inspirace
Trusted Contributor
Posts: 2,670
Karma: 2,959
Pilot name: inspirace
Platform: iOS
Clan: NEW
League: Champion
Server Region: North America
Favorite robot: Rog, Griff, Carn, Doc, Rhino, Haechi, Kumiho, Bulgasari, Mender, Inquisitor, Spectre, Strider,
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Post by inspirace on Aug 10, 2019 1:16:37 GMT -5
I hate Last Stand,
I hate Last Stand on an Ares,
I hate Last Stand on an Ares, with lock-down weapons,
I hate Last Stand on an Ares, with lock-down weapons, hands-in-hands with copies of themselves,
I hate Last Stand on an Ao Jun, which lands casually in front of my Strider and still get the beacon (only because of Last Stand),
People say "it's game mechanic, you should get one, too," but are you joking? It's 「fluffernutter」ing 5k Au,
Sure, I can wait and shoot, I can kill it twice, I can use my "skills" to win over them,
But sometimes I just wonder, why should I? It's not even fun. It's boring if I describe what I feel.
This is not playing games anymore,
It's more like work, I punch my time-card, lose daily numbers of battles to those numerous 5k-Au absolute advantages, and feel like sh*t,
Rant over, out,
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Post by TheDecepticonIdeal on Aug 10, 2019 3:57:02 GMT -5
Yeahhh, it can be a pain to deal with.
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Post by hyderier on Aug 10, 2019 3:59:53 GMT -5
You have a multitude of options:
Uninstall.
Start over.
Get one for your current account.
Just deal with it (which is what kinda say you don't enjoy, using word "hate", in your post).
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Post by Garbage game on Aug 10, 2019 11:52:22 GMT -5
Can't wait for the 10k Au Advanced Last Stan next year
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Post by Method Games[YT] on Aug 13, 2019 2:38:13 GMT -5
Sure, I can wait and shoot, I can kill it twice, I can use my "skills" to win over them, But sometimes I just wonder, why should I? It's not even fun. It's boring if I describe what I feel. The thing is you can't wait because those 2 bots are insanely powerful and with last stand will often kill 2-3 of my bots before I can kill one of them. I don't know what they could do to tone down this module, maybe it should not allow you to fire your weapons whilst it's active?
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Post by S1E1 on Aug 13, 2019 3:46:48 GMT -5
The one thing in the next update I am truly excited for is that the beacon bar will show who has Last Stand beforehand and when it'll activate. Not sure if it will fix everything, but it should make a big difference.
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inspirace
Trusted Contributor
Posts: 2,670
Karma: 2,959
Pilot name: inspirace
Platform: iOS
Clan: NEW
League: Champion
Server Region: North America
Favorite robot: Rog, Griff, Carn, Doc, Rhino, Haechi, Kumiho, Bulgasari, Mender, Inquisitor, Spectre, Strider,
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Post by inspirace on Aug 13, 2019 14:07:52 GMT -5
The one thing in the next update I am truly excited for is that the beacon bar will show who has Last Stand beforehand and when it'll activate. Not sure if it will fix everything, but it should make a big difference. Anyone who has a screenshot how this will work? On the contrary, it may l show more of who DOES NOT have Last Stand and give a flag "this target is safe to shoot." It could be used to single out those poor and weak, if the HP bar is showing whether a bot has a Last Stand or not. Like some of more 「slow」 school systems where the teacher asks whose family is richer or poorer in front of all classmates. What I was hoping for was, once the Last Stand is activated, show how many seconds left. Whether someone has Last Stand or not should be kept unknown, like Quantum Radar and other active modules, until the module is activated. ... The better solution is to replace Last Stand with something like 50% damage resistance. Absolute invulnerability is ridiculous and broken. I can take many other non-senses but this one is hard to take,
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Post by S1E1 on Aug 13, 2019 16:09:22 GMT -5
