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Post by Russel on Jul 12, 2017 6:17:49 GMT -5
In (yet another) burst of enthusiasm for Punishers - and anticipating 2.9.2 (when is that coming btw?) I upgraded a bullet hose Griff to all lvl9, which is where the rest of my stuff is mol. (it cost me about 1300au! but I'm impatient sometimes) and ran it for 3hrs last night. It was pretty junk. In fact, it was so junk that don't know if a 25% buff is gonna help.
The issue is getting those bullets on target. Their are too many shield around, too much anciles, and getting to 200m where most hit is like swimming through lava. And the reload time! I remember trying to catch enemy while firing vs running away from the enemy while reloading looked a bit like this: |
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Post by Why? on Jul 12, 2017 6:51:33 GMT -5
Long Maps, distracted enemy etc etc. But I do need to level some punishers to test it out. What may be even more effective is a frankenbuild of punishers-plasma on a Griffin. What do you say? In my Silver times I used to ride Molot Griffin and Punisher Griffin. That was fun. I don't have Magnums back then, but I wished I got a pair. So yes, I think try Magnum\Punisher build, it might be good. If anything - you can still disable Ancile shield from 530m in a matter of seconds. UPD: oh, and a tip from ex-punisher user: pre-spin Punishers before going into the battle. You would loose some ammo, surely, but will deal a lot more DPS. And if you got less than 50% ammo left - just keep firing, so you can reload before the next battle. There is nothing worse than getting into the battle with no ammunition and a long reload. So, which one should be better? Magnum- MkII or Punisher- Taran? Or the very unique 1 punisher-1 MKII? |
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Post by Russel on Jul 12, 2017 7:12:31 GMT -5
In my Silver times I used to ride Molot Griffin and Punisher Griffin. That was fun. I don't have Magnums back then, but I wished I got a pair. So yes, I think try Magnum\Punisher build, it might be good. If anything - you can still disable Ancile shield from 530m in a matter of seconds. UPD: oh, and a tip from ex-punisher user: pre-spin Punishers before going into the battle. You would loose some ammo, surely, but will deal a lot more DPS. And if you got less than 50% ammo left - just keep firing, so you can reload before the next battle. There is nothing worse than getting into the battle with no ammunition and a long reload. So, which one should be better? Magnum- MkII or Punisher- Taran? Or the very unique 1 punisher-1 MKII? I would go for 2xMk2 +2xMagnums. You could keep pounding enemy while your main damage dealer is on reload. And Mk2 was buffed more than Mk1. Oh, and don't forget that they are NOT upgraded +10% damage per level now. Keep away from lvl2, 7, 11 |
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Post by Why? on Jul 12, 2017 7:15:19 GMT -5
So, which one should be better? Magnum- MkII or Punisher- Taran? Or the very unique 1 punisher-1 MKII? I would go for 2xMk2 +2xMagnums. You could keep pounding enemy while your main damage dealer is on reload. And Mk2 was buffed more than Mk1. Oh, and don't forget that they are NOT upgraded +10% damage per level now. Keep away from lvl2, 7, 11 I didn't understand the last two sentences. Elucidate please? |
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Post by ⓣⓡⓘⓒⓚⓨ48 on Jul 12, 2017 8:58:38 GMT -5
