user allows. Currently they do not have this ability, as heavy bots have little difficulty keeping them in <500M range, with weapons that can shred them in seconds.
Pix is GLOATING about moving away from weight classes and how they function. That is why the game is falling to ?poo-poo?, they're moving away from almost every fundamental concept the game had. The purpose of having obvious tradeoffs like speed for firepower is that each bot performs in a way to counteract the other. When speed differences are negligible in contrast to other areas of performance, one type of bot dominates the game.
In consideration of dash bots, Mk2 shouldn't have an energy shield, and MK3 shouldn't have Lance's HP
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Post by fatdogmagic on Jul 7, 2017 11:03:04 GMT -5
How did it feel? Was there a noticeable difference or better, closer Matches? .. Well, Test Server is always going to be hard to get a feel for things when it compares to Live Server. Very few people take it seriously as they are "testing". Also, I didn't get to play on the one that had those changes... this past weekend. BTW, the new one for this weekend will have the shield multiplier... Punishers, Molots, and Tempests will be all over the place, and I expect a little more Nash and KD Fury/Butch/Natty/Leo action, as well. I must have missed it. What's the shield multiplier?
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Post by ⓣⓡⓘⓒⓚⓨ48 on Jul 7, 2017 11:05:35 GMT -5
Well, Test Server is always going to be hard to get a feel for things when it compares to Live Server. Very few people take it seriously as they are "testing". Also, I didn't get to play on the one that had those changes... this past weekend. BTW, the new one for this weekend will have the shield multiplier... Punishers, Molots, and Tempests will be all over the place, and I expect a little more Nash and KD Fury/Butch/Natty/Leo action, as well. I must have missed it. What's the shield multiplier? Ballistic weapons... i.e., Punishers, Molots, Nashorn, etc., will do 2x damage to shields. Energy and Physical as I understand it...
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Post by ⓣⓡⓘⓒⓚⓨ48 on Jul 7, 2017 11:06:33 GMT -5
How about: Nerf heavy bot max speeds by 5 kmph, except Fury, Butch, Raijin and Rhino. Increase Fujin and Patton speed to 42kmph, Increase Boa, Golem, and Vityaz to 45 kmph. No change to Carnage/Rog. Destrier/Shutze max speed to 65kmph, Geppard/Cossack to 66kmph, Stalker to 70kmph, no change to Gareth. Pix is GLOATING about moving away from weight classes and how they function. That is why the game is falling to ?poo-poo?, they're moving away from almost every fundamental concept the game had. Will have to mull that over, but I think I see where you are coming from...
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Post by Deleted on Jul 7, 2017 11:10:54 GMT -5
How about: Nerf Leo, Griffin, Natasha and Lance max speeds by 5 kmph. This brings Relevance to the Fury's advantages over the Natasha, The Rhino's advantages over Griffin, and Raijin's stats vs Firepower while accounting for Lance and Griffin having mobility skills,and Butch's price point over every other bot currently in game. Increase Fujin and Patton speed to 42kmph, Increase Boa, Golem, and Vityaz to 45 kmph. This eccentuates the maneuverability of bots that do not have an ability(and addresses Fujin's need to be stationary for it's shield), and that stated mobility does not clash with the unique ability/firepower mechanics of the other premium Mediums Destrier/Shutze max speed to 65kmph, Geppard/Cossack to 66kmph, Stalker to 70kmph, no change to Gareth. Light bots have very low firepower, they should have the ability to pull away from confrontation and position themselves on the battlefield as well as the user allows. Currently they do not have this ability, as heavy bots have little difficulty keeping them in <500M range, with weapons that can shred them in seconds. Pix is GLOATING about moving away from weight classes and how they function. That is why the game is falling to ?poo-poo?, they're moving away from almost every fundamental concept the game had. The purpose of having obvious tradeoffs like speed for firepower is that each bot performs in a way to counteract the other. When speed differences are negligible in contrast to other areas of performance, one type of bot dominates the game. In consideration of dash bots, Mk2 shouldn't have an energy shield, and MK3 shouldn't have Lance's HP Will have to mull that over, but I think I see where you are coming from... Changed the post for clarity.