The one thing in the next update I am truly excited for is that the beacon bar will show who has Last Stand beforehand and when it'll activate. Not sure if it will fix everything, but it should make a big difference. Anyone who has a screenshot how this will work? On the contrary, it may l show more of who DOES NOT have Last Stand and give a flag "this target is safe to shoot." It could be used to single out those poor and weak, if the HP bar is showing whether a bot has a Last Stand or not. Like some of more ?slow? school systems where the teacher asks whose family is richer or poorer in front of all classmates. What I was hoping for was, once the Last Stand is activated, show how many seconds left. Whether someone has Last Stand or not should be kept unknown, like Quantum Radar and other active modules, until the module is activated. ... The better solution is to replace Last Stand with something like 50% damage resistance. Absolute invulnerability is ridiculous and broken. I can take many other non-senses but this one is hard to take, This screenshot is from an old test server video. Presumably it will look the same once it hits the live server. It doesn't show how long Last Stand will last but you can get a sense of that from how high the HP for the activation threshold is. Couldn't disagree more on keeping Last Stand hidden. Much of what makes it such a problem now is that you don't know someone has it until after you've fully committed to going in for the kill. Then you can't retreat in time, especially if they have lockdown weapons. Once you can see who has it, you can just plan your attack around it, same as with the ability of Greek bots or stealth bots, etc. Even maxed it lasts barely longer than a Nemesis shield and it can only be used one time, so it's actually not that big a problem, as long as it isn't a total surprise. It's not that I am defending invincibility here, it's just that the game is already chock full of it. I actually think it's likely that this will result in players who have Last Stand being targeted MORE, just like Ares and Ao Juns now get prioritized as targets. Players will want to activate the enemy Last Stand while there is still some distance between them, so they don't have to deal with the invincibility up close. And one big problem with team matches is it's often hard to tell who the top players in a match are. The guys who have to be focused on with a group effort or they'll just rampage through your team. Clan tags can sometimes help, and some names you learn to recognize (if you play enough), but a lot of times it is a guessing game, especially on the Asia server or the like. Seeing who has maxed Last Stand just by scanning the enemy health bars will help people figure out how to deploy. One thing in fact that I think (not sure) is missing is that you can't tell who on your team has it. Also, you can't tell if a Loki has it if they always stay in stealth, which is totally bogus. Don't agree either that modules (passive or active) should be hidden. We have this barely useful HUD display now in the upper-right corner. Would be great if it gave a readout of all the modules and skills equipped to a bot, not just what's active. Maybe even armor and weapons levels too. It's pretty absurd that we need to memorize clan and player names to try and figure out who's MK2 maxed, etc.
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Post by integeritis on Aug 13, 2019 16:20:11 GMT -5
The one thing in the next update I am truly excited for is that the beacon bar will show who has Last Stand beforehand and when it'll activate. Not sure if it will fix everything, but it should make a big difference. Anyone who has a screenshot how this will work? On the contrary, it may l show more of who DOES NOT have Last Stand and give a flag "this target is safe to shoot." It could be used to single out those poor and weak, if the HP bar is showing whether a bot has a Last Stand or not. Like some of more ?slow? school systems where the teacher asks whose family is richer or poorer in front of all classmates. What I was hoping for was, once the Last Stand is activated, show how many seconds left. Whether someone has Last Stand or not should be kept unknown, like Quantum Radar and other active modules, until the module is activated. ... The better solution is to replace Last Stand with something like 50% damage resistance. Absolute invulnerability is ridiculous and broken. I can take many other non-senses but this one is hard to take,
Can't beat last stand 1 on 1, I am okay with that. 6 man shooting a single bot and it does not go down, now that's BS.
I think the same about purple shield. Should it survive a single Orkan Spectre blow? Sure, why not. Unlimited damage? Why? That's BS.
Not making the shield unlimited could open another balancing window by tuning the health of the bubble shield. The fact that it is unlimited from lvl 1 to lvl 12 mk2 just makes the Ares problem even worse.
I don't care if the few thousand whales of the game have an advantage. I hate that every scrub is running around with them and the only difference they have compared to whales is that the ejaculation deals less damage. This is wrong about Hades too which I run. I could run it from lvl 1 and still do well, because 1/3 of the time I can not be touched no matter what you throw at me (with a very niche list of possible counters).
