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Post by icyfire on Jan 15, 2020 7:54:45 GMT -5
Just like it say on the tin, do we need a specific leech counter?
Let's face it, the SB and Quantum Radar were mainly introduced to "balance the game" for other bots against the ARES and AO JUN
Shield Breaker for Pantheon Bots Retribution ability (and every other energy Shielded Bot) Quantum Radar for Stealth Ao Jun (and other stealth bots)
and now we have Repulse on the Leech. As with all meta, it does seem OP, especially when matched with other modules like Last Stand and Phase Shift. In which PS was supposed to be like a semi counter for every other minor ability (Lockdown, Freezing) and damage.
Do we need one or should we just trust Pix to do a proper Nerf?
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Post by Eradicator1 on Jan 15, 2020 8:01:01 GMT -5
No. Just change it to not go through walls. Why should I be killed when playing correctly if my teammates shoot it.
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Post by Koalabear on Jan 15, 2020 8:02:34 GMT -5
Well, corrosion weapons counter DR (not very well, but they do). I just don't know if corrosion damage gets Repulsed or not. Titans with their Damage Mitigation also counters DR, but they also add to the super tank problem. Personally, I think someone at Pix had an epiphany. They used to "balance" things when new content came out - much like how they "balanced the dash bots into oblivion and the Spectre as well. But, with the Ares and Ao Jun, they finally figured out their best strategy: sell the nerf! SB to counter Ares and Quantum Radar to counter Ao Jun. They kinda already sold the Repulse counter, otherwise known as Phase Shift. But, I'm willing to bet that in a few months, they will come out with a "new" weapon or add on that will properly nerf the Leech, and it will make you open your wallet or spend PCs like crazy.
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Post by blackheart on Jan 15, 2020 9:17:37 GMT -5
well there is phaseshift
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Post by shad3z on Jan 15, 2020 9:20:29 GMT -5
The don't need to counter it, they need to fix it...
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Post by T34 on Jan 15, 2020 16:32:17 GMT -5
Just like it say on the tin, do we need a specific leech counter? Nerfed by the titans once and now introducing Ravana. The rest is power-creep.
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Post by Eradicator1 on Jan 15, 2020 16:49:20 GMT -5
Just like it say on the tin, do we need a specific leech counter? Nerfed by the titans once and now introducing Ravana. The rest is power-creep. The nerf by the titans came quickish for the leech. Unlike the ares and jun. Ravana looks cool. Time will tell though.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2020 16:55:57 GMT -5
dot weapons
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Post by Deadeye on Jan 15, 2020 17:04:26 GMT -5
A direct counter to Repulse is Suppression. It cuts repulse damage by the same amount as it does the Leech's primary weapons. That's why the Rayker/Blitz/Invaders are so useful, especially the Rayker because of how often it can suppress bots. The problem though is that it only last 5 seconds followed by 5 seconds of invulnerability from being suppressed. Leeches can still do quite a bit of damage during that 5 seconds.
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Post by Garbage game on Jan 15, 2020 17:32:03 GMT -5
A direct counter to Repulse is Suppression. It cuts repulse damage by the same amount as it does the Leech's primary weapons. That's why the Rayker/Blitz/Invaders are so useful, especially the Rayker because of how often it can suppress bots. The problem though is that it only last 5 seconds followed by 5 seconds of invulnerability from being suppressed. Leeches can still do quite a bit of damage during that 5 seconds. Is that actually true? I know some people researched it and the results were inconclusive. Ⓑⓞⓑ Ⓓⓨⓛⓐⓝ ?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2020 18:02:28 GMT -5
repulse is very weak, and does NO DAMAGE if ya don't fire. simple, already has a counter that doesn't require crack or any special wep.
the problem is that the bot, the leech, it has 4 medium weps and mostly Storms and Coronas that need a counter. That's the question, or more how to counter the leech. It has DR and 4x medium. Repulse is not really a problem.
The repulse is very weak. So many threads on how to counter that. Use a low DPS wep like Viper so less dmg gets reflected back to you. Use healing, mechanic, TYr or Weyland. And blast away at the leech, i dun fear the repulse. Like i said, it's more the 4 Shotties, but i don't let it get close.