Ok, don't take this the wrong way... BUT... I would guess it is a matter of using them correctly. That is not meant to be rude... Hear me out. If you are trained for DBs and PDBs, you have to unlearn a lot of the tactics you are used to. Before the buff, I was loving Puns... NOW? They are the bee's knees! Absolutely awesome. And I take on PDBs all day long in my Punigriff. Besides tips like what Russel said about pre-spinning up and reloading whenever you can, you also need to use your weapon's strengths. If you can, engage them from 499 to 360m if they have Plasma. Ensure that you have room and/or cover to use, in case they decide to jump in to close the distance so you can maneuver in such a way as to either a.) create distance again, or b.) play tag in cover until he gets REAL close. You will be surprised at how fast they either decide to leave or die. Or, play the ambush game from the beginning and wait till you get to 100m or less to start the engagement... I can't tell you how many PDBs I have taken out in a Punigriff because they thought they could out damage me, even before the buff, up close. There are a couple of reasons why... 1. Tarans and Mags can miss if you are constantly moving around. Not all of them, for sure, but enough to prolong your health drain. 2. Puns, even at 100m or less, aren't hitting dead on, but in a spread, so as long as you are leading when he moves or are firing at center mass, you will hit them. They aren't the same as Plasma or DB, you have to get used to when to use them... but if you do, they are deadly. Post-buff, even more so. Thunder Pun Leo is another powerful build pre-buff that is now downright awesome. Devastating even. Of course, you have to be aware of your surroundings so that you can avoid rockets... but you are as much a danger to them as they are to you. It takes a little to get used to it... but I am not one of the only ones singing their praises anymore. Or, hmmm... maybe they do suck and we, who like them, are delusional... If so, I like my delusions since Puns are my favorite weapon...  IMO, YMMV |
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Post by Russel on Jul 12, 2017 9:24:03 GMT -5
I would go for 2xMk2 +2xMagnums. You could keep pounding enemy while your main damage dealer is on reload. And Mk2 was buffed more than Mk1. Oh, and don't forget that they are NOT upgraded +10% damage per level now. Keep away from lvl2, 7, 11 I didn't understand the last two sentences. Elucidate please? Usually when you upgrade a weapon, it gets +10% damage per level. It is NOT true for the Pubishers after update, however. Their upgrade numbers are a bit erratical, you can see that on the wiki. warrobots.wikia.com/wiki/Punisher_Mk2So so as we compare Taran vs Punishers, their dps will differ at different levels of upgrade. Namely, getting Punisher from lvl2 to lvl3 will gain only 8% of damage, while Taran will get +10% upgrading from 2 to 3. So while comparing lvl1 Punisher vs lvl1 Taran will favor Punishers, comparing them at lvl3 will be a bit different picture altogether. keeping that in mind you might get wrong impression of the Punishers if you use them at level which is only +8 or +9 percent. just consult the wiki and make sure your Punishers are at level with +10% or more gain. |
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Post by options1986 on Jul 12, 2017 9:36:42 GMT -5
In (yet another) burst of enthusiasm for Punishers - and anticipating 2.9.2 (when is that coming btw?) I upgraded a bullet hose Griff to all lvl9, which is where the rest of my stuff is mol. (it cost me about 1300au! but I'm impatient sometimes) and ran it for 3hrs last night. It was pretty junk. In fact, it was so junk that don't know if a 25% buff is gonna help.