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inspirace
Trusted Contributor
Posts: 2,670
Karma: 2,959
Pilot name: inspirace
Platform: iOS
Clan: NEW
League: Champion
Server Region: North America
Favorite robot: Rog, Griff, Carn, Doc, Rhino, Haechi, Kumiho, Bulgasari, Mender, Inquisitor, Spectre, Strider,
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Post by inspirace on Aug 13, 2019 16:20:18 GMT -5
Anyone who has a screenshot how this will work? On the contrary, it may l show more of who DOES NOT have Last Stand and give a flag "this target is safe to shoot." It could be used to single out those poor and weak, if the HP bar is showing whether a bot has a Last Stand or not. Like some of more ?slow? school systems where the teacher asks whose family is richer or poorer in front of all classmates. What I was hoping for was, once the Last Stand is activated, show how many seconds left. Whether someone has Last Stand or not should be kept unknown, like Quantum Radar and other active modules, until the module is activated. ... The better solution is to replace Last Stand with something like 50% damage resistance. Absolute invulnerability is ridiculous and broken. I can take many other non-senses but this one is hard to take, This screenshot is from an old test server video. Presumably it will look the same once it hits the live server. It doesn't show how long Last Stand will last but you can get a sense of that from how high the HP for the activation threshold is. Couldn't disagree more on keeping Last Stand hidden. Much of what makes it such a problem now is that you don't know someone has it until after you've fully committed to going in for the kill. Then you can't retreat in time, especially if they have lockdown weapons. Once you can see who has it, you can just plan your attack around it, same as with the ability of Greek bots or stealth bots, etc. Even maxed it lasts barely longer than a Nemesis shield and it can only be used one time, so it's actually not that big a problem, as long as it isn't a total surprise. It's not that I am defending invincibility here, it's just that the game is already chock full of it. I actually think it's likely that this will result in players who have Last Stand being targeted MORE, just like Ares and Ao Juns now get prioritized as targets. Players will want to activate the enemy Last Stand while there is still some distance between them, so they don't have to deal with the invincibility up close. And one big problem with team matches is it's often hard to tell who the top players in a match are. The guys who have to be focused on with a group effort or they'll just rampage through your team. Clan tags can sometimes help, and some names you learn to recognize (if you play enough), but a lot of times it is a guessing game, especially on the Asia server or the like. Seeing who has maxed Last Stand just by scanning the enemy health bars will help people figure out how to deploy. One thing in fact that I think (not sure) is missing is that you can't tell who on your team has it. Also, you can't tell if a Loki has it if they always stay in stealth, which is totally bogus. Don't agree either that modules (passive or active) should be hidden. We have this barely useful HUD display now in the upper-right corner. Would be great if it gave a readout of all the modules and skills equipped to a bot, not just what's active. Maybe even armor and weapons levels too. It's pretty absurd that we need to memorize clan and player names to try and figure out who's MK2 maxed, etc. I disagree. When you go to war (or war games), you don't write in big letters what your gears are capable of. Those should be kept as the top of the top secrets. Surprise is a part of tactics and showing everything out will wipe many parts of it. It's like playing poker with all hands shown. With modules, skills, and gears shown, the part of guessing/mind game will be gone. E.g., bluffing as if you have (or don't have) Quantum Radar to prevent an Ao Jun from approaching (or lure one to get closer). When everything is shown, all you need to do is just optimization given the information. Imo, that will further reduce fun and skill levels.
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Post by integeritis on Aug 13, 2019 16:25:29 GMT -5
Sure, I can wait and shoot, I can kill it twice, I can use my "skills" to win over them, But sometimes I just wonder, why should I? It's not even fun. It's boring if I describe what I feel. The thing is you can't wait because those 2 bots are insanely powerful and with last stand will often kill 2-3 of my bots before I can kill one of them. I don't know what they could do to tone down this module, maybe it should not allow you to fire your weapons whilst it's active? I told them in my test server feedback that Phase Shift is the Last Stand the game should have received, not Last Stand. It is Last Stand done right. There are many great suggestions about Last Stand, but Pixonic's implementation of Phase Shift is exactly what Last Stand should have been, and we would not question the existence of the module, suggesting alternative balanced mechanics. Currently, last stand is abused as an offensive ability to allow hard pushes, and not a last string you can hang on for a little while till you bleed to death. It is just stupid invincibility again.