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Post by mijapi300 on Jul 7, 2017 11:14:45 GMT -5
I think there are two big problems in regards to balance in this game. This is probably not popular opinion, but it is what I feel accurately describes the current state of the game.
1) Pilot skill. Too many pilots have only two reactions when they see a strong build after an update: They either use that build themselves, or they complain about it and want it to be nerfed. Not many people are willing to take the time to learn how to counter a new change and get good at that counter. As far as RDB are concerned, there are counters currently available. Two that come to mind are Zeus Carnage and Tulu Fujin. If piloted well, a RDB pretty much can't touch either one.
2) This problem amplifies the first one. The matchmaker. I won't go into too much depth because it's been beaten to death already. But 12/12 hangars shouldn't ever be facing 7/7 hangars, or anything of the sorts. I get the widened matchmaker to find matches quicker, but it's gotten out of hand. I agree with one of the comments about weapon level caps in certain leagues. Like nothing over 9/9 should be able to play in a Silver match, 10/10 for Gold, 11/11 for Diamond, and Expert and above can be maxed. The wide gap in hangar strength and player skill levels that are seen in individual games now is too much. It causes people to think certain things are overpowered, when in reality, the pilot you were facing was just that much better than you, or had such higher levels it killed you quick. The pilots themselves are the focal point of the balance "problem", but the matchmaker amplifies that aspect greatly.
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Post by fatdogmagic on Jul 7, 2017 11:17:36 GMT -5
I must have missed it. What's the shield multiplier? Ballistic weapons... i.e., Punishers, Molots, Nashorn, etc., will do 2x damage to shields. Energy and Physical as I understand it... Thanks
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Post by carnage on Jul 7, 2017 12:32:10 GMT -5
I think there are two big problems in regards to balance in this game. This is probably not popular opinion, but it is what I feel accurately describes the current state of the game. 1) Pilot skill. Too many pilots have only two reactions when they see a strong build after an update: They either use that build themselves, or they complain about it and want it to be nerfed. Not many people are willing to take the time to learn how to counter a new change and get good at that counter. As far as RDB are concerned, there are counters currently available. Two that come to mind are Zeus Carnage and Tulu Fujin. If piloted well, a RDB pretty much can't touch either one. I wish we would be able to discuss the game without this kind of assumption, though. Just because somebody suggests something doesn't mean there is necessarily a problem of skill, it could be also, you know, that he noticed something relevant and want to discuss it. And when I notice that half of the robots around me are RDB Griffins, I think it is a legit topic of discussion without somebody to imply that the problem is related to my skills. Besides, I'm doing fine, because I would certainly not be in Diamond with a level 8 hangar when most of hangars around me are much better than mine. Just I noticed that the vast majority of setups are RDB Griffins currently, and that take out some of my fun. Nothing less, nothing more.
It is not a skill problem when you see an abundance of some robots while some others are barely used. It is a balancing problem, which becomes a diversity problem. It's not like I am suggesting drastic changes to the game, only a few tweeks that I think are well thought (and several people agreed) in order to bring back every robot and weapon in relevance. I want to face Gepard or Raijin, not just Griffins. I want to see very various weapons, not a massive amount of Tulumbas and a bit of some others. In one word, I want to see diversity. It may not be the case for you, and that's fine, but the diversity of the game is certainly something which is important for me. In the end I absolutely don't care if I win or loss, I care about the fun I take from the game, and facing constantly the same setups again and again certainly take some fun out of it.