The issue is getting those bullets on target. Their are too many shield around, too much anciles, and getting to 200m where most hit is like swimming through lava. Yeah, it's my opinion as well. Punishers are too situational to be somewhat effective as Plasma. They best perform against unshield Target. I cannot see their usefullness against Ancilot. You have to break Ancile, then Shield, then you get to the Juicy thing. All considering that Ancile regenerates at Alarming Rate and that Soak Up Additional Damage. Molots, on the other hand are still useful at range and now have the Heavy support they needed (Tempest). Only with Shield piercing and an Heavy counterpart the build could be viable. (For Lancelot, Natasha & Golem) |
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Post by Russel on Jul 12, 2017 10:22:56 GMT -5
Ok, don't take this the wrong way... BUT... I would guess it is a matter of using them correctly. That is not meant to be rude... Hear me out. If you are trained for DBs and PDBs, you have to unlearn a lot of the tactics you are used to. Before the buff, I was loving Puns... NOW? They are the bee's knees! Absolutely awesome. And I take on PDBs all day long in my Punigriff. Besides tips like what Russel said about pre-spinning up and reloading whenever you can, you also need to use your weapon's strengths. If you can, engage them from 499 to 360m if they have Plasma. Ensure that you have room and/or cover to use, in case they decide to jump in to close the distance so you can maneuver in such a way as to either a.) create distance again, or b.) play tag in cover until he gets REAL close. You will be surprised at how fast they either decide to leave or die. Or, play the ambush game from the beginning and wait till you get to 100m or less to start the engagement... I can't tell you how many PDBs I have taken out in a Punigriff because they thought they could out damage me, even before the buff, up close. There are a couple of reasons why... 1. Tarans and Mags can miss if you are constantly moving around. Not all of them, for sure, but enough to prolong your health drain. 2. Puns, even at 100m or less, aren't hitting dead on, but in a spread, so as long as you are leading when he moves or are firing at center mass, you will hit them. They aren't the same as Plasma or DB, you have to get used to when to use them... but if you do, they are deadly. Post-buff, even more so. Thunder Pun Leo is another powerful build pre-buff that is now downright awesome. Devastating even. Of course, you have to be aware of your surroundings so that you can avoid rockets... but you are as much a danger to them as they are to you. It takes a little to get used to it... but I am not one of the only ones singing their praises anymore. Or, hmmm... maybe they do suck and we, who like them, are delusional... If so, I like my delusions since Puns are my favorite weapon... :) IMO, YMMV I would like to outline your point, by saying that Punishers _MIGHT_ be better than the Tarans (Magnum), but they require A LOT more skill to master. To a casual player it's easier just to aim, click "fire" and just watch out for reload, hence the plasma popularity. |
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Post by ⓣⓡⓘⓒⓚⓨ48 on Jul 12, 2017 10:38:45 GMT -5
Ok, don't take this the wrong way... BUT... I would guess it is a matter of using them correctly. That is not meant to be rude... Hear me out. If you are trained for DBs and PDBs, you have to unlearn a lot of the tactics you are used to. Before the buff, I was loving Puns... NOW? They are the bee's knees! Absolutely awesome. And I take on PDBs all day long in my Punigriff. Besides tips like what Russel said about pre-spinning up and reloading whenever you can, you also need to use your weapon's strengths. If you can, engage them from 499 to 360m if they have Plasma. Ensure that you have room and/or cover to use, in case they decide to jump in to close the distance so you can maneuver in such a way as to either a.) create distance again, or b.) play tag in cover until he gets REAL close. You will be surprised at how fast they either decide to leave or die. Or, play the ambush game from the beginning and wait till you get to 100m or less to start the engagement... I can't tell you how many PDBs I have taken out in a Punigriff because they thought they could out damage me, even before the buff, up close. There are a couple of reasons why... 1. Tarans and Mags can miss if you are constantly moving around. Not all of them, for sure, but enough to prolong your health drain. 2. Puns, even at 100m or less, aren't hitting dead on, but in a spread, so as long as you are leading when he moves or are firing at center mass, you will hit them. They aren't the same as Plasma or DB, you have to get used to when to use them... but if you do, they are deadly. Post-buff, even more so. Thunder Pun Leo is another powerful build pre-buff that is now downright awesome. Devastating even. Of course, you have to be aware of your surroundings so that you can avoid rockets... but you are as much a danger to them as they are to you. It takes a little to get used to it... but I am not one of the only ones singing their praises anymore. Or, hmmm... maybe they do suck and we, who like them, are delusional... If so, I like my delusions since Puns are my favorite weapon... IMO, YMMV I would like to outline your point, by saying that Punishers _MIGHT_ be better than the Tarans (Magnum), but they require A LOT more skill to master. To a casual player it's easier just to aim, click "fire" and just watch out for reload, hence the plasma popularity. True, it is easy to shoot a mag. *Shudders while remembering the old days of those damn TriMaggies just shooting non-stop, form their spawn to the poor noob's spawn... pew pew pew pew... forever... *
But even Mags and Tarans take enough skill to stay in range to hit them, but out of 300m rocket range as much as possible... corner shooting... etc.