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Post by S1E1 on Aug 13, 2019 18:01:47 GMT -5
I disagree. When you go to war (or war games), you don't write in big letters what your gears are capable of. Those should be kept as the top of the top secrets. Surprise is a part of tactics and showing everything out will wipe many parts of it. It's like playing poker with all hands shown. With modules, skills, and gears shown, the part of guessing/mind game will be gone. E.g., bluffing as if you have (or don't have) Quantum Radar to prevent an Ao Jun from approaching (or lure one to get closer). When everything is shown, all you need to do is just optimization given the information. Imo, that will further reduce fun and skill levels. This isn't war though or even poker where anyone has the same chance to draw any card. It's a melee where players can't communicate with each other and can barely coordinate. The best analogy wouldn't even be barbarian warfare but random gladiators who get thrown as a group into the ring. That's really what arena games are - gladiator matches. And then you can't tell who is who. Normally in gladiator example, it's obvious who is the biggest guy with the best armor. But in War Robots, a MK2 12 Invader with maxed Last Stand, Heavy Armor Modules and Advanced Repair Unit equipped, looks just the same as any other Invader. And the guys in those don't care if you're bluffing, they just run you over. They also have an extra advantage because they tend to remember the smaller pool names of the players that can kill their uber-bots. Even if they don't they can plow their way through the field until they figure it out. All of which is demoralizing to players with lower-level gear. I get the part about bluffing you have Quantum Radar, but outside that example, I'm not so sure. IMO hidden power benefits maxed players most of all, and they're the guys who need it the least
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Post by hyderier on Aug 14, 2019 0:06:48 GMT -5
This screenshot is from an old test server video. Presumably it will look the same once it hits the live server. It doesn't show how long Last Stand will last but you can get a sense of that from how high the HP for the activation threshold is. Couldn't disagree more on keeping Last Stand hidden. Much of what makes it such a problem now is that you don't know someone has it until after you've fully committed to going in for the kill. Then you can't retreat in time, especially if they have lockdown weapons. Once you can see who has it, you can just plan your attack around it, same as with the ability of Greek bots or stealth bots, etc. Even maxed it lasts barely longer than a Nemesis shield and it can only be used one time, so it's actually not that big a problem, as long as it isn't a total surprise. It's not that I am defending invincibility here, it's just that the game is already chock full of it. I actually think it's likely that this will result in players who have Last Stand being targeted MORE, just like Ares and Ao Juns now get prioritized as targets. Players will want to activate the enemy Last Stand while there is still some distance between them, so they don't have to deal with the invincibility up close. And one big problem with team matches is it's often hard to tell who the top players in a match are. The guys who have to be focused on with a group effort or they'll just rampage through your team. Clan tags can sometimes help, and some names you learn to recognize (if you play enough), but a lot of times it is a guessing game, especially on the Asia server or the like. Seeing who has maxed Last Stand just by scanning the enemy health bars will help people figure out how to deploy. One thing in fact that I think (not sure) is missing is that you can't tell who on your team has it. Also, you can't tell if a Loki has it if they always stay in stealth, which is totally bogus. Don't agree either that modules (passive or active) should be hidden. We have this barely useful HUD display now in the upper-right corner. Would be great if it gave a readout of all the modules and skills equipped to a bot, not just what's active. Maybe even armor and weapons levels too. It's pretty absurd that we need to memorize clan and player names to try and figure out who's MK2 maxed, etc. I disagree. When you go to war (or war games), you don't write in big letters what your gears are capable of. Those should be kept as the top of the top secrets. Surprise is a part of tactics and showing everything out will wipe many parts of it. It's like playing poker with all hands shown. With modules, skills, and gears shown, the part of guessing/mind game will be gone. E.g., bluffing as if you have (or don't have) Quantum Radar to prevent an Ao Jun from approaching (or lure one to get closer). When everything is shown, all you need to do is just optimization given the information. Imo, that will further reduce fun and skill levels. Strongly disagree. You can't apply tactics without knowledge. The more knowledge you make available, the more you allow skillful play to win over superior gear. And War Robots is full of superior gear... In a balanced, fair, competitive game it would be different, but this is War Robots. The players who benefit from "fog of war" most are those who have upper hand (premium modules etc) anyway and want to hide that. Information is the great equalizer.