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Post by Danny Linguini on Jul 7, 2017 12:39:55 GMT -5
I think there are two big problems in regards to balance in this game. This is probably not popular opinion, but it is what I feel accurately describes the current state of the game. 1) Pilot skill. Too many pilots have only two reactions when they see a strong build after an update: They either use that build themselves, or they complain about it and want it to be nerfed. Not many people are willing to take the time to learn how to counter a new change and get good at that counter. As far as RDB are concerned, there are counters currently available. Two that come to mind are Zeus Carnage and Tulu Fujin. If piloted well, a RDB pretty much can't touch either one. 2) This problem amplifies the first one. The matchmaker. I won't go into too much depth because it's been beaten to death already. But 12/12 hangars shouldn't ever be facing 7/7 hangars, or anything of the sorts. I get the widened matchmaker to find matches quicker, but it's gotten out of hand. I agree with one of the comments about weapon level caps in certain leagues. Like nothing over 9/9 should be able to play in a Silver match, 10/10 for Gold, 11/11 for Diamond, and Expert and above can be maxed. The wide gap in hangar strength and player skill levels that are seen in individual games now is too much. It causes people to think certain things are overpowered, when in reality, the pilot you were facing was just that much better than you, or had such higher levels it killed you quick. The pilots themselves are the focal point of the balance "problem", but the matchmaker amplifies that aspect greatly. Hear, hear. I've been getting destroyed pretty regularly these last few days, either by tankers who have dropped themselves into leagues way below where they should be, and/or by the MM sticking me with and against players way above my skill and equipment levels. I'm really about ready to hang it up on this game. It was a lot of fun for awhile, but now it's just a major cause of frustration. I play games to relax, not to want to smash my head through my iPad. Maybe I'll just delete it and start over until I reach level 20, then rinse and repeat.
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inspirace
Trusted Contributor
Posts: 2,670
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Pilot name: inspirace
Platform: iOS
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League: Champion
Server Region: North America
Favorite robot: Rog, Griff, Carn, Doc, Rhino, Haechi, Kumiho, Bulgasari, Mender, Inquisitor, Spectre, Strider,
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Post by inspirace on Jul 7, 2017 12:43:45 GMT -5
I wrote this sometime ago, but I would like to see all bots speed buffed by 10%.
(1) this will quicken up the pace of the game and reduce the frustration of walking heavy bots to anywhere relevant (simpler solution than "beacon capture mode"?). right now, slower bots are too sluggish especially when not leveled up, while fater bots are not too fast to make them hard to control, so there is a room to buff their speeds,
(2) and by buffing by percentage, the gap between heavy and light bots will increase, this may help the survival of lighter bots in higher/meta leagues.
what do you think?
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Post by mijapi300 on Jul 7, 2017 12:48:03 GMT -5
The same could be said about you carnage - I wish we could have discussions without people taking a differing opinion as a personal attack. And I made no assumptions, I stated my opinion about the status of the game. Part of the player skill aspect swings the other way too. There is an abundance of RDBs in the current game because they are easy to use. You can stay out of range of half the weapons on the field while be able to take pot shots. That doesn't mean everyone that fields one is actually going to be good at it, it just means that lots of people will use them because it's a staple that's easy to pilot. And it's also readily available to every player in the game. More damage can be done with a Tulu Fujin, but they require a lot more skill to use to that level. I don't like, and more than likely never will like, massive adjustments for balance. While you consider your changes small, any time you attempt to rebalance ten differently things at once, it's going to have immense unexpected results. It's nearly impossible to have a game like this be perfectly balanced across the board - one because there are so many options of builds that one can use, and two because skill plays such a major role in how effective you can be with anything you use. The low-skill threshold bots have always been chastised as overpowered. But they aren't. They're just easy to use, so they become common. Sure, some weak weapons and bots could use minor buffs to become relevant. But this game as a whole is incredibly well balanced. There is not a single setup in the entire game that is overpowered. Everything has a counter in this game. Effective counters, at that. Part of the issue there is, people want their counter to also be effective against everything else. If you want a bot that is built specifically to counter Ancilots, it likely will be weak against something else. You want a counter against RDBs, it'll likely have a weakness because everything has a counter. Think rock-paper-scissors. Every rock has its paper and also its scissors. I'm all for slowly rebalancing things to either mix up the meta or just bring things up to speed as needed. But massive rebalancing is not needed, and would likely leave us with a ruined game.
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