So, I don't say one way or another as to who has more or less skill... but punisher skills are less developed on the whole for the majority of War Robots players.
If I were to try and say one weapon was better than the other, it would have to have caveats... at what range and in what situation?
BUT... the fact that we are even having this conversation on the forum shows how far Punishers have come up in esteem.
Either way, I LIKE em. 
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Post by ⓣⓡⓘⓒⓚⓨ48 on Jul 12, 2017 10:43:21 GMT -5
In (yet another) burst of enthusiasm for Punishers - and anticipating 2.9.2 (when is that coming btw?) I upgraded a bullet hose Griff to all lvl9, which is where the rest of my stuff is mol. (it cost me about 1300au! but I'm impatient sometimes) and ran it for 3hrs last night. It was pretty junk. In fact, it was so junk that don't know if a 25% buff is gonna help.
The issue is getting those bullets on target. Their are too many shield around, too much anciles, and getting to 200m where most hit is like swimming through lava. Yeah, it's my opinion as well. Punishers are too situational to be somewhat effective as Plasma. They best perform against unshield Target. I cannot see their usefullness against Ancilot. You have to break Ancile, then Shield, then you get to the Juicy thing. All considering that Ancile regenerates at Alarming Rate and that Soak Up Additional Damage. Molots, on the other hand are still useful at range and now have the Heavy support they needed (Tempest). Only with Shield piercing and an Heavy counterpart the build could be viable. (For Lancelot, Natasha & Golem) Punishers shred Anciles so quick, even without any sort of shield multiplier... and they chew through Ancilot Physical shields too... I think you may be underestimating the power of the spread too. Not only are they chewing through the shields, but they are hitting parts that aren't covered... which, when in close range and with 6 punishers (Griff), that adds up VERY quickly. Plus Lances have a large surface area/hitbox, which means Punishers can do full damage further back than when shooting at smaller heavy or any medium or light bot. |
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Post by ⓣⓡⓘⓒⓚⓨ48 on Jul 12, 2017 10:45:04 GMT -5
I will try and get some footage of my account while using them and post in here if any are interested.
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Post by options1986 on Jul 12, 2017 10:53:13 GMT -5
I will try and get some footage of my account while using them and post in here if any are interested. Yeah, I would like to see the power and survaivability of a Maxed Gunship Griffin! |
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Post by ⓣⓡⓘⓒⓚⓨ48 on Jul 12, 2017 10:59:46 GMT -5
I will try and get some footage of my account while using them and post in here if any are interested. Yeah, I would like to see the power and survaivability of a Maxed Gunship Griffin! Well... it ain't maxed... I'm firmly 9/9. But, in Diamond, I go up against higher level players a lot, so you can see the power and survivalbility of an underleveled gunship Griff against close to, or completely maxed, opponents! |
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Post by Scuzzbopper on Jul 12, 2017 11:09:09 GMT -5
So I have been running a Punisher Galahad now for over 25 matches and it is way fun. Sure, I fall to RDB spam, but otherwise a way fun build. I tried Molots and it is just not the same. The low mag capacity really interrupts the flow.