Now back to my question, how to counter Leech. All the titans are counters, and everybody gets one. You gets one. You gets one too. It's not enough, but that is at least 1 counter in all champ hangers. My Hover is my counter too, always catch them easy. Not many can or want to think in third dimension. Look at the poll, and you can see why.
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Post by Wife is Pissed on Jan 15, 2020 18:11:23 GMT -5
Wasn't there some talk about a damage resistance negation module in the works?
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Post by aaronc on Jan 15, 2020 18:18:05 GMT -5
Not a direct counter to the repulse per se but Leeches dont seem to like the Titans Vengeance Alpha weapon with its high Defence mitigation
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Post by Wife is Pissed on Jan 15, 2020 18:20:53 GMT -5
Wasn't there some talk about a damage resistance negation module in the works? I just found the thread and bumped it back up to the top. It would be called the Mitigator module, but I can't tell if the original poster actually had heard something from Pix or if he made it up.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2020 18:25:31 GMT -5
The counter is dying. This counter works more efficiently if you are also locked down and don't have Last Stand.
Titans seem like a good bet. I just shoot Leeches now in my Titan, whether they are tethered or not (sorry blue, that thing has to die). I'll bet that the next batch of weapons have good corrosion or something similar.
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aceng
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Post by aceng on Jan 15, 2020 19:04:34 GMT -5
Yup, Titans are the counter to every bots that rely on DR.
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Post by T34 on Jan 15, 2020 19:07:42 GMT -5
Nerfed by the titans once and now introducing Ravana. The rest is power-creep. The nerf by the titans came quickish for the leech. Unlike the ares and jun. Ravana looks cool. Time will tell though. It was insanely quick. Maybe thats why so many were given away. Perhaps the new way forward for Pix is to churn over the meta every 4 ish months while selling bots at a reduced price. They can also alternate between the regular bots and titans. Twice as much upgrading is required. Good luck keeping up with the silver needs. Alternatively Pix just threw in a wild card with the leech to see how players react and now back to business. If ravana turns out to be the next top bot and whales buy em on mass (which i think they would) then it would be a safe bet to say that bots will be turned over in 4 or 5 months going forward. It will be interested to see what happens next.
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Post by Ⓑⓞⓑ Ⓓⓨⓛⓐⓝ on Jan 15, 2020 19:53:36 GMT -5
A direct counter to Repulse is Suppression. It cuts repulse damage by the same amount as it does the Leech's primary weapons. That's why the Rayker/Blitz/Invaders are so useful, especially the Rayker because of how often it can suppress bots. The problem though is that it only last 5 seconds followed by 5 seconds of invulnerability from being suppressed. Leeches can still do quite a bit of damage during that 5 seconds. Is that actually true? I know some people researched it and the results were inconclusive. Ⓑⓞⓑ Ⓓⓨⓛⓐⓝ ? Initially suppression also suppressed repulse, now it does not. Suppression is still a terrific leech counter when played right.
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Post by josh378 on Jan 15, 2020 20:18:56 GMT -5
If I'm in Fenrir and I'm in the open with nowhere to go, I tank the Leech and laugh for 9 seconds as they realize they can't kill me at all. After 9 seconds they start scurry like roaches when you turn the light on.
Man I love max defence Fenrir!
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Post by Garbage game on Jan 15, 2020 20:59:51 GMT -5
Is that actually true? I know some people researched it and the results were inconclusive. Ⓑⓞⓑ Ⓓⓨⓛⓐⓝ ? Initially suppression also suppressed repulse, now it does not. Suppression is still a terrific leech counter when played right. That’s too bad. Repulse with Rayker, Phase shift then Repulse? Locks them up for the duration of their ability. But the PCs cost...
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2020 21:27:27 GMT -5
Though it's not released, Nightingale seemed able to suppress people from the air. Vipers, Ao Jun fire and to a lesser extent Wasp (and Sting) can bring down repulsing Leeches. As can a lot of concentrated fire, at the possible cost of an allied bot. Also, Phase Shifting (and Last Standing) while a Repulsing is killing you are two ways to survive it. If I'm in Fenrir and I'm in the open with nowhere to go, I tank the Leech and laugh for 9 seconds as they realize they can't kill me at all. After 9 seconds they start scurry like roaches when you turn the light on. Man I love max defence Fenrir! Yeah! Can even start chewing into them while they're repulsing. Wouldn't mind a high level Viper/Wasp for my Fenrir atm.