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Post by hyderier on Aug 14, 2019 0:10:14 GMT -5
Last Stand would be easy to fix... Instead of avoiding damage, it just postpones damage... Any damage taken during Last Stand is applied once the Last Stand runs out. Or, the damage is applied, but the bot just won't die until Last Stand runs out, simple as that.
Then again, the modules proper name is Last Stan, so I guess it makes sense as it is, even if it can be easily confused with the concept of "last stand".
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Post by hyderier on Aug 14, 2019 0:21:35 GMT -5
Not making the shield unlimited could open another balancing window by tuning the health of the bubble shield. The fact that it is unlimited from lvl 1 to lvl 12 mk2 just makes the Ares problem even worse. I don't care if the few thousand whales of the game have an advantage. I hate that every scrub is running around with them and the only difference they have compared to whales is that the ejaculation deals less damage. This is wrong about Hades too which I run. I could run it from lvl 1 and still do well, because 1/3 of the time I can not be touched no matter what you throw at me (with a very niche list of possible counters).
The only redeeming quality of Ares is, the purple bubble is same for me with L9 Ares, and that whale with Mk2-12 Ares, who has tanked below my league score. Without Ares, the game would probably be unplayable for me again. I have abandoned several accounts when things just became ridiculous... Like my Rogatka against maxed pre-nerf Shocktrain Spectres, the game just wasn't fun. The game needs more elements which are equal regardless of gear level, because the game is designed to put players with very different hangar power against each others! Stealth and purple bubbles, as well as max speed already at L9, are currently the only things that are balanced in the game from F2P perspective (and "covard weapons", ie. guided missiles and LR setups, are too I guess but I don't run those). Even these are slightly unbalanced by pilots and premium modules, but not too badly.
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Post by orionpax on Aug 14, 2019 1:01:41 GMT -5
In my opinion it’s the worst thing added to the game period! And I have been playing since the beginning. ? concept.
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Post by Method Games[YT] on Aug 14, 2019 20:58:49 GMT -5
Can't beat last stand 1 on 1, I am okay with that. 6 man shooting a single bot and it does not go down, now that's BS.
I think the same about purple shield. Should it survive a single Orkan Spectre blow? Sure, why not. Unlimited damage? Why? That's BS.
Not making the shield unlimited could open another balancing window by tuning the health of the bubble shield. The fact that it is unlimited from lvl 1 to lvl 12 mk2 just makes the Ares problem even worse.
I don't care if the few thousand whales of the game have an advantage. I hate that every scrub is running around with them and the only difference they have compared to whales is that the ejaculation deals less damage. This is wrong about Hades too which I run. I could run it from lvl 1 and still do well, because 1/3 of the time I can not be touched no matter what you throw at me (with a very niche list of possible counters).
There are so many players running around now with 2-3 Ares and an Ao-Jun in their hangars. They are averaging 1.2 mill+ damage per game with these bots at level 7,8 or 9...... 1 Ares at around level 8 is better than any other bot at level 12 except for maybe an Invader/Bulwark/Ao Jun.
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Post by hyderier on Aug 14, 2019 21:53:21 GMT -5
There are so many players running around now with 2-3 Ares and an Ao-Jun in their hangars. They are averaging 1.2 mill+ damage per game with these bots at level 7,8 or 9...... 1 Ares at around level 8 is better than any other bot at level 12 except for maybe an Invader/Bulwark/Ao Jun. Having multiple of any one bot is a calculated risk because of the inevitable nerf, which may be crippling if you have many. I run just 1 of any bot for maximum fun. But, you can say your last sentence the other way too. 1 Ares at level 9 can compete with players with maxed gear (sure damage is much lower, but shield and running speed are nearly the same, except for the minor effect of pilots and boosters). Ares is that good, it gives a F2P player a chance. I would not complain about it being that good. Also, Ao Jun at around level 8 can be equally destructive.
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