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Post by ⓣⓡⓘⓒⓚⓨ48 on Jul 12, 2017 11:23:44 GMT -5
So I have been running a Punisher Galahad now for over 25 matches and it is way fun. Sure, I fall to RDB spam, but otherwise a way fun build. I tried Molots and it is just not the same. The low mag capacity really interrupts the flow. I didn't like the Punihad before... but I did like it with an Orc and 2 Puns. I will try this again with a MK 2... I REALLY want to use my Galahad again. |
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Post by Team Alpha Strike on Jul 12, 2017 16:34:49 GMT -5
So I have been running a Punisher Galahad now for over 25 matches and it is way fun. Sure, I fall to RDB spam, but otherwise a way fun build. I tried Molots and it is just not the same. The low mag capacity really interrupts the flow. I didn't like the Punihad before... but I did like it with an Orc and 2 Puns. I will try this again with a MK 2... I REALLY want to use my Galahad again. I've used at Ork/Pun Gal - as ulitarian as the Plasmahad. I still use this as a late round bot, but I think that no matter what build is in the Galahad, the Koreans and Scourge will not allow this bot to rise again. In Punisher setup, the Gal is too slow with its shield up and too inaccurate to survive an encounter with a tri-Scourge Mk2 or Mk3 ---- even if gets from 600m to 200m without getting seen/hit. I have big doubts Punishers after the Scourge gets here in general, as I don't think that we will be dealing with Punishers instead of Tulus/PINs. Rather, I think we will be many more +500m range setups like Tulus on Mk2s/Fujins, Tridents/Gekkos on Tasha's, Hydras on Docs, and the old standard - the TT Fury. With all these setups on the battlefield this summer, Punisher setups will not be very survivable. |
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Post by mechtout on Jul 23, 2017 9:58:38 GMT -5
still leveling a set (level 6 atm) but seems to me the punisher giff is doing decent damage at the 400 to 500 range vs fat bots like the griffin.
not a great 1 on 1 weapon imo, but shreds while backing up a lancelot
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Post by _psychø on Jul 23, 2017 20:57:44 GMT -5
Currently, punishers are better than Magnums for many reasons (range, damage, spread, fire rate).
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Post by Deleted on Jul 23, 2017 21:40:09 GMT -5
Yeah, it's my opinion as well. Punishers are too situational to be somewhat effective as Plasma. They best perform against unshield Target. I cannot see their usefullness against Ancilot. You have to break Ancile, then Shield, then you get to the Juicy thing. All considering that Ancile regenerates at Alarming Rate and that Soak Up Additional Damage. Molots, on the other hand are still useful at range and now have the Heavy support they needed (Tempest). Only with Shield piercing and an Heavy counterpart the build could be viable. (For Lancelot, Natasha & Golem) Punishers shred Anciles so quick, even without any sort of shield multiplier... and they chew through Ancilot Physical shields too... I think you may be underestimating the power of the spread too. Not only are they chewing through the shields, but they are hitting parts that aren't covered... which, when in close range and with 6 punishers (Griff), that adds up VERY quickly. Plus Lances have a large surface area/hitbox, which means Punishers can do full damage further back than when shooting at smaller heavy or any medium or light bot. 300m seems to be a good distance to damage the Lancelot's squishy parts. The cone seems to be perfectly sized to cover up the Lancelot, and not be too big or too small. 200m is too close and almost all the spray lands on its shield. 400 could possibly work, but some will miss the bot entirely. Be careful of the boost! They will GIT ya! |
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Post by amidf on Jul 23, 2017 22:46:00 GMT -5
just consult the wiki and make sure your Punishers are at level with +10% or more gain. I am probably misreading this and your comment to avoid levels 2, 7, and 11 (from memory), but this makes zero sense. Surely even if the gain is not as much, the weapon doesn't lose damage. So you're always going to do more damage with a higher level punisher. Maybe it is less worth the upgrade cost.... Your comments only make sense under the [special] hangar-based MM where you'd more likely face lv11 tarans if you had a lv11 mk2. Under the current MM, there are no levels to make sure you're not upgraded to. -Amid |
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Post by robocain on Jul 24, 2017 0:32:13 GMT -5