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Post by icyfire on Jan 15, 2020 23:11:07 GMT -5
No. Just change it to not go through walls. Why should I be killed when playing correctly if my teammates shoot it. And, correct the targeting of the ability to disengage if you go beyond the Leech ability range.
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Post by icyfire on Jan 15, 2020 23:21:43 GMT -5
Well, corrosion weapons counter DR (not very well, but they do). I just don't know if corrosion damage gets Repulsed or not. Titans with their Damage Mitigation also counters DR, but they also add to the super tank problem. Personally, I think someone at Pix had an epiphany. They used to "balance" things when new content came out - much like how they "balanced the dash bots into oblivion and the Spectre as well. But, with the Ares and Ao Jun, they finally figured out their best strategy: sell the nerf! SB to counter Ares and Quantum Radar to counter Ao Jun. They kinda already sold the Repulse counter, otherwise known as Phase Shift. But, I'm willing to bet that in a few months, they will come out with a "new" weapon or add on that will properly nerf the Leech, and it will make you open your wallet or spend PCs like crazy. They all do work as a "counter" but i'm thinking of a module that for x seconds will put DR mitigation to your shots. this will actually affect not just the Leech but also other DR bots like the Falcon, Ao Guang, Mender, Fenrir and even titans like the Ao Ming. IMO, the Leech is misnamed. they should have called it Boomerang since it returns damage. A leech ability should remove x amount of health from the target and add it to it's own....
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Post by icyfire on Jan 15, 2020 23:31:51 GMT -5
repulse is very weak, and does NO DAMAGE if ya don't fire. simple, already has a counter that doesn't require crack or any special wep. the problem is that the bot, the leech, it has 4 medium weps and mostly Storms and Coronas that need a counter. That's the question, or more how to counter the leech. It has DR and 4x medium. Repulse is not really a problem. The repulse is very weak. So many threads on how to counter that. Use a low DPS wep like Viper so less dmg gets reflected back to you. Use healing, mechanic, TYr or Weyland. And blast away at the leech, i dun fear the repulse. Like i said, it's more the 4 Shotties, but i don't let it get close. Now back to my question, how to counter Leech. All the titans are counters, and everybody gets one. You gets one. You gets one too. It's not enough, but that is at least 1 counter in all champ hangers. My Hover is my counter too, always catch them easy. Not many can or want to think in third dimension. Look at the poll, and you can see why. I don't have a Hover and you're right about the 3rd dimension in combat. But, i do use my Ao Guang as a Leech counter. I attract their attention and have them Leech on me, activate ability and we both have DR. just a matter whose ability runs out first. (i wish for better Medium corrosion weapons though)
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Post by icyfire on Jan 15, 2020 23:39:52 GMT -5
Is that actually true? I know some people researched it and the results were inconclusive. Ⓑⓞⓑ Ⓓⓨⓛⓐⓝ ? Initially suppression also suppressed repulse, now it does not. Suppression is still a terrific leech counter when played right. That's very interesting. Does this mean that even the Cerberus will be able to go the distance. I always seem to like the "weakest" of new bots released. (Except the Norse group, i like them all)
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Post by milty72 on Jan 16, 2020 0:29:09 GMT -5
But if they also have phase shift.
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Post by milty72 on Jan 16, 2020 0:30:23 GMT -5
Arthur works well.
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Post by ahxish on Jan 16, 2020 0:34:12 GMT -5
Phaseshift counters everything! Double tab phaseshift rox!
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Post by icyfire on Jan 16, 2020 3:58:54 GMT -5
Phaseshift counters everything! Double tab phaseshift rox! it's very expensive though.
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Post by ahxish on Jan 16, 2020 4:11:59 GMT -5
Phaseshift counters everything! Double tab phaseshift rox! it's very expensive though. i still have 300k pcs... not showing off... in fact it is a reflection of pixo scam. Hahahahaha
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