I didn't like the Punihad before... but I did like it with an Orc and 2 Puns. I will try this again with a MK 2... I REALLY want to use my Galahad again. I've used at Ork/Pun Gal - as ulitarian as the Plasmahad. I still use this as a late round bot, but I think that no matter what build is in the Galahad, the Koreans and Scourge will not allow this bot to rise again. In Punisher setup, the Gal is too slow with its shield up and too inaccurate to survive an encounter with a tri-Scourge Mk2 or Mk3 ---- even if gets from 600m to 200m without getting seen/hit. I have big doubts Punishers after the Scourge gets here in general, as I don't think that we will be dealing with Punishers instead of Tulus/PINs. Rather, I think we will be many more +500m range setups like Tulus on Mk2s/Fujins, Tridents/Gekkos on Tasha's, Hydras on Docs, and the old standard - the TT Fury. With all these setups on the battlefield this summer, Punisher setups will not be very survivable. My all lvl 9 Punisher Galahad is quite the cornershooting terror as I discovered. In general I think Punishers will stay viable for those who know how to use them. They sure need skill to be mastered. |
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Post by WilsonK on Jul 24, 2017 0:44:46 GMT -5
Just the damage per second without reload. Is a MKII Punisher doing more dmg than Taran? But as of fighting from 300-350m in distance, spitting plasma will definitely be better. For spraying needles, <200m will be more devastating of course! Ran into a few needle spraying griffs and at 100m plus distance, my health bar goes down like... water!  |
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Post by WilsonK on Jul 24, 2017 0:47:06 GMT -5
Ok, don't take this the wrong way... BUT... I would guess it is a matter of using them correctly. That is not meant to be rude... Hear me out. If you are trained for DBs and PDBs, you have to unlearn a lot of the tactics you are used to. Before the buff, I was loving Puns... NOW? They are the bee's knees! Absolutely awesome. And I take on PDBs all day long in my Punigriff. Besides tips like what Russel said about pre-spinning up and reloading whenever you can, you also need to use your weapon's strengths. If you can, engage them from 499 to 360m if they have Plasma. Ensure that you have room and/or cover to use, in case they decide to jump in to close the distance so you can maneuver in such a way as to either a.) create distance again, or b.) play tag in cover until he gets REAL close. You will be surprised at how fast they either decide to leave or die. Or, play the ambush game from the beginning and wait till you get to 100m or less to start the engagement... I can't tell you how many PDBs I have taken out in a Punigriff because they thought they could out damage me, even before the buff, up close. There are a couple of reasons why... 1. Tarans and Mags can miss if you are constantly moving around. Not all of them, for sure, but enough to prolong your health drain. 2. Puns, even at 100m or less, aren't hitting dead on, but in a spread, so as long as you are leading when he moves or are firing at center mass, you will hit them. They aren't the same as Plasma or DB, you have to get used to when to use them... but if you do, they are deadly. Post-buff, even more so. Thunder Pun Leo is another powerful build pre-buff that is now downright awesome. Devastating even. Of course, you have to be aware of your surroundings so that you can avoid rockets... but you are as much a danger to them as they are to you. It takes a little to get used to it... but I am not one of the only ones singing their praises anymore. Or, hmmm... maybe they do suck and we, who like them, are delusional... If so, I like my delusions since Puns are my favorite weapon... IMO, YMMV Needles are painful to begin with, and even now after the buff, those needles are heated needles! Yeowch! |
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Post by Russel on Jul 24, 2017 2:41:58 GMT -5
just consult the wiki and make sure your Punishers are at level with +10% or more gain. I am probably misreading this and your comment to avoid levels 2, 7, and 11 (from memory), but this makes zero sense. Surely even if the gain is not as much, the weapon doesn't lose damage. So you're always going to do more damage with a higher level punisher. Maybe it is less worth the upgrade cost.... Your comments only make sense under the [special] hangar-based MM where you'd more likely face lv11 tarans if you had a lv11 mk2. Under the current MM, there are no levels to make sure you're not upgraded to. -Amid If you are going to compare Punishers vs Tarans (for example), and you get both of them to level 7, you will get LESS damage from Punishers to compare. It's basically would be the same as getting lvl6 Punishers vs lvl7 Tarans. |
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